[Tooltime]

I slugged my barrels to get the correct size lead bullets..356 Now I have
a question on bullet shape design. I'm looking at 124gr. and 125gr.
Why do the 125's have a small shoulder on the bottom and not the 124's??
Is there any advantage use one over the other besides 1gr of weight??

125gr 124gr

John

 

[fredj338]

There are probably 30-35 diff 124-125g lead bullet designs in molds available today. Those are just an example of two. Supposedly the small shoulder Will cut a bit nicer hole in paper, no other advantage. If your bore truly slugs 0356", then you want a 0357" bullet for best results.

 

[JustSomeGuy]

There are probably 30-35 diff 124-125g lead bullet designs in molds available today. Those are just an example of two. Supposedly the sall shoulder I'll cut a bit nicer hole in paper, no other advantage. If your bore truly slugs 0356", then you want a 0357" bullet or best results.

I strongly concur with Fred about the bullet size. If your barrel truly specs out at .356, then you want a bullet of at least .357 diameter or you will get some leading. Some people even shoot .357 sized lead bullets in a "normal" 9mm sized bore of .355 with good results. Slightly oversized is seldom a problem, whereas slightly undersized often is.

 

[Tooltime]

Thanks for the replies. My barrel measured .355 so I'm using .356 bullets.
My biggest question was bullet design between the 124's and 125's is there any advantage one over the other?

John

 

[fredj338]

As previously noted, no. The individual designs/shapes play a bigger role. There are RN, RNFP, SWC, TC & many shapes of each. The shorter the nose the longer the bearing surface within a given bullet wt. This affects OAL & pressures. So bullet shape is more important than 2-3gr diff in wt. Look at this mold makers website, 15 diff molds in the 122-125gr range. Go 120gr-125gr, makes it 21 diff designs JUST from one mold maker.
Accurate Molds Custom Bullet Molds

 

[HB of CJ]

We slugged my Spring Tube Rockola early M1 Carbine way back in about 1965. If memory serves, the bore was .309? We swagged our 115 gr. RNL cast bullets without gas checks to .311. Worked OK except for the nasty habit of shaving lead around the gas port.

The easy fix then was just to ream out that gas port with a .070 drill bit and a hand brace. Had no problems using such diameter bullets in other M1 Carbines. No other guns leaded. Just mine. Work up your load slowly. We started at 14.0 gr. of H110. HB of CJ (old coot)

We did use wheel weight lead. I forgot the exact number of mold. It was a three hole Lyman.

 

[fredj338]

We slugged my Spring Tube Rockola early M1 Carbine way back in about 1965. If memory serves, the bore was .309? We swagged our 115 gr. RNL cast bullets without gas checks to .311. Worked OK except for the nasty habit of shaving lead around the gas port.

The easy fix then was just to ream out that gas port with a .070 drill bit and a hand brace. Had no problems using such diameter bullets in other M1 Carbines. No other guns leaded. Just mine. Work up your load slowly. We started at 14.0 gr. of H110. HB of CJ (old coot)

We did use wheel weight lead. I forgot the exact number of mold. It was a three hole Lyman.

Today, I would use the same lead bullet & Hi-tech coat it for no leading in the gas port. I am going to work up some loads with my M1 in 308 & 165gr coated lead. Will make for some cheap shooting & also SHTF loads.

 

[JustSomeGuy]

Today, I would use the same lead bullet & Hi-tech coat it for no leading in the gas port. I am going to work up some loads with my M1 in 308 & 165gr coated lead. Will make for some cheap shooting & also SHTF loads.

I'm pretty sure coated bullets will be good for 1500-2000fps (plain ol' lead can do that too as you know) depending on the twist rate and condition of the barrel. You might get more velocity but I have no idea how they would do in an individual gun. It's probably as much about what kind of "beating" they take when feeding as it is about velocity. This would be a worthy experiment and I look forward to any results you might share on this in the future Fred. I wonder what powder you are considering and what velocity range that will still run the gun.

 

[fredj338]

I'm pretty sure coated bullets will be good for 1500-2000fps (plain ol' lead can do that too as you know) depending on the twist rate and condition of the barrel. You might get more velocity but I have no idea how they would do in an individual gun. It's probably as much about what kind of "beating" they take when feeding as it is about velocity. This would be a worthy experiment and I look forward to any results you might share on this in the future Fred. I wonder what powder you are considering and what velocity range that will still run the gun.

I am thinking 4895, down loads well. I am looking for something that will cycle the action, 2000fps would be fine with a 165gr bullet, if that works. If not, I may get the 230gr Lee mold & try that, but the 160gr Lee (casts 165gr from ww) should get there. Stay tuned.

 

[JustSomeGuy]

Hmmm... 4895. I have been thinking about this for a couple of days now, and since I don't reload rifle much maybe you can school me on this. My first thoughts are that what matters for a gas operated rifle is the pressure. The closer you get to "optimal pressure" for the action, but still safe for the lead (or coated) bullet is what would seem to me to be ideal. So something that produces what would be "minimal operating pressure" for your gun, but still keeps the bullet at or under 2000fps is what you're looking for. Like you mentioned, to do that you might have to go with a heavier bullet using a rifle powder. My first reaction was to think about powders like Lil' Gun or H110 for the 165grn if they are bulky enough without "fillers", but seeing this is a gas gun, fillers might be a no go and I don't think ANY of the slow pistol powders will have enough bulk for a 30-06 case, and even the "fast" rifle powders might not light up at reduced pressure so I am sort of confused about the 4895 which is not really that fast a powder (maybe in this case size?). I am guessing you think it is the fastest powder you can use that has sufficient bulk for the case. Is my thinking correct? I trust your experience with rifles more than my own on this so I'm really curious about how this comes out. This will be a fascinating experiment.

 

[fredj338]

4895 has a good reputation for downloading, burning well at reduced pressures. The balance in a semi with lead bullets, even coated, is getting he action to run & get decent accuracy with out melting anything. One of the 4227 might work inthe 308 for only 2000fps. It woud be easier w/ a 300bo in the ar vs 308 in an m1/m1a, but that is what I have. When I get something pulled together, I'll report.

 

[JustSomeGuy]

Ok... I forgot your M1 was a .308 (Is that a Navy refurb model?). I was always thinking about 30-06. I look forward to further developments.

 

[fredj338]

Ok... I forgot your M1 was a .308 (Is that a Navy refurb model?). I was always thinking about 30-06. I look forward to further developments.

No it was a DCM purchase, POS. I sent it to Springfield for a 308 bbl. I already have one in 06, Service match version. So I wanted a plinker. One of my fav rifles to just go shoot.