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They'll probably say it wasn't broken in yet about the out of spec BCG. Just put 1000 rounds through it, and the upper would have cycled better.
As much as I hate to turn people off a company due to one bad product, given the failure of customer service, I don't think I could recommend Springfield to anyone. They've certainly lost a customer permanently in me. Just contrasting this experience with PSA, a cut-rate, although decent quality gun maker, it's night and day.

I reevaluated the flash hider today, and I'm less sure about the severity of that problem. Internal damage to the upper receiver due to gouging from the Sharp BCG is not extensive. I'm more optimistic I can ultimately save the upper receiver, replace the barrel, swap the gas tube/block, drop in a FZ BCG, and maybe have a functioning gun.
I'd think a BCG and drill out the gas port to the next size would do it for you.
 

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Discussion Starter #42
They'll probably say it wasn't broken in yet about the out of spec BCG. Just put 1000 rounds through it, and the upper would have cycled better.

I'd think a BCG and drill out the gas port to the next size would do it for you.
1,000 rounds of 300blk is big money. Especially since I spent all the money I was gonna spend on reloading gear on a 2nd, functional, 300blk pistol.

That may suffice, but I don't yet have the skill or tools to do that work, and since the idiots polished the chamber for no reason, and likely accelerated wear, I figure it'd be best to toss a new barrel on it. Gotta wait for resolution, though. Perhaps they'll decide to replace the whole thing once they're served.
 

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yah, that was sarcasm, but I wouldn't be surprised if SA tried some excuse like that. I doubt I've put 1000 rounds through any gun I own, maybe my first 22. New guns should run fine out of the box, but maybe 200 rounds to break in a gun with a handful of whatever.

Not too many rounds though my PSA 300 pistol, but so far good.
 

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Discussion Starter #44
yah, that was sarcasm, but I wouldn't be surprised if SA tried some excuse like that. I doubt I've put 1000 rounds through any gun I own, maybe my first 22. New guns should run fine out of the box, but maybe 200 rounds to break in a gun with a handful of whatever.

Not too many rounds though my PSA 300 pistol, but so far good.
I agree, they may try to make some lame excuses. I've got a couple guns with more than 1k rounds: sig p229, sig M400 in 5.56 come to mind, but most of those rounds were at Sig Sauer academy. I plan to get some decent defensive ammo I can trust in 300blk, run enough to know it functions, and that's about it. It'll probably take me a decade to rack up 1k rounds of 300blk assuming I don't get myself into a shootout at 100 yards in the dark. My PSA 10.5" 300blk upper functions like a champ. In fact, it had enough gas to spare that I dropped a recoil reducing spring in it, and it still cycles subsonic (makes me wish it had an adjustable block).
 

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Update:

I took posession of my Saint from my dealership today. It hadn't yet shipped back to SA due to the holiday, and I wanted to do further testing (I will include a video shortly).

I dropped in an aftermarket FailZero nickel boron BCG to test with. This eliminated all issues related to damaged brass, and difficulty cycling manually. However, while subsonic rounds did cycle a majority of the time, it was a slim majority. As such the gun is almost certainly undergassed, as well as having an out-of-spec bolt. So, to the gas...

So, according to the SA repair paperwork they adjusted the gas block and test fired it, and it worked... I pulled the set screw out today, and it wasn't adjustable. That's right, SA lied to me about what they did to fix my gun. Clearly, there's no way to adjust a non-adjustable set screw. I'm pissed.

I called SA with this new information demanding the following, and SA refusing in the following order: 1. a refund, 2. a replacement gun, 3. a new upper, 4. a guarantee that if I sent it back they would put a new upper on it. Nada. They won't play ball. They say all I can do is send it back, no guarantee they'll fix it, and no maximum number of returns before they replace my gun.

I'm not going to send it back to them to further tinker with, and lie about, on such a potentially dangerous product. Why did they polish the chamber, anyway? Did they even actually do that? Ain't gonna happen. As of now I've filed a small claims lawsuit against SA under my states consumer protection statute, as well as false advertising, breach of warranty, and fraud. I'm hoping they don't actually make me go through with a jury trial against them (although I will). I need a refund on this POS.

Video incoming shortly
Wow, and just when I thought just my Saint Pistol was having major issues, I stumble upon this thread and see you are having THE EXACT SAME ISSUE AS ME.

First magazine I loaded in it, I didn't even make it past 17 rounds before it jammed HARD. It bit so hard into the round it got jammed with the bolt forward and round still in the barrel. Worst jam I have ever seen.

Took almost 30 minutes just to unjam the fn thing. I could not believe it. I have never spent more than 30 seconds unjamming any weapon, ever!

Just a little background of me so you can understand my gun knowledge. I was in the US Navy joined as a Navy Seal. The Navy ended up sending me to a Blackwater USA for elite level tactical knowledge and experience. In general, I have handled and shot more weapons that most people know even exist. From AWM's to the Barrett to the M249 to RPG's (yes, even the Russian ones). Around 60 types of weapons were trained with, among with becoming proficient in the breakdown of each weapon, cleaning, and reassembly of each weapon. So for simplicity sakes, let's just say I know what I'm doing.

Except for this Saint Pistol, I am stumped.

And... I have never seen such DEEP, profound brass stripping of ammo in my entire life. I mean I have seen some sharp edges, but the bite it takes out of the round is staggering.

Sad to say, mine did not come with an adjustable screw either. The worst part about all of this is reading this thread and finding out how SA customer service has been treating you.

Oh, it jammed a second time on round 19 as well, that was another 10 minutes to unjam, and the third jam was in round 20. After that third jam, I just put it back in the bag and said screw it. Highly disappointed, as I really thought I would love this pistol, I even put an ACOG on it and green dot beforehand that cost way more than the Saint itself cost, just to get it up to par with my normal setup.

Well, guess I will call Springfield first thing Monday and see how this goes. Im hoping they can fix it easily, but something tells me im having the exact same problem as you.
 

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Wow, and just when I thought just my Saint Pistol was having major issues, I stumble upon this thread and see you are having THE EXACT SAME ISSUE AS ME.

First magazine I loaded in it, I didn't even make it past 17 rounds before it jammed HARD. It bit so hard into the round it got jammed with the bolt forward and round still in the barrel. Worst jam I have ever seen.

Took almost 30 minutes just to unjam the fn thing. I could not believe it. I have never spent more than 30 seconds unjamming any weapon, ever!

Just a little background of me so you can understand my gun knowledge. I was in the US Navy joined as a Navy Seal. The Navy ended up sending me to a Blackwater USA for elite level tactical knowledge and experience. In general, I have handled and shot more weapons that most people know even exist. From AWM's to the Barrett to the M249 to RPG's (yes, even the Russian ones). Around 60 types of weapons were trained with, among with becoming proficient in the breakdown of each weapon, cleaning, and reassembly of each weapon. So for simplicity sakes, let's just say I know what I'm doing.

Except for this Saint Pistol, I am stumped.

And... I have never seen such DEEP, profound brass stripping of ammo in my entire life. I mean I have seen some sharp edges, but the bite it takes out of the round is staggering.

Sad to say, mine did not come with an adjustable screw either. The worst part about all of this is reading this thread and finding out how SA customer service has been treating you.

Oh, it jammed a second time on round 19 as well, that was another 10 minutes to unjam, and the third jam was in round 20. After that third jam, I just put it back in the bag and said screw it. Highly disappointed, as I really thought I would love this pistol, I even put an ACOG on it and green dot beforehand that cost way more than the Saint itself cost, just to get it up to par with my normal setup.

Well, guess I will call Springfield first thing Monday and see how this goes. Im hoping they can fix it easily, but something tells me im having the exact same problem as you.
IRL?
 

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Discussion Starter #47
Wow, and just when I thought just my Saint Pistol was having major issues, I stumble upon this thread and see you are having THE EXACT SAME ISSUE AS ME.

First magazine I loaded in it, I didn't even make it past 17 rounds before it jammed HARD. It bit so hard into the round it got jammed with the bolt forward and round still in the barrel. Worst jam I have ever seen.

Took almost 30 minutes just to unjam the fn thing. I could not believe it. I have never spent more than 30 seconds unjamming any weapon, ever!

Just a little background of me so you can understand my gun knowledge. I was in the US Navy joined as a Navy Seal. The Navy ended up sending me to a Blackwater USA for elite level tactical knowledge and experience. In general, I have handled and shot more weapons that most people know even exist. From AWM's to the Barrett to the M249 to RPG's (yes, even the Russian ones). Around 60 types of weapons were trained with, among with becoming proficient in the breakdown of each weapon, cleaning, and reassembly of each weapon. So for simplicity sakes, let's just say I know what I'm doing.

Except for this Saint Pistol, I am stumped.

And... I have never seen such DEEP, profound brass stripping of ammo in my entire life. I mean I have seen some sharp edges, but the bite it takes out of the round is staggering.

Sad to say, mine did not come with an adjustable screw either. The worst part about all of this is reading this thread and finding out how SA customer service has been treating you.

Oh, it jammed a second time on round 19 as well, that was another 10 minutes to unjam, and the third jam was in round 20. After that third jam, I just put it back in the bag and said screw it. Highly disappointed, as I really thought I would love this pistol, I even put an ACOG on it and green dot beforehand that cost way more than the Saint itself cost, just to get it up to par with my normal setup.

Well, guess I will call Springfield first thing Monday and see how this goes. Im hoping they can fix it easily, but something tells me im having the exact same problem as you.
If you post pictures/video of the failure, bolt, and brass it'd be easier to tell what the issue may be. Not sure if it's the same issue I'm having. Sometimes they over torque the gas block cheeks. If the cheeks are pinned together too tight gas can't get out.
 

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Discussion Starter #49
So, no news on the Saint yet. SA hasn't responded to the lawsuit. However, I've completed a good chunk of my replacement upper build.

Here it is:
-Ballistic Advantage 8.3" Hansen Performance barrel in 300blk
-Lopro pinned gas block
-Odin Works pistol length gas tube
-Aero Atlas One handguard in FDE
-Anderson forged receiver
-FailZero Exo/black Teflon coated BCG
-Kinetitech brake/blast device

Still on the way:
-Strike forward assist in FDE
-Strike enhanced port cover in FDE
-Magpul K2 grip in FDE

Gonna buy a SBA3 brace in FDE eventually.

I'm pretty excited about this one. This is my first upper build. Can't wait to get to the range.
 

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Discussion Starter #50
Final update (barring unforeseen events):

SA agreed to accept my return for a refund of the purchase price. I'm still in the red due to money I put into the gun, and the filing cost of the suit, but it's good enough to end this stituation. Hard to believe I had to actually file suit to get them to be reasonable, but that lemon is on it's way back to Illinois where, if they have any sense, it'll be melted down and thrown overboard in international waters.

I've finished my replacement build today as well. Details of the upper are in an above thread. The lower is:
-Aero July 4 forged lower receiver (got a wicked deal, $80 with extras)
-Magpul K2 grip
-PSA EPT (Nickel Boron) parts kit/FCG
-SBA3 pistol brace
-Stainless action spring
-Spikes 3oz buffer

Rounded out with Holosun solar reflex sight, and Olight Valkyrie weapon light. I haven't weighed it yet, but it feels to be under 5 pounds.
 

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Final update (barring unforeseen events):

SA agreed to accept my return for a refund of the purchase price. I'm still in the red due to money I put into the gun, and the filing cost of the suit, but it's good enough to end this stituation. Hard to believe I had to actually file suit to get them to be reasonable, but that lemon is on it's way back to Illinois where, if they have any sense, it'll be melted down and thrown overboard in international waters.

I've finished my replacement build today as well. Details of the upper are in an above thread. The lower is:
-Aero July 4 forged lower receiver (got a wicked deal, $80 with extras)
-Magpul K2 grip
-PSA EPT (Nickel Boron) parts kit/FCG
-SBA3 pistol brace
-Stainless action spring
-Spikes 3oz buffer

Rounded out with Holosun solar reflex sight, and Olight Valkyrie weapon light. I haven't weighed it yet, but it feels to be under 5 pounds.
not sure I would have accepted just what they should have offered long ago if they pushed it so far i had to sue.
 

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My BA barrel really likes Fiocchi SST loads.

Probably gonna be the go to ammo for it...it's cheap and shot really well offhand. I need to get more and spend some time really working the little guy.

And the SBA3 is definitely the way to go.
 

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My BA barrel really likes Fiocchi SST loads.

Probably gonna be the go to ammo for it...it's cheap and shot really well offhand. I need to get more and spend some time really working the little guy.

And the SBA3 is definitely the way to go.
Agreed.

I got a pretty good deal on a used SBA3 on a local board...traded 200rds Wolf MC .223 for it.

It’s FDE, and the rest of the furniture is Magpul Grey, so it’s gonna be a mutt of a rifle...I can live with it.
 

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Agreed.

I got a pretty good deal on a used SBA3 on a local board...traded 200rds Wolf MC .223 for it.

It’s FDE, and the rest of the furniture is Magpul Grey, so it’s gonna be a mutt of a rifle...I can live with it.
That's a pretty ridiculous deal. Did Magpul kill off grey too? I know FDE is gone. And OD.
 

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Discussion Starter #56
not sure I would have accepted just what they should have offered long ago if they pushed it so far i had to sue.
That's a point I had to argue with myself over. Ultimately, if I'd have turned it down there a good chance I'd have to argue it in front of a judge. That's a lot of time, and no guarantees on the outcome. Ideally I'd have received the purchase price, cost of wasted ammo/parts, cost of the suit, and punitive damages over the fraud, but I also could have lost. Best to move on I think.
 

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Discussion Starter #57
My BA barrel really likes Fiocchi SST loads.

Probably gonna be the go to ammo for it...it's cheap and shot really well offhand. I need to get more and spend some time really working the little guy.

And the SBA3 is definitely the way to go.
I picked up a bunch of Hornady 110 plastic tips cheap, and first time out this BA Hansen barrel made 4 of five holes touch at 100 yards. I shot 150g AE, and 120g UMC at shorter ranges with superb results. Even at 15° it cycled 220g UMC reliably, but struggled with Hornady SubX. I suspect once it's broken in (the black coating on the FZ BCG isn't worn yet) it'll function most subs fine. I may start reloading this spring anyway.

I do like the sba3. It's my second one. Also have a Sig sbx, and it weighs more than the gun its on.
 

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I've seen this problem before with pistol 300 BLK's where they will cycle super-sonic rounds just fine but won't cycle sub-sonic rounds as well. This is because there isn't enough pressure being blown back to cycle the bolt. Put a suppressor on the rifle and it started cycling the sub-sonic rounds with no problem... why? Because the suppressor tends to hold pressure long enough with these slower rounds to allow the bolt to cycle. That's the reason why most would want to use sub-sonic rounds and what the 300 BLK was designed for.
I can only imagine the reason you are seeing the brass shavings is because the bolt is being blown back just enough to catch the bullet to chamber while it is extracting the spent casing at the same time, the spent casing hasn't completely left the chamber yet which is putting pressure on the round being chambered (spent casing leaving scuffing up the live round being fed). Basically a timing issue because of what I have mentioned above. Not saying that this is the reason but from what you wrote, it's the only thing that comes to mind. I know this is not what you want to hear but most people use super-sonic ammo and the sub-sonic was designed for running with a suppressor.

I'd be willing to bet it will work just fine with suppressor attached.
 

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I found this thread today when I was googling issues I had with the gun I just received on Monday. Monday night I put about 60 rounds through it as I was mounting/dialing in a site and I could not get it to consistently cycle subsonic ammunition, with a can attached. I was pretty frustrated. Sometimes every round or every couple of rounds it would not eject the casing or not feed the next round or even feed the round, but not cock the hammer.

I found this thread and was pretty pissed thinking I had just bought a gun, specifically for subsonic ammo and it wouldn't cycle it. I called SA customer service this afternoon, the rep was nice. He suggested I check the case/bag gun came with and look for t-handle allen key and other gas screw and try the adjustment steps from the manual.

I tried that this pm. Reading the manual these steps did not make sense. Look at page 34.
https://www.springfield-armory.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/SaintManual_1.pdf

The gun shipped with the...
"MODE 1 (Figure 35-1) a solid set screw, as configured from the factory, is non-adjustable and works just like any other standard gas block."

Which I assumed means full amount of gas is being used etc to cycle the gun, as gun shipped which I assumed meant I was SOL, and was going to be in same predicament as you. I figured what the heck and tried the steps and Mode 3 anyways.

I went through the steps and quite a few turns until the rifle extracted, ejects, and locked the BCG to the rear on empty. I'm not a gun expert and this doesn't make sense, because the solid set screw should be moving the BCG more than the metered, but that is not the case.

100+ rounds later this evening shooting Winchester and Sellier Ballot 200 grain subsonic it shot flawlessly. I hope this helps others.
 
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