SWAT Team Honored For Raid On Wrong House

[fastboy]

Originally Posted by Yuppicide

......A New Role for SWAT?????????????


McCain suggests military-style invasion modeled on the surge to control inner city crime

"...And some of those tactics — you mention the war in Iraq — are like that we use in the military. You go into neighborhoods, you clamp down, you provide a secure environment for the people that live there, and you make sure that the known criminals are kept under control. And you provide them with a stable environment and then they cooperate with law enforcement, etc, etc." -John McCain

What an old fool that guy is.

[Alaskapopo]

Originally Posted by fastboy

What an old fool that guy is.

Sounds like he has a good idea of what is needed to bring crime under control in some of the more violent inner cities.
Pat

[MGD 45]

Originally Posted by Alaskapopo

Sounds like he has a good idea of what is needed to bring crime under control in some of the more violent inner cities.
Pat

The problem Pat, is that most people on this forum don't actually live in those inner city crime invested crap neighborhoods, where the force is needed to provide a stable living environment.

They can watch the news of these kinds of places in the luxury of their safe houses/apartments, then attack the police as being ****'s carying out some "Big Brother" type conspiracy to oppress them.

I can remember hitting a drug dealers house last year, that literally ruled the streets for a few blocks in either direction of his house. Once we had secured the house, & he was being walked out in handcuffs.....we got cheers & clapping from the surrounding neighbors......Days like that make it all worth while!!

[Alaskapopo]

Originally Posted by MGD 45

The problem Pat, is that most people on this forum don't actually live in those inner city crime invested crap neighborhoods, where the force is needed to provide a stable living environment.

They can watch the news of these kinds of places in the luxury of their safe houses/apartments, then attack the police as being ****'s carying out some "Big Brother" type conspiracy to oppress them.

I can remember hitting a drug dealers house last year, that literally ruled the streets for a few blocks in either direction of his house. Once we had secured the house, & he was being walked out in handcuffs.....we got cheers & clapping from the surrounding neighbors......Days like that make it all worth while!!

I don't live in those cities either nor do I want to. I am glad that I can carry a gun in those cities when I visit thanks to HR218. My hat is off to cops that have to work there. Keep up the good work down there.
Pat

[D_Fence]

Originally Posted by MGD 45

I can remember hitting a drug dealers house last year, that literally ruled the streets for a few blocks in either direction of his house. Once we had secured the house, & he was being walked out in handcuffs.....we got cheers & clapping from the surrounding neighbors.

I'm being totally serious and will take your answer as such when I ask the following: What would have been the problem with having someone stake out his house, wait until he left, and then surround him at an opportune time. Seems to me that these raids send good cops into unknown situations, and can lead to innocent people being in the line of fire when due diligence isn't done. (Not to mention 4th amendment concerns.)

[MGD 45]

Originally Posted by D_Fence

I'm being totally serious and will take your answer as such when I ask the following: What would have been the problem with having someone stake out his house, wait until he left, and then surround him at an opportune time. Seems to me that these raids send good cops into unknown situations, and can lead to innocent people being in the line of fire when due diligence isn't done. (Not to mention 4th amendment concerns.)

Very good question, & I'll try my best to answer it. In my hometown & I'd gather about 90% of the time in other parts of the country, what you have suggested is possible & can work like a charm. We have done just that in many, many cases.

However, you must understand that there are the few, very hardcore drug dealers who spend large amounts of money to get their supply which is then broken down & re-sold to the streets. These kind of guys DO NOT leave their drug houses when they have any sizable amount of drugs in there to be sold. They don't work jobs, and they will have flunkies run errands for them. If they do leave their house, it will be when the drugs are almost gone....or they will leave the house guarded by other thugs who know to flush/destroy the dope when spooked.

These houses have great security measures to include video surveillance, alarms, vicious dogs in fenced in yards and even people several blocks over to stay on the lookout for the "PO-PO" who can call when anything resembling cops drive in the neighborhood. In these instances I believe that SWAT is the most effective.

These types of houses don't keep large amounts of drugs there constantly but they fluctuate up & down.....so when a drug investigator uses a "CI" (criminal informant) to make several videotaped undercover drug buys....who then reports that the Drug Dealer is expecting a load to come in on Friday to resupply him on the weekend for sales......how do you respond?

Once a search warrant is signed......ya gotta hit the house during the time that the big load is there.....otherwise it's a waste of time. This is when your Special Weapon And Tactics comes into play.

Like I said earlier, you asked a great question, which I concur with you is possible in probably most of the cases......but please don't rule out that there exits the situations where SWAT has to be used in order to be successful.

Unless you don't think we should be wasting our time & resources on drugs.........then that's a whole different thread!!

[MGD 45]

I honestly think that part of the problem is a lot of these so called "SWAT" teams aren't actually SWAT trained. But rather just either investigators or patrol officers who get dressed up in the cool gear, grab an AR15 or shotgun & hit a house during a raid........

There is a big difference between actually going through the intense training & acting like you have! I imagine that we hear the most of these SWAT horror stories from smaller places than the more established & professional large cities like LAPD or NYPD.....

[Alaskapopo]

Originally Posted by MGD 45

I honestly think that part of the problem is a lot of these so called "SWAT" teams aren't actually SWAT trained. But rather just either investigators or patrol officers who get dressed up in the cool gear, grab an AR15 or shotgun & hit a house during a raid........

There is a big difference between actually going through the intense training & acting like you have! I imagine that we hear the most of these SWAT horror stories from smaller places than the more established & professional large cities like LAPD or NYPD.....

You can say that again. When I was in drugs we did our own raids. After getting some basic SWAT training down the line did I realize how badly we were doing things from a tactical standpoint.
Pat

[Yuppicide]

Originally Posted by MGD 45

I honestly think that part of the problem is a lot of these so called "SWAT" teams aren't actually SWAT trained. But rather just either investigators or patrol officers who get dressed up in the cool gear, grab an AR15 or shotgun & hit a house during a raid........

Originally Posted by Alaskapopo

You can say that again.

EUREKA!!!! I think we may finally have the answer many of us were looking for!!!!!

It finally explains why there are now over 40,000 uses of "SWAT" a year (109.5 a day), Why innocent people are (more and more often) being terrorized or shot, and why regular Joe's are starting to resent these certain members of the police force who only "Think" they are some kind of "Highly trained Tactical ninja's".....and who act like (what some may call) "Jack-booted thugs" or "****'s" when these certain Officers are on the street dealing with the public!!!!

Thank You!

-Yuppicide

[D_Fence]

Originally Posted by MGD 45

These kind of guys DO NOT leave their drug houses...They don't work jobs, and they will have flunkies run errands for them....These houses have great security measures to include video surveillance, alarms, vicious dogs in fenced in yards and even people several blocks over to stay on the lookout for the "PO-PO"...so when a drug investigator uses a "CI" (criminal informant) to make several videotaped undercover drug buys....who then reports that the Drug Dealer is expecting a load to come in on Friday to resupply him on the weekend for sales......how do you respond?

If that much is known about a particular house and suspect(s), one would think it would be really really hard to go to the wrong house.

If the no-knock SWAT raids were contained to scenarios such as what you described, I doubt we'd all be having this conversation. I think that is the point most of us are trying to make. I have zero confidence that these warrants are being reviewed with due diligence.