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Why are .22 cal rimfire rifles included in this section? It makes little sense.

One Eye Jack
Actually, the S&W is a full sized, functioning as an AR type of .22. Why not have them included? Also, there are .22 LR uppers made for regular ARs. Several people here have them also. (no, I don't own one)
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Not meaning to be contentious, but how is a .22 rimfire an AR type? I can take my M15A2 and swap parts and mags with any true AR from any other manufacturer. I can't do that with a dedicated .22.
Why would anybody buy a complete upper to shoot .22s when a simple conversion kit and mag do the same?
 

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A .22 LR dedicated upper will have chamber and bbl. maximized for that caliber as opposed to making do. The fact the lower receiver is a true AR kind of answered your question for me.

While its true most ARs are in .223/5.56, there are other calibers and even different systems that fall under the AR category.

I think you are probably correct that a seperate category could be made but really don't see it as necessary. Alot of AR owners are interested in cheap, AR style plinkers. Ones that mimic the size and function of an AR 15 can also be useful training tools for novices and even LE training where budgets are tight.

JMHO, yours is just as valid.;)
 

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Discussion Starter #5
A .22 LR dedicated upper will have chamber and bbl. maximized for that caliber as opposed to making do. The fact the lower receiver is a true AR kind of answered your question for me.
A .22 "AR"{?} is a recoil operated system. An AR is a gas operated system. Even the firing pins are different. The rifling should be different rates to maximize accuracy.

The fact that your upper won't fit my lower kind of raises the question for me.:shock::?:neutral:
 

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Considering the M&P 15-22 is considered a fully functional .22 caliber AR, not just a 10/22 stuck in a fake non-functional frame that resembles an AR, I thought my posts about mine that I put in the AR section made perfect sense.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Considering the M&P 15-22 is considered a fully functional .22 caliber AR, not just a 10/22 stuck in a fake non-functional frame that resembles an AR, I thought my posts about mine that I put in the AR section made perfect sense.
Well, many do Clinton...... To me calling a recoil operated .22 an Armalite is like calling a Marlin Model 60 a Carbine. Thats all.

Do you tell people you own an AR, M4, or do you differentiate?
 

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Well, many do Clinton...... To me calling a recoil operated .22 an Armalite is like calling a Marlin Model 60 a Carbine. Thats all.

Do you tell people you own an AR, M4, or do you differentiate?
I tell people I own a M&P 15-22 .22 caliber AR, thats what it is right;)

Armalite is a brand name anyway... AR doesnt mean Armalite
 

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Beg to differ. :shock:
With what? ArmaLite (the original company) used AR as the designation for the weapon when they designed it, they sold the rights to Colt... now everyone who makes them refers to them as AR's... they are not all ArmaLite are they;)
 

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Discussion Starter #11
AR stands for Armalite.

What do you think AR stands for?

What do yo think "M&P 15-22" stands for....."Military and Police"?
 

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AR stands for Armalite.

What do you think AR stands for?

What do yo think "M&P 15-22" stands for....."Military and Police"?
So should I post threads about the M&P in the LEO section:rolleyes:

Whats the beef here, the 15-22 is built as a dedicated AR platform in .22 caliber, whats the problem with posting it in the AR section:confused:
 

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AR originally stood for Armalite but was manufactured by many makers as the AR-15 or 16. Colt was the major producer for many years.

M&P was Smith's designation for Military and Police models and to a certain degree, still is. Admittedly its use with the .22 is marketing but they did design it with training in mind and closely followed the size and controls of the M&P 15s.

CMMG makes complete dedicated uppers that WILL match up with a standard AR15 lower.

I don't quite understand why this bothers anyone. I, personally, don't own a .22 AR (or whatever designation might please your sensibilities) but see no conflict with sharing the forum with AR type rim fire owners. There are enough common factors that they fit well into the category imho.

A small caliber pistol is no less a revolver, a semi auto or any type of handgun that is chambered for it.

By strict standards, perhaps piston type ARs should not be called ARs since Stoner originally designed the platform as gas operated only.:?:

IMHO, a rose by any other name................................
 

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Discussion Starter #14
No problem.

I just know that a recoil operated .22 cal rifle is not a direct gas impingement, military and tactical platform as designed by Eugene Stoner.........an AR.

Again I ask.....What does AR stand for?
 

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Here is the history of the ArmaLite company. Interestingly enough, the AR5 was a .22 designed for and adopted by the USAF as a pilot's survival rifle. NOW what does AR stand for, LOL.

http://www.armalite.com/images/Library/History.pdf

Further info regarding the AR for the purist.................................


The AR-5 was the basis of the MA-1 aircrew survival rifle, adopted by the USAF in 1956, as a replacement for the M6 Aircrew Survival Weapon. The M6 is a superposed ("over-under") combination weapon with a .22 Hornet rifle barrel over a .410 shotgun barrel. While there is an advantage to such a combination, the AR-5 has the advantage of rapid fire, using the same .22 Hornet cartridge as the M6's rifle barrel. The AR-5 was developed by ArmaLite, a division of Fairchild Engine and Airplane Corporation. The AR-5 was submitted in response to an Air Force request shortly after the division was established on October 1, 1954.[1]

The MA-1 is a four-shot, bolt-action rifle, chambered for the .22 Hornet cartridge, a round somewhat heavier than the common .22 Long Rifle cartridge, with a higher velocity and range, yet with a light, controllable recoil.

Designed to be stowed in cramped aircraft cockpits, the rifle was made from lightweight plastics and aluminum alloys. The MA-1 was unique for being able to be disassembled with all working parts stored within the stock. When stowed in this manner, the rifle was able to float[2]. The MA-1 established ArmaLite as a recognized firearms company, leading to several other rifles of varying success. However, the USAF never received funding to buy more than the original 12 test models due in part to the number of M4 and M6 survival weapons already in USAF inventory.[3]

Armalite used the research and tooling for the AR-5/MA-1 to develop the AR-7, an eight-shot semi-automatic rifle chambered for the .22 Long Rifle cartridge. Released in 1959[4] as a civilian survival weapon, the AR-7 is related to the AR-5 in terms of its overall layout, and retains the same modular takedown, storage in stock, and the ability to float
 

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No problem.

I just know that a recoil operated .22 cal rifle is not a direct gas impingement, military and tactical platform as designed by Eugene Stoner.........an AR.

Again I ask.....What does AR stand for?
Armalite Rifle. It's the designation they used when Stoner originally designed the rifle for military use, but when it was turned down and the Army ordered more M14's and replacement/service parts, they sold the design to Colt, under the condition that the "AR" designation remained. Colt obliged, wound up with the military contract, and Armalite returned some time later.
 

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No problem.

I just know that a recoil operated .22 cal rifle is not a direct gas impingement, military and tactical platform as designed by Eugene Stoner.........an AR.

Again I ask.....What does AR stand for?
So the only problem you have is the .22 caliber is recoil operated instead of gas? Or do you believe the 5.56 caliber M&P 15 isnt an AR either... how about DPMS... Ruger... etc... etc... etc...??
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Armalite Rifle. It's the designation they used when Stoner originally designed the rifle for military use, but when it was turned down and the Army ordered more M14's and replacement/service parts, they sold the design to Colt, under the condition that the "AR" designation remained. Colt obliged, wound up with the military contract, and Armalite returned some time later.
Thank you.........and you didn't even need a "street shout out"! AR stands for Armalite......

AR5 is an Armalite also.

Getting Clinton to admit AR stands for Armalite is as difficult as getting Rep. Anthony Weiner to admit he tweeted his crotch shot to a college student!!!!!:rolleyes:
 

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Thank you.........and you didn't even need a "street shout out"! AR stands for Armalite......

AR5 is an Armalite also.

Getting Clinton to admit AR stands for Armalite is as difficult as getting Rep. Anthony Weiner to admit he tweeted his crotch shot to a college student!!!!!:rolleyes:
Yes the AR designation meant ArmaLite Rifle when Stoner developed them... it wasnt an ArmaLite Rifle anymore when Colt bought them out, it was a Colt Rifle that Colt agreed to keep the AR designation on, at that point it became a designation as it was no longer made by ArmaLite, so it wasnt their rifle.

According to your viewpoint the only "AR" that should be allowed in the "AR" section are those made by ArmaLite or Colt right;)
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Yes the AR designation meant ArmaLite Rifle when Stoner developed them... it wasnt an ArmaLite Rifle anymore when Colt bought them out, it was a Colt Rifle that Colt agreed to keep the AR designation on, at that point it became a designation as it was no longer made by ArmaLite, so it wasnt their rifle.

According to your viewpoint the only "AR" that should be allowed in the "AR" section are those made by ArmaLite or Colt right;)
AR does not stand for Armalite Rifle, Army Rifle, or anything but Armalite.

So, Clinton, is my Armalite M15A2 an AR?

And yes, Armalite, DD, Colt, RRA, Bushmaster, Spikes, etc.,etc., are ARs, in the common parlance, if they fit the paradigm of the Stoner design, as are most Frankenbuilds. They certainly belong in this section.

If you want to post your .22 cal, recoil operated, semi-auto, collapsible stock, rifle in the AR 15 section you don't need my permission. Post away.

This is AR-MERICA after all!!!! :cool:
 
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