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Discussion Starter #1
Ok so I am going to be purchasing an AR here within a week or so and I have been doing my homework reading through the old posts and need some help deciding on a few thing and a couple questions as well.

First of all I guess I should state that this will be used for home defense as well as moderate range use. Now..

What I know I want is the 16" barrel, mid lenght due to less recoil and (from what I have read) easier on the upper itself, preferably 1:7 so i can use the heavier bullets if I like, and chrome lining.

As far as the upper goes I know I dont want a carry handle and I probably wont add an optic for awhile because I want to get good with the irons. So what would you guys suggest? The A2 sights or a flat top with a flip up sight? i think i am using the correct terminology here and please correct me if i am wrong.

The stock, which do you guys like and why? the A2 buttstock or the 6 position M4 stock?

and lastly I am going to buy the complete rifle due to the fact that i plan on putting it on layaway plus for my first rifle i would feel more comfortable purchasing then building. The couple local shops say they can order pretty much anything and I would like to keep it around $900 but will spend a few hund extra if you think it would make a difference. Of course I want it to be reliable and a warranty isnt a bad thing. Any recommendations of manufacturers?

Thanks to all who help I have been reading so much the last few weeks i am a little info overload so I need some outside thoughts. Thanks again.
 

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CMMG and Sabre Defense are the only two makers that I can think of right off the top of my head that make 16" 1/7 CL midlengths. Possibly Armalite makes one also.

I prefer the adjustable stocks. Go with the flat top and some type of BUIS.
 

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I personally like the carbine, the recoil of a mid vs. a carbine isn't that much of a difference to me that it warranted me to pick a mid over a carbine.

Once you get good with the irons, do you have an idea as to what kind of optic you want on there? If you know you want something like an Aimpoint or an EOtech, then you can get the A2 sight. I myself like the LMT sight. But if you know you'll want a magnified optic or if you want to add a magnifier behind your red dot, then you will want a flip-up. That way you can have your sight on the down position and it will fit under your scope or magnifier. There are lots to choose from, but Troys are considered "the best", they will run you $140. (BTW, I'm selling a set of flip-ups, just look at my signature ;) )

As far stocks go, I have a magpul CTR, LMT Sopmod, VLTOR EMOD. All of which are collapsible. So that would be my suggestion.

As far as brands go, then there are many to choose from. Stag, RRA, CMMG, LMT, Noveske, Colt, just to name a few. Any one of those will serve your needs and then some. Those 6 in my opinion are the only ones I would invest my money in. If you are on a budget, you might want to stick with the first 3, although LMTs aren't that much more.

You should also start stocking up on mags. PMAGS are absolute butter and worry free almost 100% of the time! But my cproducts with magpul follower have yet to fail me. I actually just ordered some more cproducts stainless steel from my dealer... The only thing I don't like about the cproducts is the little wiggle room it has when in the magwell, the PMAGS don't have that play. I will say this though, that little play is absolutely nothing to worry about, it's normal. It's just the PMAGS are just a bit tighter in the magwell.

Now my final advice would be... AMMO! Lots of it! :)

Enjoy BRD... It's contagious to your wallet! If it spreads, make sure your plastic is handy and that it has a high limit on there. It's the only way to subdue the damn thing!
 

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also check out DPMS. I have a couple from them--one in .223 and one in .308. both have been reliable and accurate. I also have one I built from scratch, mostly DPMS parts, with a Sun Devil lower. For the money, I think DPMS is the way to go for a complete rifle. They sell a flat top rifle with a light contour barrel and collapsible stock for like $725.

--John
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks for all the quick replies and great info. As far as a specific optic i havent given too much thought because it probably wont be for another 8 months if i decide to put one on. I am going to go do some looking around tomorrow so ill have to see if i like the A2 or flat top better.

As far as manufacturers go all the ones I heard below i figured just wanted to see if I seen anything different....DPMS they look like they have some good prices but i had been reading about how some of the 5.56 were actually .223 or vice versa and that is kinda a big deal, just makes me think twice about there quality.

Stewie if you dont mind me pickin ur brain..what do u like about the Carbine over the mid-lenght? figured i would gather all the personal feedback i could get. Any others have thoughts

Thanks again for all the help..i would be going crazy with this stuff if it wasnt for this site.
 

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How bout that, another Kansas boy. Welcome to the site, and the addiction. I just bought an Armalite AR-10 last week and have been pricing and ordering parts all week.

Anyway, the guys around here know their stuff and are very helpful. Good luck on whatever you decide to buy.



Rock Chalk baby, Rock Chalk!
 

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No particular reason. I liked being able to have the option of putting a 9" rail with a low profile gas block tucked in underneath. I'm working on another build and it's also a carbine length. There's really no particular reason why I choose one over the other. But if I was to get a different gas length, it would be rifle and not a middy and make a long range special purpose rifle.
 

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Make sure you get a rifle chambered in 5.56 cuz then you can shoot both 5.56 and .223 in it.

I like the Magpul CTR stock. It has a hole for a quick release sling attachment and also locks up solid, good price too.

1:9 vs. 1:7 barrel twist,
1:9 is best for 55gr - 62 gr. - doesn't stabilize ammo much heavier
1:7 is best for heavier ammo but doesn't stabilize the 55gr as well as a 1:9 twist.

I have a 1:9 and plan on building another rifle in 1:7
 

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Discussion Starter #9
How bout that, another Kansas boy. Welcome to the site, and the addiction. I just bought an Armalite AR-10 last week and have been pricing and ordering parts all week.

Anyway, the guys around here know their stuff and are very helpful. Good luck on whatever you decide to buy.



Rock Chalk baby, Rock Chalk!
Hey, glad to see another jayhawk supporter here, at least I wont be alone when the college basketball threads start up. Hopefully we will be able to get it done today against OU.


Thanks for the additional input Stewie, i just figured id ask the reason since you had mentioned it.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Make sure you get a rifle chambered in 5.56 cuz then you can shoot both 5.56 and .223 in it.

I like the Magpul CTR stock. It has a hole for a quick release sling attachment and also locks up solid, good price too.

1:9 vs. 1:7 barrel twist,
1:9 is best for 55gr - 62 gr. - doesn't stabilize ammo much heavier
1:7 is best for heavier ammo but doesn't stabilize the 55gr as well as a 1:9 twist.

I have a 1:9 and plan on building another rifle in 1:7
yeah i am definitely going to get the 5.56 so i have the option of the .223 as well. I must had been reading about the rifiling when i was tired because i didn't realize that the 1:7 didnt stabilize the 55gr-62gr as well as 1:9 for my use of the rilfe will be range especially at first and of course SHTF. For range dont mainly use the 55gr-62gr?

I have one new but very errr stupid question. if this bad were to actually happen, does that affect the sale of ammo for these things? told ya it was a dumb question
 

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1:9 vs. 1:7 barrel twist,
1:9 is best for 55gr - 62 gr. - doesn't stabilize ammo much heavier
1:7 is best for heavier ammo but doesn't stabilize the 55gr as well as a 1:9 twist.

1 / 7 twist will handle 55gr just fine. ;)
 

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1/9 will usually stabilize 40gr-75gr, and if your lucky even 77gr.
1/7 will usually stabilize 55gr-80gr, regarding twist and bullets, it depends on the barrel. Theirs no way of creating a barrel twist precisely, so you whined up with barrels that say 1/7, but are really 1/7.5. When you take your rifle out to the range to zero, you have to use different types of ammo to find the one it prefers.

Just to give you another idea, what about the M4 or CAR 14.5" barrel with permanently attached phantom or extended A2 to make it 16". I got mine from CMMG with chromelining and 1/7 twist. I know you said Mid-length, but just giving you another option. ;)

The 14.5" barrel gives better handling in CQB, but you give up range for compactness. I have two 16" CARs and one M4gery, the M4 provides better handling in buildings. It took me 7mths to decide which barrel I wanted, so take your time and don't rush your options.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Thanks for clearing up the twist on the rifles and what will stabilize what fellas.

I am going to go look around today at a couple shops and try and get a better idea if i like the flat top upper with flip up sights or the A2 sights.

Thanks for bringing up that other option batallion as I want to explore all my options, plus the swap on range isn't too big of a deal i dont think the range we have here goes over a couple hundered yard anyways. I imagine it would be a little lighter too so that may be a plus.

Thanks
 

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I personally think you'd be happier with a flat-top rifle. You can always mount a detachable A2 carry handle if want to and the flat-top is much better for mounting any type of optics.

Also, if you don't mind answering this, what part of Kansas are you in? Depending on where you are, we could go shooting together some time.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I personally think you'd be happier with a flat-top rifle. You can always mount a detachable A2 carry handle if want to and the flat-top is much better for mounting any type of optics.

Also, if you don't mind answering this, what part of Kansas are you in? Depending on where you are, we could go shooting together some time.

I am in the Wichita area, i definitely wouldnt be opposed of doing some shooting with someone with a little experience.
 

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mvician,
Thank you for interjecting with your vast knowledge of AR's. What is the heaviest ammo a 1:9 barrel will stabilize?
 

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go with the A3 flat top upper and add an A2 carry handle this will give you the best of both you can have the looks of the A2 and when needed you can still add an optic to the rail by taking off the carry it's a win win

Personally I sell off my carry handles and replace thrm with flip up rears as I don't ever use the carry handle but hey that's just me
 

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Discussion Starter #19
go with the A3 flat top upper and add an A2 carry handle this will give you the best of both you can have the looks of the A2 and when needed you can still add an optic to the rail by taking off the carry it's a win win

Personally I sell off my carry handles and replace thrm with flip up rears as I don't ever use the carry handle but hey that's just me

I like the idea of doing the detach carry handle and i like the sights of the A2 but on the couple that i looked at today the rear sight hole (i have no idea the correct terminology) seemed really small, I dont know if it was just that certain manufacturer or what. I did like on a S&W flat top they had some flip up sights that looked just like the Larue Troy sights. What do u guys think about getting the flat top upper and putting a set of those on? They had a couple bushmasters and S&W that were around $860 w/o any sights and with the Troy sights that would put me at about $1100 or so. Any thoughts?
 

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If you looked at an A2 (carryhandle type) AR, there are 2 apertures on there. You can change them with your finger because the apertures move depending on which one you want.

A smaller one for more precision and a larger aperture for low light and faster sight aqcuisition.

I personally always use the large aperture because I run an Eo and cowitness with the irons and it just works better that way for me.
 
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