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yeah you cant tell its there and if you are if you want to fire a gun holding it in a way where it would not be pushed in doesnt seem to safe to me
 
Welcome to XD Talk. Please do not dismiss otherwise safe and reliable weapons because they do not have a grip safety. Your scenario is just a little unrealistic. In all the years I have carried Glocks I have never thought: "I sure wish this gun had a grip safety".;)

In reality I think the question is not whether the thing is reliable or could cause problems but whether it is actually necessary. Of course the answer to that is no.
Well, I will say this again for the THIRD time.... STRICTLY MY OPINION THAT I LIKE THE ADDED SAFETY and I gave my thoughts as to why I like it, take it or leave it. BTW, my "What if" scenario is not all that unrealistic. Has your home ever been invaded? Mine has......
 
Never had a problem with it.

For those that think its unnecessary for the XD to not have a grip safety, well here you go. Remember its a single action gun, not double action like a Glock.

Viddler.com - Springfield XD - Sear system - Uploaded by Bareideru

Watch this Glock animation to compare the trigger pull moving the striker back then releasing it, instead of just releasing it. Its the same reason a thumb safety is necessary on a cocked and locked 1911.

 
Discussion starter · #25 ·
I've steered away from Glocks because of the lack of externally mounted manual safeties.

I grew up on 1911s, and now swear by the XD line.
 
The only problem I run into with the grip safety is when I go to rack the slide or lock it back I sometimes forget to depress the grip safety. No biggie, just reposition my hand it works perfect.
 
There's a grip safety?? :shock: Kidding aside, there will always be scenarios in which something bad could happen. Before I started to really shoot my XD9sc, I was shooting a few other weapons (1911 and Glock) and I went to shoot my XD and it didn't fire (happened twice in over 2000 rounds)...I wasn't pressing down on the grip safety. The grip on the 1911 was slightly different. It's something I easily fixed and since that time, never had an issue though I haven't dropped it in mud, on concrete, in water, etc. As it is, I have no worries about trusting my life to it. Couldn't say the same for my problematic Kimber and Glock 36 and thus why both are now gone. My newest purchase, the XDM 3.8 9mm :D
 
I've steered away from Glocks because of the lack of externally mounted manual safeties.

I grew up on 1911s, and now swear by the XD line.
I toyed around with the idea of getting a Glock for my bedside gun in either .40 or .45 until I shot a couple of them. The lack of external safety doesn't matter to me in the least bit. As a matter of fact, the Glock does have an external safety. The safe action trigger. One of the same safety devices that an XDm has. What did matter to me is I tried a test that a friend of mine led me to one day.

This post might get a little long as I describe the test and what the results meant to me, so if you aren't really interested in the results or my decision to not buy a Glock based on the results, just know that I didn't buy it due to the grip angle.

That is the short version, here is the long descriptive version.

This was back in about 2001 or thereabouts, so whatever generation of the Glock that was out then is the one that I was shooting. At the time of this test, I was using my S&W 5906 9mm as my primary pistol and was wanting either a .357 Sig or .40 S&W (was leaning towards a Sig P229, but was also open to the idea of other pistols) when a friend of mine offered to let me shoot his G23 to see what I thought about it. As soon as I picked it up, it felt odd in my hand, but then again, so did the H&K USP Compact that I had shot about a week before that so I (wrongly) assumed that it was just because it was a polymer framed pistol and I wasn't accustomed to it. Since I wasn't closed off to the idea of a polymer gun (mainly because by this point, Glock had already proven themselves to one of the, if not the, most reliable handguns ever built) I figured I would give it a try and see if I could overcome the odd feeling via training. Thought that maybe if I shot it enough, it would eventually feel comfortable. After 3 or 4 magazines, I noticed that my wrist was hurting a little bit and the palm of my hand was starting to get a little sore. I mentioned this to my friend and he told me to try something. This is the test that I had mentioned. He told me to line up on the target with the Glock in my hand, but at the low ready. After this, he told me to close my eyes, and while they were closed to aim at the target. I though this was funny, but considering at the time, I was about 18 or 19 and had not shot a whole lot, and the guy that I was shooting with had been shooting longer than I had been alive, I complied and proceeded with the test. I tried my best to remember how close to eye level the target was (which although I ended up pretty close, this turned out to not matter as much as I thought it was going to at this point in the test) and raised the pistol up and did my best to aim center mass. After I got settled, I opened my eyes and realized that I was looking at the top of the slide. Although my hands were pretty close to where they needed to be, the pistol was actually pointing above the target. I was about 10-15 yards away from the target, and if I would've shot, I would've missed the target. Now granted, you never shoot with your eyes closed, but the point is, where my body naturally wanted to aim did not match up to the frame of the Glock. I had heard that the grip angle on a Glock is more extreme than most pistols, but I had never really put much thought into it until this test. After this test, I thought about, what if someone kicks in my front door at 3am. If I wake up, grab my pistol, point (in the dark) towards whoever just kicked my door in, am I going to have positive aim on him when lighting is less than perfect? Granted, night sights would fix this, especially if the front post sight glowed a different color than the rear sights, and practice would probably overcome this issue, but why should I have to train to overcome a particular feature/flaw/design of a weapon (unless it was my issued weapon, in which case you train because you have no choice). In civilian life, I have a choice and that is why I chose not to get the Glock. That being said, I just bought a XDm the other day, and before I bought it, I rented one and fired the hell out of it just to make sure that it was exactly what I wanted. I had thought about the possibilities of certain issues with the grip safety, but had decided that it wasn't enough of an issue to steer me away from it. Once again, if there was an XDm offered without the grip safety, I would've bought it instead, but as it stands, I bought the one I did. If in the future, I decide that it is more of an issue than I do right now, I will look into ways of disabling it so that it will not be a factor. Which kindof brings me back to what I said before about it. Is it needed? No, I don't think it is.

One more thing, I have not shot a Gen 4 Glock, but I have been told that if you use the small backstrap, it reduces the grip angle to a more natural angle. That being said, I might give Glocks another look as a bedside gun. When I decide that I want another gun, the 5906 will move into the center console of the Jeep, and a larger caliber handgun will replace it in the nightstand. Most likely another .40, but I will also look at .357 Sig and .45 when I am deciding. Or, when my 870 gets delivered, I might go ahead and put the 5906 in the console, and just keep my XDm near enough to the bed, along with the 870. With a 12 gauge laying there, I doubt I would reach for the handgun anyway.

Sorry about the length of the post, but hopefully if you weren't really all that interested in it, you didn't read the long version and if you did read the long version, hopefully it helped in some way.
 
I don't even notice the grip safety.
x2. I think its a GREAT feature. I took my father-in-law to the range today and he absolutely hated that the gun did not have an "external switch safety", what he calls it.

He didn't even realize the grip safety was there until I explained it to him.
 
Practice, practice, practice if you want to get that perfect grip when it comes to drawing from concealment or just drawing.

My video response:
 
as someone who is new to handguns, the reason I have chosen to buy the XDm is because of the grip safety. I felt that it was an added security against accidental fire. Not that any mechanical safety should be trusted more than just good common sence and safe practices, but if for some crazy reason my small child would get his hands on a loaded weapon I think the grip safety is safer than the triger only on the glock or even a safety button (that would be something that would draw him to push right away). I think it would be very difficult for him to get both the grip safety and the trigger pushed inorder for it to fire. I worry about that a lot more than some of the possible problems of having the grip safety.
 
I've been a fan of XDs for years and had never even noticed the grip safety - but it does impact some new shooters.

Last year, I talked my dad into going to an IDPA match and loaned him one of my XDMs. He had all kinds of trouble with the gun locking up during the stages and we finally realized he wasn't pressing the grip safety when he racked the slide.

Honestly, I can't even replicate what he was doing - but then my brother-in-law went a few months later and had the same problem.

Neither one of them had a problem when shooting from static positions at the range - but the added movement of the matches caused the problem to manifest.

From now on, I'm loaning new shooters either a Glock or an M&P. I don't think the grip safety is a problem, but I do think it can cause issues if you haven't spent much time handling pistols...
 
My issue with a grip safety on ANY gun isn't failure to fire at a target. Nor really failing to fire because I am in a hurry under duress.

The big problem I see, is in a situation where you have someone in close that is trying to grab your gun. Don't bother saying you would already have shot, there are plenty of situations where a no-shoot can go to a shoot situation but its BECAUSE they are going for your gun. In such a situation where you won't necessarily have a complete solid grip, maybe even contested (opponent hand is also on the grip) - a grip safety will be a major liability. If you had a gun in that situation with no grip safety you could fire it and the slide would remove the cretin's hand from your weapon (and perhaps his wrist).

I like my XDM - its a nice gun, but honestly the grip safety gives me buyer's remorse. Its not a good choice for a carry gun over my Glock, or Beretta. Either of those guns won't have that issue.

Its a similar preference why I don't care for single action hammer guns. You've got to go around cocked & locked, or draw the hammer back while drawing the weapon, or go empty and rack the slide. In a defensive situation - pull, point & fire without any sideshow (safety manipulation, hammer draw, slide racking) is the fastest course to a survival outcome.

Sure, copious practice might solve those issues, and maybe you'll be almost as fast. Almost is not good enough, and that amount of practice to overcome a design defect is just wasted time.
 
Discussion starter · #35 ·
I put my Xd/xdm up against glocks every three month at qualification shoots. I stay qualified on three and I once owned four.

It is simply not possible to fail to depress the grip safety when you have a proper grip. If you blame that safety without correcting the grip, where is the true problem?
 
My issue with a grip safety on ANY gun isn't failure to fire at a target. Nor really failing to fire because I am in a hurry under duress.

The big problem I see, is in a situation where you have someone in close that is trying to grab your gun. Don't bother saying you would already have shot, there are plenty of situations where a no-shoot can go to a shoot situation but its BECAUSE they are going for your gun. In such a situation where you won't necessarily have a complete solid grip, maybe even contested (opponent hand is also on the grip) - a grip safety will be a major liability. If you had a gun in that situation with no grip safety you could fire it and the slide would remove the cretin's hand from your weapon (and perhaps his wrist).

I like my XDM - its a nice gun, but honestly the grip safety gives me buyer's remorse. Its not a good choice for a carry gun over my Glock, or Beretta. Either of those guns won't have that issue.

Its a similar preference why I don't care for single action hammer guns. You've got to go around cocked & locked, or draw the hammer back while drawing the weapon, or go empty and rack the slide. In a defensive situation - pull, point & fire without any sideshow (safety manipulation, hammer draw, slide racking) is the fastest course to a survival outcome.

Sure, copious practice might solve those issues, and maybe you'll be almost as fast. Almost is not good enough, and that amount of practice to overcome a design defect is just wasted time.


Cough cough -- I disagree! -- cough cough.

You put up a straw man argument then twist it about to support your dislike of the weapon. If you want to own a Glock, just go get one. They are fine. If you don't have the ability to use a safety, don't get a gun with a safety. But please, don't troll with your bogus straw man arguments.
 
Discussion starter · #38 ·
You can operate the XD/XDM and do everything, including clear failures, without changing your grip. How is it possible to NOT depress the safety?

I don't believe this is true. Perhaps a Glocktalk fan took a wrong (or is it "right"?) turn and got lost?
 
I was robbed and shot in B'ham, AL on 8/6/06 while carrying my XD9 subcompact. After I fired my first round I wasn't able to get a good grip on the gun for follow up shot(s). Real world situation and the grip safety was a hinderance, to say the least. (fyi, the "suspect" ran off after my first shot and was never caught).

I LOVE this gun but it is not my daily carry gun any longer.
 
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