[jd manila]

HI to all XDTalk bros.,I'm just curious if there is an easy way to detect potential squib round in reloads,btw, I'm using an HS9 service model,can it damage the barrel, having 3 squibs in 1 session,TIA

 

[Croesius]

I'm no reloader, but I'd be VERY worried if you encountered three squibs in one shooting session.

VERY worried.

Are you doing the reloading yourself? I have heard many a time a saying "never fire another man's reloads". In a self defense scenario, a catastrophic failure is quite likely the second to last thing you want to have happen.

 

[mhen]

Is it possible that you are confusing squibs with misfires? Misfires are MUCH more common than squibs, but still 3 bullet malfunctions in a session is a large number.

 

[jd manila]

No bro. i didn't reload it myself, it's from a local range, because here in Manila, imported ammo will cost you a fortune that is why we are forced to use reloads that are sold in the range, and surely it's a squib because the slug got stuck 3 times, however sir, my query is will it damage the barrel and can there be a way to easily spot a squib in a bunch of reloads. thank you guys!

 

[ThumperIII]

SQUIB. A round fired that has insufficient power to drive the bullet completely thru (and out) of the barrel. Dangerous as a second normal power load could be driven into the stuck round and potentially cause an explosion of the barrel and/or slide and frame.
No 100% detection method for the consumer other than dis-assembly prior to firing. Individual cartridges can be weighed to hopefully separate a no powder load from the rest (only the primer to power the bullet into the bore). But real difficult with pistol size cases as just the differences between brass and bullet weights may be near equal to the weight of the powder load. A simple low powder charge where some powder is there but maybe less than minimum load necessary for the bullet to clear the barrel would not normally be detectable by weight for same reason. Rifle cartridges are slightly more apt to be detected due to the larger weight of the powder charge. Also could be right amount but wrong powder. Not detectable unless disassembled. However, if suspected I would not fire that ammo batch. If you are getting squibs, then there is no comfort level assurance you will not also encounter a double charged load from the same source.
During a course of fire a squid may be detected by differences in sound or felt recoil, lack of new hole in a target...after being fired. But if it occurs during a rapid fire string, you may not have time to realize the problem prior to making another trigger pull. Your 'bad'.

Squibs can happen with commercial as well as reloader ammo. Only the reputation of the product and brand for a confidence level. But, you might be the first case to detect a problem. Weighing each round is an option that may work, at least better than nothing, but do not count on it being reliable. A 9mm case does not hold a lot of powder so small differences may not show up. If these are range reloads with cast bullets, any difference in weight may mean nothing as far as the powder levels. They are probably using near a minumum powder power charge in their reloads so even 1grain low may cause a squib. Brass and bullet differences would be greater. Complaints and spread the word short of being banned from the range is you only option if you have to use their ammo.

The squib in itself will not damage a barrel if removed prior to firing another round through the barrel. As the squib was a result of insufficient pressure to push the bullet through the barrel there is nothing to have damaged or stressed the barrel. Most chance of barrel damage is if a hard steel rod is used to drive out the stuck round and scrapes into the bore or rifling. Aluminum, brass, any soft metal or even steel if absolutely no other choice and the rod is correctly sized and smoothed with rounded edges. The stuck bullet will not damage the bore wwhen moved, it is just going a lot slower than if fired. In your circumstances, best not to do any rapid fire if ammo is questionable. Wear good shooting glasses and recommend shooting gloves along with the ear plugs.

Other cartridge problems may be detected visually: missing, raised or damaged primers; damaged or deformed cases; deformed bullets; setback; improper crimp; wrong caliber, etc.

If you are the loader/maker, observe the powder charge in the cases during assembly. No distractions. When any doubts, dis-assemble or safely discard if dis-assembly is not a safe option. If you weighed the individual cases and bullets prior to loading and sorted by weight, you might have a good chance of detecting a completed no powder cartridge. A bit low or incorrect powder - not really without dis-assembly.

During some large caliber munitions testing for the military, we used some mega-powered X-ray equipment to check and record the powder levels and some other factors, but not sufficient contrast discrimination to detect wrong powders unless markers had been added to the powder.

 

[ajamesp51]

If you have a squib and fire a good round you can bulge your barrel which ruins it. I had a customer send me a barrel that looked like a pregnant guppy.

The only thing you can do if you are buying pre loaded reloads is to weight each round and look for ones that are a few grains short. Set up a balance calibrated to a fully loaded good round then weigh each looking for the one that does not weigh enough.

 

[Quickdraw Limpsalot]

You may be able to weigh each round on a scale and throw out any that are drastically different from the average weight. Visually, there's no good way without pulling the bullets.

 

[Keltyke]

No 100% detection method for the consumer other than dis-assembly prior to firing. Individual cartridges can be weighed to hopefully separate a no powder load from the rest (only the primer to power the bullet into the bore). But real difficult with pistol size cases as just the differences between brass and bullet weights may be near equal to the weight of the powder load.

I reload, and until I changed my powder delivery system to a more reliable one and started checking each load visually, I had problems with squibs. DO NOT, DO NOT, DO NOT use weight in an attempt to determine a squib round. There is NO reliable way to check already loaded cartridges for a light, or no, load. As stated, brass case weights may vary almost as much as powder load weights and will fool you into thinking a round is good when it isn't.

The squib in itself will not damage a barrel if removed prior to firing another round through the barrel.

True. The only damage will be if you don't catch it and fire a second round. This will usually result in a ruined barrel at least, and a broken gun and injury at worst. I'm sure you've already thought of carrying a brass rod and small hammer to punch out the offending bullet at the range.

The BIG problem with this is it virtually eliminates rapid fire practice (if your range allows it). When you're concentrating on the target and cranking off 2-3 rounds a second, you'll never be able to stop in time to prevent that second shot.

Sounds like the company that makes the rounds you're using doesn't have very good quality control. You said imported ammo is very expensive there. You may have to bite the bullet and use it. Can you get reloading supplies and do it yourself?

 

[thetravlor]

Inform the range of so many squibs. Let them know you aren't happy and that any damages to your gun will result in a law suit. Might be they need better quality control at the reloader.

 

[john_bud]

It really seems that you are an on the ball shooter. Catching a squib and clearing the barrel - smart!

But the range is using substandard materials in the reload or they are making some mistake in the reload process. I would have a long discussion with them about it.

 

[mixednuts]

As others have stated there really isn't a foolproof way to check for a squib unless you actually pull the bullets. When I first started reloading I had 3 squibs in the first batch that I made. The problem was I didn't clean my powder measure as thoroughly as I should have and it would drop a very light load once every hundred rounds or so. After cleaning it again the problem went away.

Luckily when a squib happens there is not enough recoil to actually cycle the slide so firing a live round behind it is virtually impossible, at least with my gun. Still, its something to always be on the lookout for as it can happen at anytime and unfortunately with factory ammo as well.

 

[agalindo]

Right variances in brass weight will offset any powder weight difference especially if you are using mixed brass.

 

[ChaoP]

Luckily when a squib happens there is not enough recoil to actually cycle the slide so firing a live round behind it is virtually impossible, at least with my gun. Still, its something to always be on the lookout for as it can happen at anytime and unfortunately with factory ammo as well.

I saw a squib the other day at an IDPA match, it cycled his slide and he fired another shot. It was the last course of the day so he didn't take it apart to see if the gun was damaged, but it burned both of his hands pretty bad and shot the magazine out of the gun.

I've seen plenty of videos online where a squib cycled the slide and loaded another bullet and the person pulled the trigger. They usually didn't end too well

 

[shooter-55]

Squibs are caused by a number of things and not just the lack of powder in the case. Bad powder, wet powder, obstruction between the primer and the powder......and has been said the lack of powder.
I had a guy show me a "squib" load that had polishing media caked solid in the bottom of the case, so the charge would not reach the powder. It actually pushed the unfired powder and the bullet out of the case into the barrel.
As has been stated, it is going to be pretty hard to see things like this. Just be careful that you pay attention to any variance in report and recoil.

 

[jd manila]

I reload, and until I changed my powder delivery system to a more reliable one and started checking each load visually, I had problems with squibs. DO NOT, DO NOT, DO NOT use weight in an attempt to determine a squib round. There is NO reliable way to check already loaded cartridges for a light, or no, load. As stated, brass case weights may vary almost as much as powder load weights and will fool you into thinking a round is good when it isn't.


True. The only damage will be if you don't catch it and fire a second round. This will usually result in a ruined barrel at least, and a broken gun and injury at worst. I'm sure you've already thought of carrying a brass rod and small hammer to punch out the offending bullet at the range.

The BIG problem with this is it virtually eliminates rapid fire practice (if your range allows it). When you're concentrating on the target and cranking off 2-3 rounds a second, you'll never be able to stop in time to prevent that second shot.

Sounds like the company that makes the rounds you're using doesn't have very good quality control. You said imported ammo is very expensive there. You may have to bite the bullet and use it. Can you get reloading supplies and do it yourself?

HI, yes sir US made ammos are so expensive here, that's why we are inclined to use reloads for range practice, sir I'm not a so heavy shooter that's why I don't plan on reloading myself, anyway,I was thinking how could it be possible to automatically rack another one in chamber when you just got a squib, because what happened was, fired a round got a pfft sound and noticed a smoke so I stopped,but I also noticed that the slide didn't recoil I guess maybe if I did tap, rack, bang would change all that,Keltyke sir, I appreciate your tips so much.TY

 

[jd manila]

Inform the range of so many squibs. Let them know you aren't happy and that any damages to your gun will result in a law suit. Might be they need better quality control at the reloader.

Thanks for your advise, but threatening them with lawsuit because of that incident I don't think so, they'll just laugh it off, won't work here.

 

[XDm_Shooter]

I reload, and until I changed my powder delivery system to a more reliable one and started checking each load visually, I had problems with squibs. DO NOT, DO NOT, DO NOT use weight in an attempt to determine a squib round. There is NO reliable way to check already loaded cartridges for a light, or no, load. As stated, brass case weights may vary almost as much as powder load weights and will fool you into thinking a round is good when it isn't.


True. The only damage will be if you don't catch it and fire a second round. This will usually result in a ruined barrel at least, and a broken gun and injury at worst. I'm sure you've already thought of carrying a brass rod and small hammer to punch out the offending bullet at the range.

The BIG problem with this is it virtually eliminates rapid fire practice (if your range allows it). When you're concentrating on the target and cranking off 2-3 rounds a second, you'll never be able to stop in time to prevent that second shot.

Sounds like the company that makes the rounds you're using doesn't have very good quality control. You said imported ammo is very expensive there. You may have to bite the bullet and use it. Can you get reloading supplies and do it yourself?

Even if you shoot a little bit it would not take long for your efforts to pay off if you start with even a very basic reloading kit...it may just save your gun, your hands or more from future incidents. I would not EVER shoot bullets reloaded by anyone other than myself (one exception would be my grandpa who has been loading for longer than I have been alive). If I had to use expensive factory ammo, so be it...I ain't trustin' some "range reloader" to make sure my rounds are safe. As keltyke has said, DO NOT use weight to determine if you have a load that is safe or not safe. Depending on the brass and bullet there could be enough of a difference between the components to make an unsafe load appear safe by weight. Pistol rounds don't use much powder therefore you could be off by enough to have a problem doing it by weight. IMO - If I were you I would look into a basic reloading kit and know what I am getting is going to work when I need it to and like it is supposed to. Not only that - you can start to stock pile ammo...just in case you need lots of it!

Thanks for your advise, but threatening them with lawsuit because of that incident I don't think so, they'll just laugh it off, won't work here.

All the more reason to load your own. If they are willing to "laugh off" a lawsuit I certainly would not be using their ammo!! Any "company" that loads and sells ammo is required to have a license to do so...if they are licensed to load and sell ammo and are going to laugh off damage to your weapon or bodily injury...don't think that is the guy I would be buying from!

 

[tomfoolery]

I can't think of a way to tell a squib from a non-squib short of individually weighing each and every round.

 

[agalindo]

I can't think of a way to tell a squib from a non-squib short of individually weighing each and every round.

Not even then, weight variances between cases especially if they are not from the same lot or brand would nullify the difference in charge weight. Been there done that.

 

[Keltyke]

I can't think of a way to tell a squib from a non-squib short of individually weighing each and every round.

You haven't read the previous posts, have you? It will NOT work! The weight of the different brands of brass cases can vary as much as the weight of the powder load, possibly fooling the shooter into thinking a load is loaded when it isn't.

Bad advice is ok sometimes, but not when following it may cause injury.