Gas Prices = Chaos

[Uraiit]

I just found out that natural gas is actually the equivalent of paying $0.60/gallon.

I'm going to be converting ALL of my vehicles...

[jnclement]

Originally Posted by Uraiit

I just found out that natural gas is actually the equivalent of paying $0.60/gallon.

I'm going to be converting ALL of my vehicles...

Some one told you a story. At $11/MCF, that ain't $.60/gallon. Best way to fight high gas prices is personal conservation.

Welcome to the world of "peak oil". It was predicted, accurately, in the early 1950s. You might as well get ready. This guy was in town tonight, did a really interesting talk........

http://www.simmonsco-intl.com/files/...%20College.pdf

Although I know that isn't as much fun as nationalizing the oil companies, and becoming a socialist country. Food will be up 100% soon, why isn't anyone bitching about that?

[street cruiser]

Originally Posted by jnclement

Some one told you a story. At $11/MCF, that ain't $.60/gallon. Best way to fight high gas prices is personal conservation.

Welcome to the world of "peak oil". It was predicted, accurately, in the early 1950s. You might as well get ready. This guy was in town tonight, did a really interesting talk........

http://www.simmonsco-intl.com/files/...%20College.pdf

Although I know that isn't as much fun as nationalizing the oil companies, and becoming a socialist country. Food will be up 100% soon, why isn't anyone bitching about that?

People are preparing for the worst. The storm is on the horizon and not looking too good.

[Uraiit]

Originally Posted by jnclement

Some one told you a story. At $11/MCF, that ain't $.60/gallon. Best way to fight high gas prices is personal conservation.

Welcome to the world of "peak oil". It was predicted, accurately, in the early 1950s. You might as well get ready. This guy was in town tonight, did a really interesting talk........

http://www.simmonsco-intl.com/files/...%20College.pdf

Although I know that isn't as much fun as nationalizing the oil companies, and becoming a socialist country. Food will be up 100% soon, why isn't anyone bitching about that?

Since you don't know what it costs here in Provo, that's a pretty bold statement. But working with your numbers, lets do the math.

First of all, since natural gas is not measured in gallons, but in Cubic Feet, we have a system of measurement known as a Gasoline Gallon Equivalent (or GGE). One GGE is approximately 128 (127.77 CF to be exact) cubic feet of Natural gas.

So take 1 MCF (1000 cubic feet) of natural gas, and divide it by the GGE of 127.77.

1000/127.77=7.82. That's 7.82 gasoline gallon equivelent for $11. So for you, that's the equivalent of paying $1.40/gallon. Still a hell of a lot cheaper than whatever you might be paying for gasoline...

However, just because Google says that natural gas is $11/MCF on average, does not mean that's what it costs ME.

Utah has some of the cheapest natural gas prices in the nation. Questar--one of the larger suppliers to the state--charged an average of $6.90/MCF for the first quarter, bringing in the state average at a whopping $0.88 per GGE!

It just so happens to be even cheaper in the locale I'm in, and unlike gasoline, the cost of natural gas DROPS in the summer months, because people stop using it for heat. During the summer months it comes in at between $0.60-$0.75/GGE, depending on when and where you buy it.

Even if I'm paying top-dollar (remember that whopping $0.88?), it's still worlds better than paying $4-$5, which is easily what gas will cost this summer where I am.

Honestly, why is it that people just can't refrain from commenting on subjects which they know little-to-nothing about?

It's a totally safe investment for me, because as it is now, natural gas is cheap enough to justify the cost, so I'm willing to pay the $.60-$1.00/GGE cost.

If the cost ever starts spiraling out of control like gasoline has, my family owns multiple natural gas wells in other parts of the country. So I have access to free natural gas, for only the cost of a "line usage fee" of a few cents per MCF. If the cost ever warrants it, I'll drop the $6k on a home CNG compressor appliance, and fill up for free at home...

I can't lose.

[magua]

When you convert price per litre to Imp gal it's $5.62 a gal up here, about 40% of that is govt taxes. Only travelling this year is to the range...Bob

[jim331656]

Originally Posted by Uraiit

I just found out that natural gas is actually the equivalent of paying $0.60/gallon.

I'm going to be converting ALL of my vehicles...

hahhaaa there is the problem... Moving from 1 limited resource to another limited resource justs bandaids a big problem. Things are gonna get ugly. Fuel price is hitting the supermarket hard soon it will hit more and more industries hard... gotta make some changes

[yeahYeah]

$3.55 here.

the govt. needs to stop pandering to the environmentalists and start drilling for our own supply. we are a suicidal nation putting $ into the hands of rogue states in the middle east.

[Ride the Lightning]

Originally Posted by jcabin

thats a wonderful lesson, but the demand hasnt gone up enough to justify the increase in price. you're blind.

Are you freakin' nuts? Have you looked at the world community beyond our shores in the last 20 years? There are two or three times as many industrialized nations in the world now compared to 20 years ago and they are now using energy just as much as we are. India, China, Taiwan, and on and on have all mulitplied their energy needs by leaps and bounds. Hmmmm. 400 million Americans don't need much more energy, but 1 billion Chinamen have each tripled their energy costs. How is that not 8-10 times more demand? There's more to the oil industry than happens here. Refusing to accept that is a sure way to lead us down the path to speaking some other language in the not too distant future.

[Brickboy240]

You know...I have just about had it with trying to educate people that don't want to listen. Most of those people just love to spew nonsense or the same tripe they heard on some media outlet.

Funny, because those of us working in this biz...here at ground zero....we get it! We know exactly what needs to be done to give everyone gas at 2 bucks a gallon. The powers that be at our companies have been telling Congress and the Prez what needs to be done for decades, but they just do whatever they want.

Now...decades later...like Rev Wright said...our chickens have come home to roost. Gas will be 4 bucks plus a gallon this summer.

And the finger-pointing whips up into a frenzy as all the actions and inactions, combined with the unintended consequences of things like ethanol all crash together right now. Add all of this with the fact that the greens want to rush or force the development of alternatives that are not yet proven sound and we have the problem we have today.

But never underestimate those that blame Bush or Exxon's profits for our current problem. This does nothing but shows one's complete ignorance and bias. Should I tell those people that if Exxon and BP make LESS profits, they will see HIGHER gasoline prices? Nah...they probably would not believe me.

(Note: I am NOT a fan of Bush or Exxon...we don't do business with Exxon for various reasons but neither are directly to blame for our current conundrum...ok?)

Everyone on this forum thinks we can un-do all of this overnight. Just drill in Alaska or bring forth a hydrogen powered car. Well, its not that easy. Remember this is the convergence of decades of bad thinking and bad planning....it will NOT be un-done anytime soon. Can it be undone? Absolutely! Could we see 2 bucks a gallon gas in the USA again? Sure...but it would require dashing much of what we're doing now and giving Al Gore and his minions a coronary...but it is very do-able in several years.

The sad thing is that what needs to be done are all the things that the green lobby will not like: increase domestic production, expand refineries or build new ones, ditch ethanol entirely and narrow our gas blends down to maybe 5-6 types (from our current 34). It wouldn't hurt to limit the production of some of the more inefficient personal cars on the road to slow the consumption, either. Some would see this as a nanny state thing to do, but in the mix, we HAVE to have SOME sort of conservation of petroleum...ok?

Will we ever do what is needed to get back to reasonable fuel prices? Probably not. Why? Because like re-doing the income tax system, in doing so, too many political feet will get stepped on and many lobbyists livlihoods will be cut short. Another reason we will never see meaningful reforms is the same reason we see so many outrageous posts here concearning energy - most of our elected officials have no clue as to how the energy biz really works. Since most of them don't drive daily or are overly wealthy, they don't care about gas prices or bear any responsibility if their decisions go awry. The only reason most politicians even bring up gas prices or oil profits is to garner votes and whip up voters...thats it.

What can we do as individuals? Well...not much, but there are some things we can do to lessen the impact of high fuel prices. First...if you do not need the gas guzzler - ditch it for a more efficient car. Not popular, but ditching the Suburban or Expedition for a car that gets 25+mpg WILL lower your gas costs...guaranteed! True, I have a V8 Toyota Tundra..BUT...I kept my old 4cyl Volvo to be used as a daily driver, instead of trading it in for a few grand and thats what I drive most of the time. Wanna keep that big truck? Do what I did and get a cheap 4cyl beater to commute in...made sense to me.

Second, I would bet that most that bitch about gas prices are living at or above their income levels. They have huge houses, several cars and big screen tvs and credit cards with huge balances. They take big vacations, eat out all the time, wear expensive clothes and spend tons on extra goodies that are not al lthat esstential. They probably don't mow their own lawns and have maids or pay for other services they could do themselves. Well, living below one's means is an excellent way to lessen the impact of rising prices in everyday goods like gas and food. Most Americans live paycheck to paycheck...spending everything they make, so that when an unexpected expense comes along, they freak out. I have told many about the benefits of living well below one's means and saving for a long time. The gas and food price crunch is an excellent example of why living like I do is beneficial. True, I don't have a plasma tv, a huge house, tons of the latest electronic goodies and new cool stuff...but...I don't freak out at the price of gas or food either!

There are no easy answers to any of this...but if you look around and think about it...it is possible to lessen the impact of fuel costs and find enough information to educate oneself on how we got to where we are today. Don't rely on the nightly news or some candidate running for office to enlighten you...they're absolutely clueless.

- brickboy240

[amishclark]

look at brickboy, dropping knowledge. i must add that i could care less about the price of gas, despite owning a truck as my only vehicle. i walk to the grocery store, ride a bike to school, plan driving trips to involve multiple stops, and drive as little as possible because of this. stop expecting a "right to cheap gas" and start doing the right thing. gas prices are not the issue...your consumption is.

$.02