inexpensive first .45 1911 recomendations

Discussion in 'M1911' started by dfgomaha, Mar 15, 2015.

  1. Feb 15, 2017 #121
    Koofy smacker

    Koofy smacker XDTalk Member

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    I have not. Ill be honest I dont pay too much attention to the cheap guns coming from that region
     
  2. Feb 15, 2017 #122
    Capuano

    Capuano XDTalk 5K Member

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    That's a $650 gun, may not be top price as a Springfield but it's not that cheap either.
    The guy who bought that gun from me, has beaten many of his friends with Hi Dollar 1911's.
    Not many people (unless you are a 1911 fan) will spend close to a grand on a Springfield TRP,
    when you can get a PPQ-45, or a Sig P-220 that will out-shoot the TRP out of the box for less money.

    My buddy Bill bought a TRP brand new that went 3 times back to Springfield for repair, after the third time
    (with a new barrel) I still beat him with his own Norinco 1911.
    Needless to say, he sold that POS and lost over $300 on the deal.

    Again, I'm NOT a 1911 guy, so I couldn't care less about them, if I want to shoot a pistol designed by the genius master John Browning,
    I shoot my P-35 BHP


    IMHO, of course
     
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  3. Feb 16, 2017 #123
    JayhawkNavy02

    JayhawkNavy02 XDTalk 1K Member

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    I have to admit, I find your posts entertaining.

    The PPQ/P220 cannot match the accuracy of a properly built 1911, period, no matter how much work and funds you have to invest. The PPQ can't even match the XD(M) 5.25 in accuracy, it's been tested, found lacking and precision shooters moved on. The P220 can do exceptionally well, but it is limited by the mechanical design, like the lack of bushing and lock up. The very things that make it incredibly reliable, work against it in accuracy. What is very possible and easy to do is build a 1911 poorly, no doubt and happens quite often. MIM is an attempt to mitigate/minimize that by eliminating/reducing fitting of parts, but some is still required.

    A $715 stock Springfield Range Officer with a simple bushing properly fit and a barrel re-built can put out sub 1.5" 50 yard 5 shot groups, something that would be very challenging with the pistols you've mentioned even with immense accuracy work at a much higher cost. Total cost would be about $815 to the owner. Here's an example of a box stock, Springfield RO, except the RRA rail and UDMD2 by the USMC PWS.

    [​IMG]

    What competition are you referring to? Since its accuracy I assume Bullseye the only 9mm+ bore precision/conventional pistol sport or at worst Bianchi, since that still has a 50 yard component. FWIW, I've never seen a BHP, P220 or PPQ ever get a serious nod. Guys have tried, the BHP has fundamental flaws in the design, which preclude sub 1.5" accuracy at 50 yards, the CZ Accu Shadow fixes some of those. The Pardini GT45/GT9 closes the deal, but at $3,500, blows up the "inexpensive" budget, you can also pick up a used S&W M52/M952, they get very close, but need some work, and you'll end up in the high $2k when you're done, again, not "inexpensive".

    Springfield overall, makes a fine pistol for the price, but there will be anomalies, it happens, but Springfield will usually do their best to make it right. If you think a Norinco is superior to a properly built Springfield 1911, well, lets just say we have different views and happy to trade anyone 1 for 1. Springfield doesn't charge shipping, either way, and is relatively quick on repairs, I doubt he was out of pocket on anything. I would have bought that "POS" from him in a heartbeat and if there were issues, Springfield warranty would be on top of it. My experience, not speaking for others 2nd hand.

    FWIS, I shot a nearly box stock 1911 (barrel re-fit/new bushing) and did very well with my POS in formal precision competition until I could save for something else. Statistically, most guys in precision/conventional/bullseye shooting do. The 1911 has been in the hands of EVERY precision shooting national champion (aka Bullseye) since 1939. No exceptions. No pistol has ever usurped the place of a 1911 at 50 yards. End of story. If there was a superior alternative at lower cost that provided greater accuracy with equivalent reliability that would not be the case.

    This part of your post I agree with.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2017
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  4. Feb 16, 2017 #124
    Capuano

    Capuano XDTalk 5K Member

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    AMAZING !!!!

    You're like a reincarnation of John Moses Browning, Bozo, and Buffalo Bill Cody, all in one !!

    I worship you !!


     
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  5. Feb 16, 2017 #125
    Snaphook

    Snaphook XDTalk 10K Member

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    You can certainly give him a snotty reply, but he's right. I've owned several P220's, including their very best match guns, and will buy a P220 Legion when it comes out, and I fricken LOVE P220's, but they're not more accurate than a good 1911. They're just not.

    And I've owned a TRP and it was a fine gun with a trigger that was a bit too heavy, but I'd be surprised if Springfield didn't make the TRP right for your friend.

    PPQ? Yeah, I have the 5" version and I like it but the accuracy is not stellar, I have several 9's that will significantly out shoot it (Sig X5, Sphinx, Wilson Beretta) and comparing a PPQ to my Wilson 9mm 1911 with the 1" at 25 yard accuracy guarantee? Forget it.

    There's a reason why the 1911 is still so popular, even a mediocre one is very accurate and very easy to shoot accurately, while a high end 1911 is goofy accurate and ridiculously easy to shoot accurately. And the bullseye guys like Navyhawk? They'd shoot the worlds ugliest gun if it gave them 1/10" of an inch more accuracy, I've shot Bullseye and shot with the "type" for years, and they're ONLY concerned with accuracy and loyal to accuracy only.

    You'd do yourself a favor paying attention.
     
  6. Feb 16, 2017 #126
    Capuano

    Capuano XDTalk 5K Member

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    It got nothing to do with paying attention here, I never denied or doubted that Navyhawk or Cuda66 are a fountain of knowledge about weapons (maybe Cuda66 is a little more rounded, with not just hand guns, but weapons in general)
    My problem is the way these guys show their superior knowledge, and the arrogance on their postings.
    The thread here was a cheap 1911 to start getting into the game, NOBODY asked about a "Bullseye" 1911, or a Wilson Combat gun.
    I specified many times I'm NOT a 1911 guy, I don't hate them, I'm just not interested in them, I posted about the bad experience my buddy had with his TRP, and was bashed because I DARED to criticized Springfield Service Department.
    You have to understand that most of us do not compete professionally, we don't have big money guns like you guys do, and ask silly questions like "Inexpensive 1911 to start with"

    And again, most of us will do just great shooting a PPQ-45 or a Sig P-220 at the gun range, competing for wings and beer.

    And BTW, I totally agree with "Lord Humungus" here, the RIA 1911 is the best bang for the money.
     
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  7. Feb 16, 2017 #127
    DevJames

    DevJames XDTalk 15K Member

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    Eh. I've only seen them post to counter outlandish claims or further cement solid decisions and choices.

    I think it's more of your perception of them after be called out and given evidence of either ignorance or flat out shenanigans.
     
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  8. Feb 16, 2017 #128
    dfgomaha

    dfgomaha XDTalk 2K Member

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    Still happy with the Rock Island
     
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  9. Feb 16, 2017 #129
    JayhawkNavy02

    JayhawkNavy02 XDTalk 1K Member

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    Bingo. The best is the 3rd grade response vice anything material to back up what is typically nothing other than complete and utter baloney. The one thing he did get right is that I am absolutely not well rounded. Fact. Flip side, I don't talk out my backside about other people's experiences as if they're my own.

    I guess we just have to be gentle.
    Sorry couldn't help myself.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2017
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  10. Feb 16, 2017 #130
    dfgomaha

    dfgomaha XDTalk 2K Member

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    My Rock and his Springfield little brothers
    20160314_174717.jpg
     
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