Silencing Christians

[Krackels]

Originally Posted by rev-arb

I guess that there will always be those who choose not to see.

Yep, it's no different than the anti-gunners scratching their heads and saying what's so special about guns... why do you feel you need them anyway?


If one group doesn't have full freedom of speech than no-one has freedom of speech.


"...Even if people don't want to hear them, we have stand up and we have to protect the rights of people to engage in that type of speech...."

"The first amendment protects our freedom of speech it doesn't protect us from being offended."

You might not feel like you're being oppressed but hopefully you recognize that when people are arrested for saying that certain behavior is immoral; when a graduate's microphone is cut off because she was about to share the real reason for her success; or when a child is told she can't sing a song because it is religious be VERY AFRAID!

Welcome to 1984!

[JeffXD]

Well, you asked for it. I am atheistic, non-theistic, whatever you wish to call it. Unlike many "atheists" who I think just enjoy bashing religion for the heck of it, I just do not think that deities exist. Simple as that. Now then.... Christians should not be "silenced" because it might offend another faith. I really get sick of people trying to supress someone elses beliefs because it doesnt jive with thier beliefs. Atheists trying to take "God" off of money, out of the Pledge of Alliegience, whatever... Stupid
Not allowing Christmas parties at school because it offends someone else... Stupid Whether people like it or not, this country has a big reigious element from its creation over 200 years ago to the way the majority live thier lives. On the other hand, I get bent out of shape when Christians try to remove books or parts of books, etc because it doesnt support thier beliefs. To the point, I am against ALL censorship. I don't care who is censoring.

[Krackels]

Originally Posted by bountyhunter

Absolutely! That's why you find so many of them locked up without legal process or hope in places like Guantanomo bay...

Oh, wait.... that's right.

never mind.

Yeah cause catching someone in a Terrorist training camp is exactly the same as exercising your free speech during a Gay Pride parade.

Originally Posted by Reeek

Maybe this thread needed a (PV) in the title . . .

Sure, we wouldn't want to offend...

[Krackels]

Originally Posted by JeffXD

Well, you asked for it. I am atheistic, non-theistic, whatever you wish to call it. Unlike many "atheists" who I think just enjoy bashing religion for the heck of it, I just do not think that deities exist. Simple as that. Now then.... Christians should not be "silenced" because it might offend another faith. I really get sick of people trying to supress someone elses beliefs because it doesnt jive with thier beliefs. Atheists trying to take "God" off of money, out of the Pledge of Alliegience, whatever... Stupid
Not allowing Christmas parties at school because it offends someone else... Stupid Whether people like it or not, this country has a big reigious element from its creation over 200 years ago to the way the majority live thier lives. On the other hand, I get bent out of shape when Christians try to remove books or parts of books, etc because it doesnt support thier beliefs. To the point, I am against ALL censorship. I don't care who is censoring.

I applaud your for you candor and goodwill.

You're exactly like I would expect an atheist to be.

For the record, I'm completely against censorship as well.

[DanTheEldest]

Those arguing that this must not be true because of the prominence (regrettably) of certain high-profile media figures or political appointees are missing the big picture, IMO. If you stand back and look at the culture of the nation as a whole, you simply cannot find another religious group within our borders that has been as systematically lampooned, attacked, denigrated, and dismissed as whackos as Christians (and I'm including catholics for the sake of argument).

No one in the popular culture dares to heap the sheer volume or viciousness of abuse on other religious groups as they do on Christians. A crucifix in a bottle of urine? Yep. Images of Biblical figures covered in dung? Done that too. Endless stereotypical characters in sitcoms, movies, and dramas depicting the crazy, bigoted Christian? All over the place. Stand-up comedians ridiculing the faithful? Not hard to find. It is far more the rule to find these types of mischaracterizations in our media than to find accurate depictions of real followers of Christ--loving, compassionate, standing for the morality presented by the Bible, and respectful of others. And Christians have been, up until this point, the silent majority, allowing it to happen out of a meekness of spirit and a desire to see others find what they (we) have--a relationship with God that transcends mere outward religiosity and empty ritual.

Compare this with the way other religions are treated in the popular culture. Muslims are shown as solemn and dignified, treated with respect, particularly in the public schools, where they seem to be the "acceptable" religion to introduce students to even though comparable studies of Christian doctrine and history would be (and have been) eliminated before they even began in the classroom. Buddhists and other Eastern religious followers are venerated for their self-control and focus on introspection, as well as appreciated for their "exoticness"--we're teaching kids yoga and meditation for pete's sake, without filling them in on the very religious connotations and backgrounds of what we're told are just a series of healthy exercises. Mormons are held up as role-models for family living. Anybody saying anything negative at all about Jews and Judaeism are immediately slapped with the Anti-Semite label and ostracized, due in part to the recent memories of the Holocaust and other genocidal attrocities they've endured.

It's less the specific incidents depicted in the video episodes (they're just symptoms of a broader disease) as an entire culture being immersed in anti-Christian sentiments and opinions. You can dismiss it with sarcasm and arrogant contempt as you did in previous posts, but looking at it from the inside, there is a very real cultural bias against followers of Christ beginning to permeate our land that simply cannot be denied unless you already have an axe to grind with the religion itself.

[DanTheEldest]

Originally Posted by Krackels

I applaud your for you candor and goodwill.

You're exactly like I would expect an atheist to be.

For the record, I'm completely against censorship as well.

+1 to JeffXD and Krackles on this.

[loonybin]

Originally Posted by bountyhunter

Do I need to remind you that the last four judges to the supreme court (all from GOP nominations) are Roman catholics?

Correction: Ginsberg was nominated by Clinton. not RC. There are 5 Catholics on the SCOTUS, but Kennedy is hardly in line with Catholic teaching. He affirms Roe v. Wade, and sided with those who struck down sodomy laws and appealed to international law to do it! (so much for the sovereignty of our nation's laws...)

And that harriet Meirs, who is herself a devout christian and very conservative, was bounced from nomination simply because she was NOT a roman Catholic

Bounced because she's not Catholic? Please. See Kennedy above. Being Catholic is no guarantee of where they will fall on the issues. And if evangelicals really hold so much sway on the GOP, then why would they have bounced one of their own and supported a couple Catholics?

and could, therefore, not be counted as an automatic vote to repeal the legality of abortion?

You mean repeal a bad ruling that overstepped the authority of the Court and return the legality of abortion to the states where it had been for years? Overturning Roe v. Wade will not suddenly make abortion illegal. It will just return the decision to the states. Roberts and Alito aren't automatic votes to overturn Roe v. Wade. More likely, but then that's what everyone thought of Kennedy.

You think that having the court stacked heavily as it is toward christianity foreshadows a time when Christians will be oppressed?

You can't really be serious.

Considering it's happening at the state level in the schools and local and state legislation enforcing "tolerance" at the expense of free speech based on religious belief, I can believe it could happen eventually, if liberals retain power in our gov't.

There are those who hold influence in our Congress who want "hate crimes" legislation like they have in Canada. There, speaking out against homosexual activity will get you arrested, convicted, and either fined or put in jail (it's already happened).
Schools teaching kids how to pray to Mecca, but won't allow a Christmas song that references Jesus (heck, they won't allow the word "Christmas" because it has religious connotation).
State legislation that requires homosexual indoctrination in grade school (as young as 1st grade!), but won't allow Christian parents to opt out of it.

Philly against the Boy Scouts of America
Judge orders homeschoolers into government education
Christians ordered to pay big bucks for praying!
California Assembly Bill 1056 and the New Definition of Tolerance - Christian Newswire

Will oppression of Christianity definitely happen here? Who knows. If Christians don't stand up now, then it could become more likely.

[FrankW438]

I was raised in a strong Christian family, but my belief structure has recently been challenged. I'm not an atheist, and I'm not quite an agnostic either.

I do believe that most Christian churches have a good belief structure that gives us rules to help us get along in society.

It is the overzealous Christians that really bug the heck out of me. Like the church in Kansas that protests at soldiers funerals over homosexuality in the military. Or the kind that go door-to-door, "witnessing" to you whether you want to or not. Or the kind that told me I was going to hell for reading "The DaVinci Code."

I don't mind someone talking about their beliefs, as long as they aren't forcing them on me or anyone else. That is where their right to free speech ends, in my opinion.

-- Frank

[DanTheEldest]

Originally Posted by FrankW438

It is the overzealous Christians that really bug the heck out of me. Like the church in Kansas that protests at soldiers funerals over homosexuality in the military.

The Bible says "by their fruits you will know them". I personally see none of the fruits of the Spirit in the people from the Westboro Baptist Church, therefore, I have no problem questioning their status as real Christians. That may be just me being "judgmental" again, but calling people f*gs and saying you wished they'd burn in hell tends to shed some clarity on the subject.

[TYFOON]

I fug-ing hate people. We all are elitist in one fashion or another.

But I love my XD family....


he puts down the drink and goes to bed......