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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Found this interesting thought I'd post it.
Looks like the 9mm performs just as well as the .357 Sig, and even out performs the sig using heavier bullets.


 

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It's one companies marketing tests. You can NOT discount the add'l. energy & temporary cavitation the 357sig provides. If you want to believe that 9mm+p is equal to 357sig, that's fine, but it's not. For the exact reason so many 9mm guys shoot +P or +P+ ammo is the reason the 357sig is even better. I'm a 45acp guy but my 2nd choice is the 357sig.
 

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The chart is skewed. They didn't compare the same weight bullets. All of the 9mm are [email protected] and the .357sig are [email protected]. That gives the 9mm 22grs more mass and weight to achieve the same exspansion as the lighter .357sig bullets. It's just one more example of marketing hype. You shoot that 147gr bullet out of the .357sig at 1250fps your going to get more penetration and exspansion than the same bullet out of the 9mm. The only way the 9mm comes close to .357sig for the same bullet weight is to use a +P load. Other factors come into play when the speed of the bullet goes up. It was found that some standard 9mm bullets wouldn't hold together at the higher velocities the .357sig could produce so heavier jackets where used for them. That also affects terminal performance of the bullet. I'm not knocking the 9mm but I will not say it is as good as the .357sig.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
A quote from Doc Roberts.
NONE of the common service pistol calibers generate temporary cavities of sufficient magnitude to cause significant tissue damage.
Here's the link to the winchester site. You can create your own comparison. What I gathered from all the winchester 9mm and .357 sig results was little difference between the two rounds, again with better results coming from the 9mm heavy bullets.



A quote from Doc Roberts.
We have tested virtually all the handgun ammo available; neither myself nor any of my colleagues carry .357 Sig--quite a few of us carry 9 mm, .40 S&W, and .45 ACP...
Link.
Untitled Document
 

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Again, it's WW site, grab what you can from that, but a 9mm, even +p is a 9mm.
You can get a 147grGDHP from DoubleTap or Hornady XTP. Still nothing wrong w/ the 125grJHP @ 1350fps, a full 100fps+ over any 9mm +P+++++++++++++.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Still nothing wrong w/ the 125grJHP @ 1350fps, a full 100fps+ over any 9mm +P+++++++++++++.
Agreed, there's nothing wrong with the extra velocity. It's just that it's not asbig of a difference as some people might think.

Here's another one comparing 124gr rounds.

 

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All that chart proved is what I said before. If you want .357sig results you would have to use 9mm+P. You could make the same arguement for .38+P and .357mag. It's marketing hype plain and simple. I'm with fredj338, use .45acp and be done with it.:p The reason I prefer the .357sig is because the ballistics are damn good, by virtue of it's design it never has a FTF and it's just as easy to reload as any other load. I do pocket carry a KelTec P11 and don't feel undergunned loaded with 9mm Gold Dots. But I also feel better gunned carrying my XD.357sig or XD.45c loaded with Gold Dots:lol:
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
If you compare the 147gr non +p 9mm with the 357sig you see that the 9mm performs a bit better at normal pressures. I'm not trying to change anybody's mind just posting some interesting data.
 

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If you compare the 147gr non +p 9mm with the 357sig you see that the 9mm performs a bit better at normal pressures. I'm not trying to change anybody's mind just posting some interesting data.
Something else to consider, the tests done are in 4"bbl. pistols. If you go smaller, G26 or G33, your 9mm loses quite a bit of gas, lucky to make 1150fps. The 357sig is still going just under 1300fps. My ccw is a 1911OM/45acp or P239/357sig, same size, same rounds count but the P239 is 6oz lighter. Both pistols are more accurate than an avg. shooter needs & both hit very hard w/ their respective ammo.
 

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We certainly need to take into consideration the source of the information (not agalindo, but WW). Yes, it might be "just advertisement", but it also says to me that the bullet companies have continued to put a lot into R&R. They have developed their wares to the degree that your pistol, whether it be a .38 snubbie or a 45/70 (maybe all the way down to the .32), will provide you sufficient power to stop an attack. The biggest factor is: placement, closely followed by what gun are you willing to carry on your person at the necessary time and then are you willing and able to apply deadly force.
We, as civilians, are seldom, if ever, called upon to use our self-defense weapons. I doubt that you will find two incidences that a civilian had to shoot through a wall or a car in self-defense. I have read about a thousand entries in the "Civilian Gun Self Defense Blog" Civilian Gun Self-Defense Blog and have not seen any that required the extraordinary firepower that the .357 proponents boast of.
 

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I don't have any heartburn with agalindo. It's WW marketing that gets to me. As a handloader of thirty years, it's just an automatic reaction to analyze all of the information put before me to see if I can implement any of it. The posted WW ad didn't add up. I load both calibers extensively so the given data and pictures don't add up and that ticks me off because they are manipulating the unknowing public. Bullet makers have come a long way in designing bullets for specific calibers to get the best performance from them. That has helped the gunslinger get the best possible performance from any caliber he may choose.

I agree that shot placement is important and accounts for 70% of the total equation. But so does selecting the proper bullet for the caliber you choose to use. Then comes practice with your equipment so that you'll have confidence and proficiency with it. Any doubt about any part of the total package can effect the final result when the time comes.
 
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