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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Your gun is not more accurate than you.

Every gun is capable of more accuracy in a ransom rest than you are.

/rant
 

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Not to contradict, but I have read a few articles where the author claims to have smaller groups off hand or with a sandbag rest than with the ransom rest.
Not sure of all variables but there it is.
 

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Not to contradict, but I have read a few articles where the author claims to have smaller groups off hand or with a sandbag rest than with the ransom rest.
Not sure of all variables but there it is.
Number 1,he lies!
Number 2 He has no idea how to use Ransom Rest.

don
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I'm sick of seeing these posts of mediocre target groups from standing at 5 yards and a quote saying "I know this gun is more accurate than me". No.. It's not. You just can't utilize the weapon's accuracy to it's full potential.
 

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Your gun is not more accurate than you.

Every gun is capable of more accuracy in a ransom rest than you are.

/rant
Every gun is capable of more accuracy in a ransom rest than you are.
So the gun IS more accurate than you are.

One of the silliest posts ever.
 

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So I had to look up this "ransom rest" to see what all the fuss is about. To me it seems to take the shooter out of shooting. I really don't see the point. What are we proving? That this expensive gun clamp when used correctly can hold a tighter group that most humans? It sure isn't proving that you are a good shot. You are no longer in control of the gun. Not my idea of marksmanship but to each their own.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
So the gun IS more accurate than you are.

One of the silliest posts ever.

Yeah. Cruddy wording. Read my post above yours.

The gun is not more accurate than you. You just are unable to take advantage of the accuracy it provides.

Let's say the gun has a half moa deviance at 100 yards. But then you throw a shooter in that is able to shoot a 1 moa group. The gun is still providing it's half moa, but you're spreading that group out by a half moa because you're human.

So when people try to sell their gun, or buy a gun and show off groups and say things like "the gun is more accurate than me" that's a ridiculous statement.
 

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I still don't get it. If the gun with it's mechanical variabilities shoots 1/2" MOA, and I introduce an additional 1/2" MOA with my muscle control (or lack thereof), isn't the gun capable of achieving more accurate groups than what I can accomplish as a human holding said gun? I mean, the gun isn't going to shoot itself...
 

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Yeah. Cruddy wording. Read my post above yours.

The gun is not more accurate than you. You just are unable to take advantage of the accuracy it provides.

Let's say the gun has a half moa deviance at 100 yards. But then you throw a shooter in that is able to shoot a 1 moa group. The gun is still providing it's half moa, but you're spreading that group out by a half moa because you're human.

So when people try to sell their gun, or buy a gun and show off groups and say things like "the gun is more accurate than me" that's a ridiculous statement.
I'm not sure of the intent of the thread either. Most of the time when I see the statement it's when trying to convince a new shooter that they don't need a match barrel or the dozen other upgrades because they haven't mastered the fundamentals. I was listening to some testosterone in the next lane yesterday suggesting that better ammo and some upgrades would help them hit that 25 yard target 25" target. That is, until my wife started working her 4"-6" targets at 15 yards and then it got pretty quiet over there.

I'd argue, that any gun, UNLOADED, was more accurate than those folks. Good folks, I'm sure, but definitely in need of some practice and training in order to make use of the gun's accuracy.
 

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I still don't get it. If the gun with it's mechanical variabilities shoots 1/2" MOA, and I introduce an additional 1/2" MOA with my muscle control (or lack thereof), isn't the gun capable of achieving more accurate groups than what I can accomplish as a human holding said gun? I mean, the gun isn't going to shoot itself...
Correct, nearly every gun is more accurate than nearly every shooter, again, it's a stupid thread.
The point of a Ransom Rest is to take the human out of the loop to check the mechanical accuracy of a gun, it's just a diagnostic tool, not a shooting aide.

As someone who can't hit the broad side of a Helen Gurley Brown I can attest all my pistols are more accurate than I am.
 

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So I had to look up this "ransom rest" to see what all the fuss is about. To me it seems to take the shooter out of shooting. I really don't see the point. What are we proving? That this expensive gun clamp when used correctly can hold a tighter group that most humans? It sure isn't proving that you are a good shot. You are no longer in control of the gun. Not my idea of marksmanship but to each their own.
The purpose of a Random Rest is to "dial in" your gun and ammunition combination. Because not all guns shoot all ammunition the same way, using a Ransom Rest will give you accurate information about which load works best in any particular handgun. It removes the shooter from the equation, just as its supposed to.
 

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Yeah. Cruddy wording. Read my post above yours.

The gun is not more accurate than you. You just are unable to take advantage of the accuracy it provides.

Let's say the gun has a half moa deviance at 100 yards. But then you throw a shooter in that is able to shoot a 1 moa group. The gun is still providing it's half moa, but you're spreading that group out by a half moa because you're human.

So when people try to sell their gun, or buy a gun and show off groups and say things like "the gun is more accurate than me" that's a ridiculous statement.
The way I understand it, we are misusing the word "accurate." Guns are "precise." Shooters are "accurate." A good gun should be capable of precision shooting. Shooting a gun that shoots precisely should help a shooter to become more accurate because he/she will know that misses are the result of the inaccuracy of the shooter, and not the fault of the gun/ammo.
 

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My Sig X5 is precise, I am pretty accurate. I would without a doubt say the pistol could be more precise and accurate in someone elses hands.
That being said, I'm sure in others hands like a beginner, it would not be as precise.
 

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I'm not sure of the intent of the thread either. Most of the time when I see the statement it's when trying to convince a new shooter that they don't need a match barrel or the dozen other upgrades because they haven't mastered the fundamentals. I was listening to some testosterone in the next lane yesterday suggesting that better ammo and some upgrades would help them hit that 25 yard target 25" target. That is, until my wife started working her 4"-6" targets at 15 yards and then it got pretty quiet over there.

I'd argue, that any gun, UNLOADED, was more accurate than those folks. Good folks, I'm sure, but definitely in need of some practice and training in order to make use of the gun's accuracy.
I got this over the weekend too. My GF got her pistol out and proceeded to print a very nice group at 10 yards. I then got her other pistol out and printed a better group. The lane next to me got eerily quiet and peeked around to see what weapon I was shooting. It's the Indian, not the arrow. Nice arrows do help a little though.
 

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My Sig X5 is precise, I am pretty accurate. I would without a doubt say the pistol could be more precise and accurate in someone elses hands.
That being said, I'm sure in others hands like a beginner, it would not be as precise.
Nope. The gun is what it is. It might shoot less accurately in the hands of a beginner, but if it is a precise weapon, it will still be a precise weapon. The quality of the gun does not change depending on the hands that hold it.
 

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Absolutely right! Here is where you get into the difference between mechanical accuracy and practical accuracy. Each gun is a law unto itself as to it's mechanical accuracy. This is where the Ransom or a good sandbag rest comes in... to find out what the GUN is capable of. And contrary to popular belief not all guns are accurate and many shooter can shoot better groups than some guns are capable of delivering. For example my first Smith and Wesson M14 came with a guarentee of x ring accuracy at 50 yards and the GUN will still shoot into just over 1" at 25 yards from a sandbag rest. By the same token I recently tested a new Glock that would not shoot any better than 3 1/2" at the same range. Now YOU define what is accurate to you. IMHO the Glock is not particulary accurate and the old K38 is exceptionaly accurate. To a shooter of lesser ability HE might consider the Glock to BE accurate. I have personally used several different types of rest and test beds and have generaly found that I can equal the Ransom results from a sand bag rest of my own design. But as I age and my eyes fade I feel that that will be changing and so soon it will be back to a Ransom for testing mechanical accuracy.

The accuracy issue is one reason i took to the XD rather than the Glock or some others, in general the XD is a tighter grouping gun. Then you add in the ergonomic that allow you to USE the accuracy and you have a superior weapon.

I never ascribed to the theroy of COMBAT accuacy. You don't often get a full torso shot at anything and if you do shoot a living target you need to PLACE the bullet where it will work and THOSE are mighty small areas indeed. I want every ounce of accuracy both mechanical and practical that a gun will give me... hence the XD.
 
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