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Hi Guys,

So I went to a local indoor range here in town the other day, which happens to be the only one that I know of that allows you to shoot rifles in addition to handguns. Well, I take my Spike's AR up there and my wife and I are having a good ole time doing some shooting. Well the guy who works at the range begins chatting me up while I was paying and getting ready to go in and from the get go I can tell we arent going to get along. He tells me how he has 6 AR's and all the bells and whistles they have blah blah blah, I get the impression that he was one of those guys that were picked on in high school and now is trying to over compensate by having a crazy amount of guns (of course nothing is wrong with having a ton of guns...i am building a nice little collection myself).

Anyways, we go in and start shooting and after a few minutes I notice he has come in behind and us starts telling me that I have a nice gun but I'm an idiot for shooting Wolf steel cased ammo because "It's Lacquer covered and the lacquer will gum up my rifle like super glue and destroy it"....and he finishes by saying "But you do what you want...nice gun, ****** ammo". So I think to myself, "I am kinda new to guns but I have researched a good bit and from my understanding the Wolf ammo is steel cased but does not have any lacquer on it from what I can tell, in comparison to Brown Bear which does seem to be covered in something, this guy doesnt know what he is talking about." Granted, I have shot Wolf, Brown Bear, Tula, etc all in my XD's with no problems withsoever.

In conclusion, I think that the cheapo steel cased ammo is fine for range shooting and doesnt pose any threat to my guns as long as i clean them properly. And that the Wolf Military Classic I was shooting is in fact, not covered in lacquer. Can you guys offer any advice on this as to whether I'm right or wrong. I have read so many posts on here about Steel Cased ammo that I am pretty sure I'm at least partially right in my thinking. I really would appreciated any advice you guys could offer. Lastly, sorry for the long post. Thanks guys....
 

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Right wrong our indifferent I only shoot brass myself, I simply don't like the idea of steel on steel. Maybe it is tempered to be malleable (soft) therefore blowing my reasoning out of the water. That guy was out of line either way
 

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I see a lot of people hating on steel case ammo but I've never seen anyone show up saying they've personally ruined a gun with it.

If it was as bad as everyone says, there would be a class action suit of angry gun owners looking for compensation.

I'm shooting more Tula than anything else and haven't encountered any problems. If that changes I'll let you know.

In my experience Tula's quality control has been better than WWB.
 

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Steel on steel is a myth kinda sorta too. There are many, many different types of steel. Some are nearly as hard as diamond, some are nearly as soft as aluminum. Gun steel is the very hard and durable stuff, as to which, it will vary wildly with the manufacturer. The cases will not be the durable and expensive tool steel, they will probably be plain Jane A36 steel, the most common carbon steel for making items that don't need a ton of durability. So, the cases will be much softer than the gun metal. I doubt they will wear out tool steel much if at all.
 

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Guy is an ass period.... Now it's shot steel through my AR before just cause brass was hard to find at a good price back then. It's gone bang everytime
 

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Its bogus. Certain metals will corrode when they come into contact over a period of time. Since all barrels are steel, and some ammo is steel cased there shall be no issue. If they made aluminum cases and we fired that or left an aluminum case sitting in a steel breech and action then over time it would fuse together from electrolysis. Shoot even Hornady is promoting steel cased ammo.
 

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My M&P15 thinks that brass is the rarest metallic alloy in existence. It's been fed a healthy diet of Tula, Herter's, Wolf, and Hornady Training, all steel cased ammo. Some of it has had the poly coating (as mentioned above) while some does not. I've taken two 4 day AR courses with the M&P and shot nothing but Hornady steel ammo.
 

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I see a lot of people hating on steel case ammo but I've never seen anyone show up saying they've personally ruined a gun with it.

If it was as bad as everyone says, there would be a class action suit of angry gun owners looking for compensation.

I'm shooting more Tula than anything else and haven't encountered any problems. If that changes I'll let you know.

In my experience Tula's quality control has been better than WWB.
No there wouldn't, you aren't effectively suing a Russian company. Is Tula/Wolf crap ammo, sure. Will it hurt your gun, probably not. Keep in mind that steel cases ammo was designed to be shot in combat grade guns w/ generous tolerance, where when they do break/fail, the military just gives you another one. Me, I won't shoot steel cased ammo much, I have to buy my own guns.;) I won't tell others not to, but it is just MY choice.
 

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fredj338 said:
No there wouldn't, you aren't effectively suing a Russian company.
No gun owners and courts in Russia? That company has been making ammo for almost 100 years. I trust that they know what they're doing.
 

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i have used steel cased ammo in many makes of guns and never have had a problem. Poly coated is fine just do a good cleaning after use as gunpowder used is dirty in this type of ammo.
 

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I have shot Wolf ammo in the past, and never had any problems with it performance. The only negative I had was an indoor range would not let you use steel jacketed cartridges, because the sweep up the brass and use it for reloading.
 

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Steel on steel is a myth kinda sorta too. There are many, many different types of steel. Some are nearly as hard as diamond, some are nearly as soft as aluminum. Gun steel is the very hard and durable stuff, as to which, it will vary wildly with the manufacturer. The cases will not be the durable and expensive tool steel, they will probably be plain Jane A36 steel, the most common carbon steel for making items that don't need a ton of durability. So, the cases will be much softer than the gun metal. I doubt they will wear out tool steel much if at all.
Not to mention that your AR may well have a chrome lined chamber . Therefore no steel on steel.
 

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No gun owners and courts in Russia? That company has been making ammo for almost 100 years. I trust that they know what they're doing.
I would bet you that the vast majority of Wolf/Tula ammo is sold here, not in Russia. It's not like that country is for a lot of free civilian gun ownership. Not to mention. last I looked, Russia was not using 223, 40 or 45acp, so who do you think that ammo was made for???? Continue buying it, it is crap ammo, but I won't. I can reload for half the cost of Wolf/Tula & not support a country more corrupt than ours.
 

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I would bet you that the vast majority of Wolf/Tula ammo is sold here, not in Russia. It's not like that country is for a lot of free civilian gun ownership. Not to mention. last I looked, Russia was not using 223, 40 or 45acp, so who do you think that ammo was made for???? Continue buying it, it is crap ammo, but I won't. I can reload for half the cost of Wolf/Tula & not support a country more corrupt than ours.

It is crap ammo. It lacks "power" and is almost as dirty as WWB and blazerbrass. thats about it. Tula 9x19mm is pretty darn accurate and plenty fine for plinking or small game hunting. back in the hayday when I could buy it for $3.99 a box of 50 I shot unreal amounts from a P226 and P225. If anything the lower power of the ammo kept the pistols from the extra wear more powerfull ammo would have created. That was even back when they were laquered coated.

Just cuz they look different dont mean they are different. Cannt we all just get along??!!
 

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I don't reload and i don't shoot steel cased ammo my self. I shoot Brass cased and then sell the brass.
For 9mm steel cased ammo is about $1.00 per 50 round box cheaper then the brass cased ammo I buy.
I get that $1.00 back when I sell the brass.

Other calibers may not work out like this, but I see no need to run steel cased ammo threw my guns.

And if I start reloading I save even more.

You guys can run steel all you want. But I wont put it my guns, and would be hesitant to buy a gun that had steel cased run threw it.
 

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Steel Cases.... There was a write up this month in Gun's and Ammo magazine. For those that did not see.

Guns and Ammo Aug. 2011: Reader Blow Back- "Perhaps you can settle a discussion that my shooting buddies and I have. Do steel pistol cartridges cause more wear on the extractor than brass cases? We are split on this. Seems to me that the steel would be slightly harder than brass and cause a bit more wear."

Answer: "We will let our esteemed Hand gun Editor, Patrick Sweeney reply" " Interesting question. The coeffients of friction, (steel on steel vs. steel on brass) aren't greatly different. Brass has less friction, but the brass case theoretically expands more, and friction is dependent on pressure. There are also other variables at work such as chamber size, case wall thickness and operating pressure. The only way to be sure would be to shoot several hundred firearms with tens of thousands of rounds each in a labatory conditions and measure wear. We have lots of Internet assertions that "steel is bad", but one of the first things you learn in engineering school is: The plural of ancedote IS NOT data. Were steel-cased ammo really the tool of the devil, as some say, we'd see firearms expiring on a daily basis from their use. Some firearms do seem to not like steel-cased ammo, but most don't seem to care, so I don't either."

I'd say, go shoot your steel cased ammo with pleasure, and tell that ahole next time to "bite me"!! :twisted:
 

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I only shoot brass in my AR, I recommend that you switch to brass because that spikes is a nice weapon. Im not telling you what to do but it would benefit you. The guy seemed like a D-bag and he should have gone differently about it. As long as you clean immediately after I think you should be okay as far as lacquer goes. But steel on steel kinda scares me, only brass in those high end rifles brother. Save the wolf for an AK-47 Lets see some pics of that Spikes!
 
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