Not the best decision...

[frogger42]

This is why guns and alcohol don't mix.

[Alaskapopo]

Originally Posted by Philadelphia

I made a mistake on calculating the time (and I wasn't drinking).

What he said is all the evidence that exists on that issue until a toxicology report comes in.

Don't misunderstand. As I said in my original post, I don't think this guy did the right thing. There is no way I would have done what he did and I don't agree with what he did. But I'm also not willing to string him up based on a report in a newspaper.

Actually I made a mistake it was three beers not three bears. If he had three bears he would be dead. I am not willing to string him up based on the media but rather on the fact he was arrested. As a cop I can not arrest without probable cause. The cops had the facts and they chose to arrest. I trust my brothers.
Pat

[Alaskapopo]

Originally Posted by nickb

Great info here Pat, thanks. But the last part confused me.

Why would the HGN show a higher reliability for lower levels of BA?

And it seems that someone with a high alcohol tolerance would not be impaired at the same BA as someone who never drinks.

I'm not condoning drinking and packing. But, in the good old US of A, it seems to me that a 200 pound, regular drinker should be able to handle a beer while a 140 pound teetotaler cannot.

Why do we continue to put cuffs on everyone for the failings of a few?

PS. The "bears" part was funny, you have to admit............

All I was saying is its 77% reliable in showing that people who fail are over .10. So if someone fails they are most definately over the new limit of .08
Pat

[Breadfan]

You can't tell for sure that he was not affected by those 3 drinks. Different people react differently to alcohol, especially those who don't drink often.
I for one, need only one beer to start feeling 'funny' because I'm not used to it and drink only on special ocassions. Anyway, guns and alcohol shouldn't mix regardless how 'little' you took.

[BigD_htl]

3 beers? ... sound like my extended lunch hour

[Alaskapopo]

Originally Posted by BigD_htl

3 beers? ... sound like my extended lunch hour

I hope you are kidding. That is not something to be proud of. Drinking early in the day.
Pat

[Philadelphia]

Originally Posted by Alaskapopo

Actually I made a mistake it was three beers not three bears. If he had three bears he would be dead. I am not willing to string him up based on the media but rather on the fact he was arrested. As a cop I can not arrest without probable cause. The cops had the facts and they chose to arrest. I trust my brothers.
Pat

I don't know how it works where this guy is, but in my state, pointing a gun at someone in that manner is a crime (reckless endangerment and/or agg assault). It's then on the defendant to show justification as a defense. In my city, the cops don't get into this type of analysis. They arrest and let the DA's office figure out if charges will be filed (which usually takes several days while the guy rots in a holding cell somewhere -- just the way it is and it's all "legal"). So yes, there was PC to believe that a crime was committed, but that doesn't answer the question as to whether the act was actually legally justified. Or to put it another way, even if the act was legally justified, the cops certainly did nothing wrong in arresting him and your trust in your brothers could remain intact. That would generally be their job (again, at least where I am -- maybe it's different in Alaska).

In my mind the fact the the guy was arrested tells us little, other than he did, in fact, point his gun at another person.

And on another note, PC isn't the standard of proof sufficient to string someone up. As I said before, I think witnesses generally throw good samaritans under the bus if the good samaritan has a gun. What I'm getting at with that is maybe the guy is just a reckless yahoo and maybe the situation really did reasonably appear to call for the display of a gun, but we'll never know. The witnesses will all say that the multi-ton car with an out of control driver driving up amongst them to hit a tree was no biggie but all the sudden this crazed gunman came out of nowhere with his gun drawn threatening to shoot for no apparent reason and . . . blah blah blah.

It works the same way where I am even when a cop shoots someone because they were shot at. All the witnesses will say the "victim" was a choirboy on his way to bible study and while perhaps not the perfect angel, absolutely would never have possessed a gun much less shoot one and much, much less shoot one at cops. Where they generally get tripped up are the recovered bullets and shell casings that match the balistics of the gun found on or near their little angel with his prints all over it and his rap sheet being as long as the proverbial phone book. As you know, witness statements need to be looked at with plenty of grains of salt and the investigation really only just begins with those statements.

One thing I'd like to know is how the driver of the car came to drive up on a lawn crowded with people and hit a tree. I saw nothing about why that happened or whether charges were filed against the driver. A car is no less deadly than a gun, but that aspect of the story seems long overlooked and forgotten.

[Joeywhat]

Originally Posted by Alaskapopo

I hope you are kidding. That is not something to be proud of. Drinking early in the day.
Pat

Maybe his lunch is at 6 PM?

Don't pass judgment on what others choose to do with their personal lives. If you don't like to drink, good for you. But don't force others to share your ideals.

[Philadelphia]

Originally Posted by Breadfan

You can't tell for sure that he was not affected by those 3 drinks.

I don't need to tell for sure anything because the burden remains on the gov't to tell for sure beyond reasonable doubt that he was.

[Alaskapopo]

Originally Posted by Joeywhat

Maybe his lunch is at 6 PM?

Don't pass judgment on what others choose to do with their personal lives. If you don't like to drink, good for you. But don't force others to share your ideals.

I am free to pass judgment because from my experience most people who drink early in the day are alcoholics. I grew up with one. You are free to not listen to me.
Pat