Questions at the gunshop for background check?

Discussion in 'XDTalk Chatter Box' started by Deer Slayer, Nov 15, 2008.

  1. Deer Slayer

    Deer Slayer XDTalk 3K Member Founding Member

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    I'm looking for the questions they ask you here in michigan when you go to buy a handgun at the gunshop. A friend and I were debating the wording of one of the questions, and I'm trying to find the actual questions they ask you. All my searches come up with the questions they ask when you apply for the purchase permit. Anyways, anybody got a link to the questions, or a copy of the form? :confused:
     
  2. Ed Ely

    Ed Ely Super Moderator Staff Member Founding Member

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  3. Joeywhat

    Joeywhat XDTalk 5K Member

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    Ed, when was that 4473 used? I have not used that form, and have used both the old and new versions recently.

    Slayer, are you asking about the form 4473 (probably question 12a, right?) or the "quiz" when applying for a purchase permit?
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2008
  4. scooter123

    scooter123 XDTalk 1K Member

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    The only questions they will ask are those pertaining to your purchase, such as what handgun do you want to purchase. The dealer will fill out the firearms transfer forms for you and you won't have any questions to answer, all you need to do is sign it where indicated and confirm that the serial number was recorded properly.

    One reason is the requirement for a pistol purchase permit, they let the local PD do the asking when you apply for the purchase permit. That is limited to a basic handgun safety questionaire, questions about your past record, and mental health history. BTW they give you a firearm safety prochure to review before filling out the safety questionaire. Bascially, the system relies on your NCIS background check coming up clean and that is done when you request your purchase permit. However, if you respond falsley to the past criminal and mental history questions, it is a Felony and you can find yourself in a lot of trouble. Which means that if you try and cheet the system and the NCIS system is more current than you thought it might be, you'll get arrested on the spot. At my PD, the duty seargent is just about 10 feet from the window for the purchase permits and the doors to the lobby are auto opening and closing. Which means that the desk seargent can probably lock you into the lobby to wait for your arrest. You will also have to supply the name, phone, and address, for one reference who is NOT related to you when you apply for the purchase permit, so it's best to have that info at hand before you go in. Obviously, that reference should also be able to pass an NCIS check. I do not think that they actually check the reference, however if you do something really stupid with your gun that reference will probably be checked and also asked some serious questions.

    BTW, the purchase permit requirement is waived for those holding a CPL. If you want to know why, take a look at the CPL requirements. They do a much deeper background check, require 2 references, require evidence of training and proficiency, and have a long list of past offenses that will void a CPL aplication.

    However, the requirement to register any handgun is NOT waived for CPL holders and in either case you only have 10 days to make that registration. Failing to do this is, I believe, a Felony and also pretty stupid because the State PD gets a copy of every FFL dealer purchase and every registration so it would not be too difficult to cross check purchases against registrations.

    Now, there are some additional legal issues concerning handguns in Michigan if you do NOT have a Concealed Pistol License. If you do not have a CPL you are quite limited in how, and where, you may transport your handgun. Basically, your only allowed to transport a handgun to a Police Department, a gunsmith, a shooting range or gun dealer, between residences, or from home to work provided your job requires you have a gun at work. In an automobile, a motorcycle, or even a bicycle, in Michigan a handgun is considered "Concealed" unless some specific requirements are met. One is that the gun must be locked up AND out of reach of the vehicles occupants. This means either in the trunk or in a locked case inside of a van or truck. In addition there must be NO ammunition "ready to hand". Which means that you must NOT have ANY loaded magazines ANYWHERE inside the vehicle, even if they are locked up in the case with the gun. For those shooting with a revolver, I would recomend that ammunition not be carried at the same time as the handgun unless it's inside a seperate and locked case. That "ready to hand" issue is a big fat gray area that has the potential to get you in a lot of trouble if you piss the cops off when your stopped. I would also recomend that even though your gun is locked up in your trunk, or a locked case, that you take the additional step to either lock that action open with a cable lock or install a trigger lock for transport. Michigan's laws about transporting a handgun without a CPL have enough pitfalls for the unwary that making a very clear demonstration of intent to make sure it's unaccessable as possible may be the only thing to save you from going to court.

    Basically, if you meet the legal requirements for getting a CPL, do it. If you don't meet those requirements because of a bad driving history, or past evidence of a bad temper and poor judgement, you should think long and hard before getting a handgun. I'll probably get flamed for saying it but frankly we don't need any more knuckheads with handguns, there are enough right now that we just don't need any more. As for the cost of a CPL, it's a pittance when compared to the cost of a violation.

    OOps, forgot about the questions on the 4473, that you basically just fill out and sign.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2008
  5. Tampabayjason

    Tampabayjason XDTalk 100 Member

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    I purchased my gun a couple weeks ago on the 6th and my form didn't look like that so i must have filled out the newer one. Anyways the questions are pretty much the same.
     
  6. UncleBuck

    UncleBuck XDTalk 5K Member Founding Member

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    In Texas I show my CHL and check Yes for the first one and NO for the rest and walk out with whatever I want :D
     
  7. Deer Slayer

    Deer Slayer XDTalk 3K Member Founding Member

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    That was exactly the from I filled out, and the question in question :p, was the one about drugs/marijuana, and controlled substances. It asks if you ARE an "unlawful user", not WERE a user, so he was thinking if you EVER smoked weed, you weren't supposed to own a gun. That question is just STUPID, who would answer that honestly if they were?!?! :rolleyes: Anybody got an example of the new one??
     
  8. UncleBuck

    UncleBuck XDTalk 5K Member Founding Member

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    dude... :shock:
     
  9. Tampabayjason

    Tampabayjason XDTalk 100 Member

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  10. Bowser4x4

    Bowser4x4 XDTalk 500 Member Founding Member

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    The only question that might give me some thought is the one about being judged mentally defective.....last gun I bought, the wife went. "You must be crazy to buy another gun.."..:shock:

    Woof
    Bowser
     
  11. Cannibul

    Cannibul XDTalk 5K Member Founding Member

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    Ed I hate to say it but that form you linked to is very old. I've not filled that one out in years. Note the dates on the bottom of the form. The current form has been in use since 2001

    The current form on the ATF website is this.

    DRAFT ATF F 4473 (5300.9)

    TBJ, the form you filled out is even older. And actually under ATF regs your gun shop will lose their license for using that older form.
     
  12. Ed Ely

    Ed Ely Super Moderator Staff Member Founding Member

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    Yep, that is the new form that I was
    referring to. Actually, there is six pages
    to the new form. The last two are just
    complete blank white sheets of paper
    which are attached, making a total of
    six sheets.

    Another expense for us taxpayers to
    underwrite!

    Ed
     
  13. Deer Slayer

    Deer Slayer XDTalk 3K Member Founding Member

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    Well, I'm probably wrong about it, because the first one looks the same as the last one except for the dates. The questions were layed out in the same mannor on both. So, it probably was the newer one, definitely wasn't the second one. I doubt they'd use an expired form, they sell enough guns they probably had the new one before they were supposed to. Just looked the same as the one I filled out. Gee, let's change the form, then change it back again just to confuse everybody! :roll:
     

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