New girl on the block

[skylark175]

Hi Susan and welome to the forum. Please correct me or set me straight. I thought that Australia was a "no guns alowed" country. Obviously, I'm wrong about that but what does it take to get the concealed weapons permit there? Do you carry and what about the average citizens?

On a side note, a lot of my relitives are from Aus. and someday I hope to get down under for look at your beautiful country.

[charlie.45]

welcome to XD Talk. Generally I shoot at 7yrds but I do also try to go past that usually no further than 20yrds and as of yet I'm not real proficient from that distance but that being said I have bad eyesight as well so targets are even harder to see from that range,hoping to get lasik surgery soon.

[digitalexplr]

Welcome to the forum! I general practice in the 15 to 7 yard range. Since most self-defense shootings occure in the 3 foot to 11 foot range, these practice ranges are way more than adequate. (15 yards = 45 feet. 7 yards = 21 feet).

[robinsre]

Originally Posted by flycaster

Civilian self defense? Better not shoot at 50 meters! Law enforcement? May well be necessary. Two different protocols.

Chuck

Thats widely variable.

If I'm out of my house, and there's someone at 50 meters taking pot shots at me with a rifle I know I can't run fast enough to get away....I'm going to get to cover and take the shot.

In most scenarios I cans see your point but there ARE reasons for civilians to make long range shots.

[Dotagious]

I tell my students if they can hit a paper plate at 7 yards while moving, they are in good shape.

[gkelley3]

Welcome to the forum from Florida!

[Krackels]

Welcome to the forum.

I normally start shooting pretty close and work my way out...

7 yards and then out to 25 yards for pistol, although I will shoot my revolver at 50 yards.

I shoot my rifle out to 200 yards, but I'll also use scaled targets to simulate distances out to 500+ yards and it's pretty effective except for simulating bullet drop and wind drift.

[Terry]

Hello & Welcome from NorthPole, Alaska.

[ormandj]

Originally Posted by Susan West

Hi, I’m new to this forum and over the past week I have visited here on several occasions to read what you in the USA, I assume that is correct, write about firearms, their use and how to shoot etc.

Read a few interesting posts, nodded in agreement at some and cringed at others.

I ask politely at what distances do many of you practice? 15 metres? 20 or more?

When I take some of my students to the range for some practice i begin with them shooting 50 rounds at 50 metres 100 at 25 metres and 150 at 15 metres?

Speed is paramount, accuracy is critical, but accuracy with out speed is pointless and speed is irrelevant without accuracy, although I still teach speed.

By speed I mean at 15 metres 3 shoots per second at a standard IPSC target and if you miss the target at that distance perhaps you should take up another sport, or occupation, or learn how and why you need to do it better.

As an observation, guns don’t need names, they are not your friend. All guns are not the same, ammunition is a critical issue, calibres are NOT.
I prefer .40cal, but settle for 9mm, the right ammo is just that, ammo that when it hits, and hits the centre of what you intended to shoot, stays hit.

In the posts i have read there is much said about trigger control, grip, sight picture etc, they are all a given. Without the above you are a danger to yourself and those with you in a situation.

Practice is critical, bad habits must be eliminated. Then more good practice, strong hand weak hand, instinctive shooting, etc. In situations there is no time to think.
I also teach karate, when you need it you do not think, you respond, reflex.
However if you are really smart you would have seen the situation develop many seconds before it happened and taken the appropriate action.
Shooting is similar, be observant, know what is happening around you, who are the players and who are observers. I am not making reference to police officers in a tactical situation, I am making reference to the average person walking down the street, a person who carries.

I like my HS2000, no safety, loaded, but holstered and ready. Years will pass if you are lucky and you will never need to draw, but you train anyway, serious training, not what I call weekend plinkers. Weekend would be shooters if they only had what it takes, talk a lot, but when push comes to shove, just talk more.

To end, if you can take a pistol to the range and at 50 metres hit 3 targets 1 metre apart with 2 shots on each I will assume that you are competent and this should be done in under 10 seconds from the draw.
If you accomplish this I will know factually that you understand about the grip, stance, sight picture, sight alignment. Then guess how easy and fast it becomes at 7 metres or less. There is always more, but more rests with an individual, more is about attitude, more is about who you are.
From down under, where kangaroos roam.

These are unrealistic expectations for the general population. You're shooting once every 1 2/3 seconds (not accounting for draw speed) and hitting targets of unspecified sizes at 50 meters (54 approximate yards) with each shot. Most people don't see well enough to shoot iron sight that accurately with a pistol, let alone that rapidly.

At 50m, you are within rifle territory, and certainly not in a self defense situation (unless in VERY strange circumstances.) I can see this kind of training for people who want to shoot competition, but it's certainly not something "normal" people have time/money to achieve (assuming their eyes are working that well.) Realistic training for SD purposes is in the 6-14m range, and anybody with reasonable vision should be able to accomplish this with reasonable amounts of practice.

If you're training people to shoot in competition, wonderful. Otherwise, you should think about training people to use the proper tool for the job, pistol at 50m is not very viable, imo - under stress, very few people are going to shoot accurately, and again - it will be very hard to justify shooting at that range except under the strangest circumstances in SD. If you're military (as an above poster mentioned) it might be a completely different story (although I don't know many services in the world training people to use a pistol as anything other than a secondary weapon...)

Glad to have you here, and look forward to your advice! If you're able to train people to shoot that well who aren't natural born shooters with great eyesight, you've got a LOT to offer!

Best of luck,
David

[Susan West]

Greetings again: fficeffice" />>>
I posted on the XD forum to make a contribution. The response from some was great.>>
I was not prepared for some of the others. I looked at the 10-8 forum, I saw nothing of interest in the topics. However give me a few days, might even send them my credentials. Funny in the past 25+ years of shooting, NO ONE has ever questioned my ability or honesty.>>
I usually finish up with new shooters with the line, “I am better than most, not as good as some.”>>
>>
“When I take some of my students to the range for some practice I begin with them shooting 50 rounds at 50 metres 100 at 25 metres and 150 at 15 metres”>>
When you read the above carefully you will see that WE BEGIN at 54 yards, I want to see that “they” the students know what trigger control, sight picture, etc is all about.>>
Shooting at that distance and hitting a “THE” target under pressure means they understand. This is the time factor/pressure.>>
I THEN go on to say we move to 27 yards, then etc. >>
>>
“Speed is paramount, accuracy is critical, but accuracy with out speed is pointless and speed is irrelevant without accuracy, although I still teach speed.”>>
The above I stand with.>>
>>
“By speed I mean at 15 metres 3 shoots per second at a standard IPSC target and if you miss the target at that distance perhaps you should take up another sport, or occupation, or learn how and why you need to do it better.”>>
The above is also good, then if you are able to do the above, GUESS how great you will be if you need to shoot at 7 yards.>>
>>
In the posts I have read there is much said about trigger control, grip, sight picture etc, they are all a given. Without the above you are a danger to yourself and those with you in a situation.>>
Hope no one has a problem with this.>>
>>
Practice is critical, bad habits must be eliminated. Then more good practice, strong hand weak hand, instinctive shooting, etc. In situations there is no time to think.>>
I also teach karate, when you need it you do not think, you respond, reflex.>>
However if you are really smart you would have seen the situation develop many seconds before it happened and taken the appropriate action.>>
Shooting is similar, be observant, know what is happening around you, who are the players and who are observers. I am not making reference to police officers in a tactical situation; I am making reference to the average person walking down the street, a person who carries.>>
>>
“To end, if you can take a pistol to the range and at 50 metres hit 3 targets 1 metre apart with 2 shots on each I will assume that you are competent and this should be done in under 10 seconds from the draw. >>
If you accomplish this I will know factually that you understand about the grip, stance, sight picture, sight alignment. Then guess how easy and fast it becomes at 7 metres or less. There is always more, but more rests with an individual, more is about attitude, more is about who you are.” THIS was the salient point, it is obvious that some experts out your way where to fast in sending a reply without reading this in context.>>
>>
As a post script, I work in the cash in transit industry, covert, yes I know every time I go into a major shopping centre there is an element of risk, yes I know the threat will come from real close. Yes I understand there are hundreds of people around me, all innocent. BUT still I practice my routine, beginning at 54 yards, then moving forward, it hones my skills.>>
>>
It will be interesting to read some of the responses, or perhaps there won’t be any, what would an Australian (a female at that) know about shooting an XD, or in my case a HS2000.>>
Late last year I also purchased my Smith & Wesson M&P, an interesting firearm, still I prefer my HS2000.>>