[CGP]

I had some time yesterday to visit a new indoor range to test out my new Sub 2000 Glock 17 variant. I put through about 250 rounds using various ammo and pleased to report that I had ZERO issues. After some sight adjustments, I was able to hit POA at 15 yards all day long.

Gear:
1 x 33 Round Factory Glock Mag
5 x 17 Round Factory Glock Mag

Ammo Tested:
- Federal HST P9HST1 (17 rounds)
- Federal HST P9HST3 +P (only used about 5 rounds of these)
- Winchester White Box JHP 124 (30 rounds)
- Winchester White Box 115gr FMJ
- Federal American Eagle 124gr FMJ (100 rounds)
- RWS 124gr FMJ (30 rounds)
- Fiocchi 124gr FMJTC (50 rounds)

Here's a pic of the Sub 2000 with the other guns I used yesterday:

Initial Impressions
Contrary to other reports, I did not feel too much of a kick on the recoil. It could be that I cheated a little bit by slipping a LimbSaver Recoil Pad after the first mag. It took a few rounds for me to get acclimated to the sight picture. I found that I have to be 2-3 inches away from the rear sight to get a good aim. The Sub 2000 is very lightweight and easy to hold freestanding. I did not experience any strain with aiming and holding the weapon.

One thing I would change though is to add a TacticoolProducts.com Bolt Tube Cover. I find my cheek pressing against the cold metal tube and while it's not an issue, I'd prefer something softer.

Sight adjustment was easy. I loosened the front sight using a PH2 phillips screw driver and pushed the Front Sight Post down a notch. Retightened and it's good to go at 15 yards. I would have preferred a longer range but since it was an indoor range, I was limited to 15 yards.

Shooting at the Range
After shooting the first full mag to get a feel and also made minor sight adjustments, I proceeded to stage 2 - Fire 4 mags (3 17 rounds and 1 33 rounds) AS FAST AS I CAN PULL THE TRIGGER!

I tell you want, it was so much fun. Here's what the target looks like afterwards:

I shot it so fast when I was done, smoke was coming out of the chamber and the top of the barrel - yes, smoke.

So now that I got that out of my system, I went to Stage 3 - slow firing to find out how accurate this is. Granted I'm only shooting 15 yards.

First Set - 3 Rounds, 15 yards (top set)
2nd Set - 10 Rounds, 15 yards (center) - made some sight adjustments here

3rd Set - 10 yards, 15 rounds

4th Set - 15 yards, 15 rounds (one flyer)

Post Range Cleanup
Field stripping is easy, but cleanup is a chore. I spent over an hour cleaning the chamber area and bolt tube from all the soot and powder that collected there after shooting. I ended up spraying everything inside with BreakFree, then followup with some cleaning rod action laced with some Hoppe's 9. Let it dry for a little then sprayed a little RemOil in and round the interior.


Overall Conclusion
Fit and finish leaves something to be desired, but I did not have high expectations given the price point.

Overall, I am quite impressed with the performance of this weapon. It fulfills quite a few roles and I can see carrying this for hunting and for home defense. It's compact and lightweight and provides exceptional accuracy. It's enormously fun to shoot.


6/21/2011 Update
I took the S2K to an outdoor range this morning to try out at 25 yards. Somehow, the trigger felt differently than my first outing. It seems heavier, although I would probably say the difference would be me transitioning from rapid fire to slow fire in the first outing, to just slow fire on the 2nd range trip. I did catch myself anticipating the trigger a bit this time and causing me to shoot some low fliers. I also had to make a slight adjustment to the front sight.

Here's the result shooting 25 yards, 30 rounds total.

This is just shooting using the factory plastic sights. I do think the weapon is accurate with the right optics and might consider one down the road. Overall, I'm pretty happy with the results.

Thanks!

 

[john_bud]

Exceptional ?

I'm glad you are happy with it, but really for a rifle that's not at all what I would call
exceptional -- especially at 15 yards.

 

[CGP]

Exceptional ?

I'm glad you are happy with it, but really for a rifle that's not at all what I would call
exceptional -- especially at 15 yards.

Yes, I would have preferred a longer range and will definitely try it out further at 25 - 50 yards. This is also just using the sights out of the box, which I would say, questionable with the plastic parts, but it works.

 

[APDturbo]

it looks ugly, especially with the 33round mag, i want one.

 

[tom_d]

Exceptional ?

I'm glad you are happy with it, but really for a rifle that's not at all what I would call
exceptional -- especially at 15 yards.

They aren't designed to be precision rifles by any stretch of the imagination. It's a (cheap) pistol caliber carbine that is 'combat accurate' at ranges of up to 100 yards. (Their stock sights are also extremely cheap and a pain in the a$$ to adjust.) I have a model similar to the OP's (9mm Glock receiver) and love it! Fun to shoot and it always gets comments at the range when I pull a rifle out of a laptop sized bag and unfold it!

 

[john_bud]

So it's "exceptional" when the fact that it uses cheap plastic sights is factored in? Gotcha!

Don't get me wrong, it's a great gun for bringing along and plinking or hitting medium game at modest ranges. I almost got one, but for just a bit more $$ bought a Sterling L2A3 carbine conversion from Wiselite. The driving factor was the plentiful and super cheap 7.62x25 ammo -- the irony is that the surplus ammo has vanished and the new stuff is 50% more $$ than 9mm. Doh!

Now if that Sub2000 was available for XDm mags, that would have been a different story.

 

[tom_d]

So it's "exceptional" when the fact that it uses cheap plastic sights is factored in? Gotcha!

Don't get me wrong, it's a great gun for bringing along and plinking or hitting medium game at modest ranges. I almost got one, but for just a bit more $$ bought a Sterling L2A3 carbine conversion from Wiselite. The driving factor was the plentiful and super cheap 7.62x25 ammo -- the irony is that the surplus ammo has vanished and the new stuff is 50% more $$ than 9mm. Doh!

Now if that Sub2000 was available for XDm mags, that would have been a different story.

I'll definitely have to agree there. The S2K is the only thing in my arsenal that takes Glock mags. I will also agree that the posted 15 yard target is not really all that impressive. I was just pointing out what you already seem to know, that it is by no means a precision gun. The addition of a red dot sight helps that though. I'll see if I can round up a target or 2 from it's last range trip.

Still nowhere near precise, but I think it's at least decent for 9mm at 100 yards.

 

[Groo]

my really used scoped hi-point does much better at 100 yards than that. I hope its just the optics holding you back

 

[CGP]

my really used scoped hi-point does much better at 100 yards than that. I hope its just the optics holding you back

After reading the comments, I sure hope it's just the sights. Now I'm on a mission.

 

[CGP]

Updated report...

 

[Wagion]

Try www.ktog.org to get some great advice on mods and sights for your Sub2000

I have one makes a great truck gun.

I wish Kel-Tec would keep up with the market they had the great idea of offering it with Glock, S&W, Beretta and I think Sig mag at first they really need to add some new options to that list.

One of Kel-Tec's known issues is not cool guns or new products it is keeping up with demand go looking for any of their newer guns to get an idea.

 

[CGP]

Try www.ktog.org to get some great advice on mods and sights for your Sub2000

I have one makes a great truck gun.

I wish Kel-Tec would keep up with the market they had the great idea of offering it with Glock, S&W, Beretta and I think Sig mag at first they really need to add some new options to that list.

One of Kel-Tec's known issues is not cool guns or new products it is keeping up with demand go looking for any of their newer guns to get an idea.

I'm there already. I don't know what the deal is with KT production cycles but it took me a while to find this subby.

 

[tom_d]

my really used scoped hi-point does much better at 100 yards than that. I hope its just the optics holding you back

Red dot and poor form. I'm sure I could get better results with even a 4X scope.

 

[john_bud]

Most every gun I own is held back by either my poor old eyes or my twitchy fingers (or both!). Good optics really help!

 

[CGP]

I'm now curious on how others fare shooting iron sights (in my case, plastic sights). For disclosure, this is my first caliber outside of my 2 22LR rifles. Maybe my standards at 25 yards is not as high I as I had previously thought. Without scopes, I don't see how anyone can be any more accurate given that the front sights on the sub 2000 almost covers the entire target when I'm aiming.

As far as accuracy, I would say that my scoped 10/22 is more accurate at 50 yards using a cheap NcStar 4X scope. Using CCI mini-mags, I can group to about 1 inch.

 

[john_bud]

100 yards you should be able to hit pop cans all day long. At least until you get old and feeble like me

 

[CGP]

100 yards you should be able to hit pop cans all day long. At least until you get old and feeble like me

100 yards? What platform would this be (rifle)? I did not think any 9mm carbines would have that kind of range/accuracy non-scoped, but I'm new at this so I really don't know.

 

[john_bud]

Take a look at this chart.

Handgun Trajectory Table


Maximum point blank range (where the bullet has dropped 3") for 9mm Luger is just under 100 yards for 147gr and 117 yards for 124 and 115 gr. That's shooting from a handgun, so the rifle will have about 150 fps greater velocity and a proportionately longer MPBR. So,you should have no problem at all hitting dead on at 100 yards.

 

[CGP]

Take a look at this chart.

Handgun Trajectory Table


Maximum point blank range (where the bullet has dropped 3") for 9mm Luger is just under 100 yards for 147gr and 117 yards for 124 and 115 gr. That's shooting from a handgun, so the rifle will have about 150 fps greater velocity and a proportionately longer MPBR. So,you should have no problem at all hitting dead on at 100 yards.

Thanks for the reference. I'll just have to take some more range time and see what this can do at longer distances. I've already ordered some optics and can't wait to get it installed and tested.

 

[Wagion]

I shoot my Sub2000 9mm at the 100 yard six inch gong all the time with just the factory sights and ring it with at least 18 out of 20 rounds from a 20 round mag.


What kind of scope and what scope mount? Did you order the factory folding mount or something different.