More evidence... Jihad not about Policy, but religion. (PV_)

[sammi]

Originally Posted by Judge

It's not really kind of funny, it's true.

I don't, for example, slam the "barbary pirates' for enslaving people - b/c we all know it's wrong and others, even in America, were doing it too.

In medieval times men had much different perspectives, they wre tougher men, tougher more brutal times. Things to them were much more black and white. I won't judge them b/c I wasn't there. In addition, much of what you claim was done by Christians was done by men who hardly knew how to spell Christian, much less professed the faith.

What we do know is that the last 7 years - for example, and we can go back farther, you've not seen Christians strapping on bombs, flying planes into buildings or using children as bombs. You won't find more charitable orginizations than the Christian ones, to every race and nation. You won't see Christian beheading someone who doesn't accept their faith.

There are many differences, you just have to have eyes to see.

Alot of it is media. When it comes to Islam they are quick to make sure to state that "a muslim man today got a parking ticket" but when it comes to somone else they dont mention his religion why is that? Its the sort of hypocracy that I also get when I hear "oh muslim women have to cover up" but they wont say anything about catholic nuns covering up just as modestly or even more than some muslim women do.

Most likely here unlish you have dish, you will not here the other side where muslims including babys and women were beheaded in Indonesia not to many years ago by the minority christians living there. Nor of the christian serbs who massacred thousands of muslims rapping their women and implanting dog semen in them. Or cutting open the bellies of women and removing the baby and squashing its head. You wont here how christians in lebanon marched in sabra and chatila in during the civl war and massacred thousands of inocent men women and children. Nor will you here of Black october where christians went on a rampage killing every muslim they saw on site. Or what about hiroshima and nagasaki? Did we forget that?

You will not find me however nor any one who has the least bit of intellect blaming and poting fingers and a whole religion for this.

You want to have an open mind so where you get your news is important.

[Judge]

Yes, where you get your news from is important....

you talk about the nuns, you'll have to show me the 'catholic' country that pulls the women out and beats them up for not covering up... Like Iran, the Taliban, Hamas are doing. Video provided by youtube. The nuns cover up - not out of shame, but to dress simply, not in fashion, but in plain attire. Same as a priest does. It is part of their office as priest and nuns, not a requirement of their sex for all in the faith.

As far as the beheadings, you've got it backwards - it was the muslims who were beheading the Christian women.

http://www.asianews.it/index.php?l=en&art=5394

It's common for muslims to protest (in the Phillipines, in London, NY) with signs saying 'behead those who insult islam/mohammed. You won't see any Christian parades with the same. Again, they are following mohammed's example where 900 men from Qurayza were led on Mohammed's order to the Market, trenches were douch and the men beheaded while Mohammed watched and cheered. Their wives and children were sold as sex slaves or distributed as gifts among Mohammed's companions, mohammed even chose one of them (Rayhana) for himself.

As far as Sabra and Shatila, they were not conducted by "Christians" but by the Phalange (Kataeb) Party - which is officially secular and by Saad Haddad's SLA. Neither have as their goal the stated intention of enforcing Christian law as both include mostly non-islamic groups and support - including that of "Christians". They had been battleing the PLO and seen many atrocities committed against their families. There was great rage in Lebanaon at this time, but to describe them as a "Christian" army is bogus as hell.

I can't believe you mention Nagasaki and Hiroshima - as if that were a "Christian" massacre. The facts are simple, we were at war with the Japanaese nation. The Japanese people and soldiers had for years been indoctrinated with the idea that American's were evil baby eaters or some such. If we had invaded, the estimated cost in American lives was over 1 million men. What people forget is the estimated Japanese casualties were 2 to 5 million, possibly more. Even the Japanese today admit it was necessary - a politician just stated such a week ago. He caught some heat b/c Japanese socieity doesn't want to deal with that issue anymore, they consider it closed. But our bombing both saved millions of lives and additional years of war and destruction. IT HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THEIR RELIGION OR FORCING THEM TO BECOME CHRISTIAN.

You need new news sources.








(http://www.asianews.it/index.php?l=en&art=5394).

Originally Posted by sammi

Alot of it is media. When it comes to Islam they are quick to make sure to state that "a muslim man today got a parking ticket" but when it comes to somone else they dont mention his religion why is that? Its the sort of hypocracy that I also get when I hear "oh muslim women have to cover up" but they wont say anything about catholic nuns covering up just as modestly or even more than some muslim women do.

Most likely here unlish you have dish, you will not here the other side where muslims including babys and women were beheaded in Indonesia not to many years ago by the minority christians living there. Nor of the christian serbs who massacred thousands of muslims rapping their women and implanting dog semen in them. Or cutting open the bellies of women and removing the baby and squashing its head. You wont here how christians in lebanon marched in sabra and chatila in during the civl war and massacred thousands of inocent men women and children. Nor will you here of Black october where christians went on a rampage killing every muslim they saw on site. Or what about hiroshima and nagasaki? Did we forget that?

You will not find me however nor any one who has the least bit of intellect blaming and poting fingers and a whole religion for this.

You want to have an open mind so where you get your news is important.

[AZXD]

No religion needed, watch the news.
Some a$$hole beats a spouse everyday.

It's all about a$$hole's hiding behind the skirt of religion

Tell me it's not!

[XDinNC]

Originally Posted by sammi

Nor of the christian serbs who massacred thousands of muslims rapping their women and implanting dog semen in them.

Is this similar to the claim that Jews sacrifice Palestinian children and grind their bones to make bread? Don't forget that the Muslims in Bosnia committed the same offenses (killing and rape) against Serbs.

I would like to point out that in most all of the news reports concerning terrorist attacks, the new media never mentions the religion of the perp. Take the recent attacks in the UK - they have called them "militants", "Middle Eastern", etc. without ever mentioning that they could be Muslim.

[leftywa]

Originally Posted by AZXD

No religion needed, watch the news.
Some a$$hole beats a spouse everyday.

It's all about a$$hole's hiding behind the skirt of religion

Tell me it's not!

True enough. But when a$$ is motivated by religion he is usually willing to go farther because he is sure that he is correct. If the guy is the leader of a country or a movement....look out.

[AZXD]

Originally Posted by leftywa

True enough. But when a$$ is motivated by religion he is usually willing to go farther because he is sure that he is correct. If the guy is the leader of a country or a movement....look out.

That's why I devote my life to the religion of a$$ watching

[sammi]

Originally Posted by Judge

Yes, where you get your news from is important....

you talk about the nuns, you'll have to show me the 'catholic' country that pulls the women out and beats them up for not covering up... Like Iran, the Taliban, Hamas are doing. Video provided by youtube. The nuns cover up - not out of shame, but to dress simply, not in fashion, but in plain attire. Same as a priest does. It is part of their office as priest and nuns, not a requirement of their sex for all in the faith.

As far as the beheadings, you've got it backwards - it was the muslims who were beheading the Christian women.

http://www.asianews.it/index.php?l=en&art=5394

It's common for muslims to protest (in the Phillipines, in London, NY) with signs saying 'behead those who insult islam/mohammed. You won't see any Christian parades with the same. Again, they are following mohammed's example where 900 men from Qurayza were led on Mohammed's order to the Market, trenches were douch and the men beheaded while Mohammed watched and cheered. Their wives and children were sold as sex slaves or distributed as gifts among Mohammed's companions, mohammed even chose one of them (Rayhana) for himself.

As far as Sabra and Shatila, they were not conducted by "Christians" but by the Phalange (Kataeb) Party - which is officially secular and by Saad Haddad's SLA. Neither have as their goal the stated intention of enforcing Christian law as both include mostly non-islamic groups and support - including that of "Christians". They had been battleing the PLO and seen many atrocities committed against their families. There was great rage in Lebanaon at this time, but to describe them as a "Christian" army is bogus as hell.

I can't believe you mention Nagasaki and Hiroshima - as if that were a "Christian" massacre. The facts are simple, we were at war with the Japanaese nation. The Japanese people and soldiers had for years been indoctrinated with the idea that American's were evil baby eaters or some such. If we had invaded, the estimated cost in American lives was over 1 million men. What people forget is the estimated Japanese casualties were 2 to 5 million, possibly more. Even the Japanese today admit it was necessary - a politician just stated such a week ago. He caught some heat b/c Japanese socieity doesn't want to deal with that issue anymore, they consider it closed. But our bombing both saved millions of lives and additional years of war and destruction. IT HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THEIR RELIGION OR FORCING THEM TO BECOME CHRISTIAN.

You need new news sources.








(http://www.asianews.it/index.php?l=en&art=5394).

You do not have any sincerity in you whatsoever. Nuns dress the way they do out of modesty. This is the same as muslim women. It is a requirement of their faith to dress modestly. If you look at the supposed picture of the virgin marry she dresses like a muslim women. Why arent you blamming her. And if some people abuse their women you want to blame an entire religion for that? Iran is not even a muslim country so dont even bring that up in here. Hamas is a terrorist organization... why do you always rush for the bad examples when it comes to Islaam? And anywayse, even if it is a terrorist organization, those palestinian women cover up because they believe this is how they should show their modesty. If my wife covers from head to toe, are you going to say i force her? Why dont you ask her why she does it. SHe will reply because i do it to please god. Who gave you the right to be a voice for these muslim women when they dont want your stinky opinions speaking for them. If they are soo scared of wearing muslim clothes, then why is islam the fastest growing religion in the united states, and not only that the majority 6/10 reverts are women. What do you have to say about that? Do your brain a favor and read up on muslim women in islam. Ill give you a head start. http://www.theislamblog.com/archive/...ijab-and-veil/ If you want to make this into a debate of where women have more rights, in the bible or the Quran i would be more than happy to enter into one with you. Because i dont see any rights given to women in your bible on the contrary you guys had to make up your own laws for women because they were just too cruel in the bible.

You completley dismissed the accounts of christian murderers in indonesia and said "ive got it backwards" as if you dont want to admit that it happend. This shows of the biased you have. I didnt say christians do not die in indoneisa but what i provided you with is the other side of the story that you dont here. Look up the slaughtered muslims on the island of Maluku. They were christians and it is a sectarian conflict. You cannot say it wasnt for christianity, because they wouldnt be fighting in the first place.

Again you are using the examples of the khawaarij who are what you call terrorists as your voice peice for islam. If you are still arogantly and stuburnly stuck on this idea then there really isnt any talking with you. Do you even know why they were beheaded, or did you just find that line on the internet without reading the history? Did you know how many years those jews were killing muslims abusing their rights and causing all sorts of problems for the minority muslims? This was a war. By the way, the most painless death you can have is by having your head cutoff, and that was even on fox news. Ofcource not the way the terrorists do it but by one slice of the sword which is the proper way.

Now when you arrogantly without any knowledge started talking about lebanon you have stepped into my area of expertise. I am from lebanon and I think i know my history better then you would I believe. The phalnge are christian terrorists. When you have crosses hanging out of your riffle and supposed pictures of jesus on your tank, and a big red corss on every vehicle marching in the towns of sabra and chatila and masacerring thousands of muslims what else do you call that? Of cource i will not blame christianity for that because i know there are peacfull christians. But maybe they took verses out of the bible out of context like this one..

"And they utterly destroyed all that was in the city, both man and woman, young and old, and ox, and sheep, and ass, with the edge of the sword." Jashua 6:21

This is not the only massacre that was done by christians look up black october as well. Were muslims stopped from their cars talken out along with their familes and slaughtered just for having a muslim name.

The plo did not make its goals to institue islamic law, this is where your ignorance comes in again lumping all muslims in one boat. THe plo is a organization that wanted to atack israel for ocupying thier lands (palestine). They used lebanon as a proxy for that, and that is not correct but to say they wanted to establish an islamic state is bogus for you to say.

Nobody is saying that it is all the christians fault, or all the muslims fault, i do not do this like you do. I look for the truth of the matter whereever it lies. Did muslims commit massacers yes they did. Did christians commit massacers yes they did. But for you to always deny andything that a christian does is from your own stubburnnes. This is what some terrorists do to defend their beliefs what seperates you from them when you act JUST like them.

Using your thinking, since the united states is a majority christian country they attacked hiroshima because they were good christians that wanted to help the world by using their example. And i cant belive you still justified it without saying that it was a mistake. I take it that you agree that killing women and children is ok??? But when muslims killed those adult male jews to protect themselves from there brutality and crimes agains them,, no this is wrong. But nuking an entire country killing babies that had nothing to do with it is OK. Or even using chemicle weopons in Iraq where some of the land there can never be used, and when babies are born deformed every day in the thousands because of these weopons, or when 500,000 innocent civilians died in iraq beccuase of sanctions ..this is OK?? Where is your logic in that?

[Powerman]

Originally Posted by sammi

Nobody is saying that it is all the christians fault, or all the muslims fault, i do not do this like you do. I look for the truth of the matter whereever it lies. Did muslims commit massacers yes they did. Did christians commit massacers yes they did. But for you to always deny andything that a christian does is from your own stubburnnes. This is what some terrorists do to defend their beliefs what seperates you from them when you act JUST like them.

I have seen plenty of propaganda from WWII as depicting Japs as less than human and heathens. Once again we see propaganda of how inhuman and evil Muslim extremists are. Simply being a human enemy of my state is enough for me. I you want to take up arms against me, then get ready for a response. But all this anti Muslim propaganda is sickening.

There is absolutely nothing that one race, ethnicity, or religion has not done. Nothing. All have killed, raped, and mutilated young and old. It is so funny when we point at atrocities and injustices that we have done and show our disgust.

Policy alone is not to blame. If we could go back in time and change our past, there would still be extremists. However, I doubt there would be as many, and I doubt we would have such a huge target on us. To some who believe we are so innocent and have absolutely nothing to do with with what happens in the ME is wrong. To think this is strictly a religious action is, well, stupid.

But to some this is a religious movement. "We will win when we kill them all and Christianize their children." There is no getting through to extremists Sammi. You should know all too well.

[AZXD]

Originally Posted by Powerman

I have seen plenty of propaganda from WWII as depicting Japs as less than human and heathens. Once again we see propaganda of how inhuman and evil Muslim extremists are. Simply being a human enemy of my state is enough for me. I you want to take up arms against me, then get ready for a response. But all this anti Muslim propaganda is sickening.

There is absolutly nothing that one race, ethnicity, or religion has not done. Nothing. All have killed, raped, and mutilated young and old. It is so funny when we point at atrocities and injustices that we have done and show our disgust.

Policy alone is not to blame. If we could go back in time and change our past, there would still be extremists. However, I doubt there would be as many, and I doubt we would have such a huge target on us. To some how believe we are so innocent and have absolutely nothing to do with with what happens in the ME is wrong. To think this is stricktly a religious action is, well, stupid.

But to some this is a religious movement. "We will win when we kill them all and Christianize their children." There is no getting through to extremists Sammi. You should know all too well.

WTF, are you converting

[Judge]

You don't know me, but trust me, I'm sincere.

The picture of the Virigin Mary?? Are you chittin? me?? uh, what camera was it taken with? Do you have a copy of the negative - I'd want to make sure that pic wasn't touched up....

It's simple as far as nuns - Christians don't kill or beat their women who don't wear cover their face. that's why nuns out in public often don't wear their habit, but a simple grey and white dress - with or without scarf or headwear. Next time you see a nun getting slapped around for her attire will be the first time.

Blame an entire religion - for the way it treats women - well, ok. Look at islamic law - if a wife gets a little to fussy, the husband can beat her (verse 34 of al Nisa). That's uplifting. A couple of years ago, there was a multicountry survey, and nearly 1/2 of the moslem women reported being beaten by their husbands. Husbands can engage in polygyny but not the wives. There's more but that's enough for now...

I provided you the links to the Christians being murdered - 3 girls who were Christians were murdered - beheaded...

Yeah, I've seen the stories about the Jews put out by the islamists - they eat moslem children right??? The simple fact is there would be no palestine if it weren't for Israel being kind enough to provide jobs for many of the palestinians. Much of the 'history' moslems study are lies/propaganda to incite hatred and justify using their children as bombers.

You claim Lebanaon is your area of expertise, but you didn't know the Phalange were secular?? What is wrong with this picture? Between the two of us, I'm the only one posting facts which are verifable and links. And you have the pompousness to claim I'm ignorant?? You didn't see me attacking you personally as you have me. Grow up.

"The most painless way you can die is to have your head cut off" - WOW. I'm sure Daniel Pearl's and Berg's screams were fake... That's your definition of 'painless'. Kiss my ass.

Again, you'll have to point out to me how many people Christ murdered or oversaw being tortured and murdered. At the last count - it was zero. For mohammed - it's in the thousands. Uh, big difference. Christians are commanded to love, not murder. Islam/Mohammed commanded the murder of those who would not convert or submit. You see, if you ever read the Bible you would see a progression of grace - from a severe and barbaric law to the grace offered by Christ. There are no murders of 'heathen' in the NT and none the last half of the OT. There is an increasing of knowledge given as as it is given there is more grace shown. That's starkly different than islam.

Read my lips - Hiroshima was no mistake - it saved millions of lives - including women and children, and decades of further suffering with a devastated country. These were two of Japans leading manufacturing cities - for the war. In addition, Japan declared war on us, we didn't attack them unprepared and we didn't single out civilians or women and children, much less force them to be suicide bombers.

The only one to use chemical weapons was your sunni bro Saddam Hussein. And the 500,000 killed is bogus. That would be nearly 400 people killed a day - which there have been very few weeks, much less days where 400 total were killed. In addition, the vast majority of the murders are by your Sunni bro - Al Quaeda, not by our troops or the British or the Polish or the Iraq army. That is why the masses, shia and sunni are turning to us, not to AQ. They know who the evil is. Maybe you need to tap some of your great "info sources" and find out what in the hell is really going on there - for once.

You'll be amazed.

The truth will set you free.

Originally Posted by sammi

You do not have any sincerity in you whatsoever. Nuns dress the way they do out of modesty. This is the same as muslim women. It is a requirement of their faith to dress modestly. If you look at the supposed picture of the virgin marry she dresses like a muslim women. Why arent you blamming her. And if some people abuse their women you want to blame an entire religion for that? Iran is not even a muslim country so dont even bring that up in here. Hamas is a terrorist organization... why do you always rush for the bad examples when it comes to Islaam? And anywayse, even if it is a terrorist organization, those palestinian women cover up because they believe this is how they should show their modesty. If my wife covers from head to toe, are you going to say i force her? Why dont you ask her why she does it. SHe will reply because i do it to please god. Who gave you the right to be a voice for these muslim women when they dont want your stinky opinions speaking for them. If they are soo scared of wearing muslim clothes, then why is islam the fastest growing religion in the united states, and not only that the majority 6/10 reverts are women. What do you have to say about that? Do your brain a favor and read up on muslim women in islam. Ill give you a head start. http://www.theislamblog.com/archive/...ijab-and-veil/ If you want to make this into a debate of where women have more rights, in the bible or the Quran i would be more than happy to enter into one with you. Because i dont see any rights given to women in your bible on the contrary you guys had to make up your own laws for women because they were just too cruel in the bible.

You completley dismissed the accounts of christian murderers in indonesia and said "ive got it backwards" as if you dont want to admit that it happend. This shows of the biased you have. I didnt say christians do not die in indoneisa but what i provided you with is the other side of the story that you dont here. Look up the slaughtered muslims on the island of Maluku. They were christians and it is a sectarian conflict. You cannot say it wasnt for christianity, because they wouldnt be fighting in the first place.

Again you are using the examples of the khawaarij who are what you call terrorists as your voice peice for islam. If you are still arogantly and stuburnly stuck on this idea then there really isnt any talking with you. Do you even know why they were beheaded, or did you just find that line on the internet without reading the history? Did you know how many years those jews were killing muslims abusing their rights and causing all sorts of problems for the minority muslims? This was a war. By the way, the most painless death you can have is by having your head cutoff, and that was even on fox news. Ofcource not the way the terrorists do it but by one slice of the sword which is the proper way.

Now when you arrogantly without any knowledge started talking about lebanon you have stepped into my area of expertise. I am from lebanon and I think i know my history better then you would I believe. The phalnge are christian terrorists. When you have crosses hanging out of your riffle and supposed pictures of jesus on your tank, and a big red corss on every vehicle marching in the towns of sabra and chatila and masacerring thousands of muslims what else do you call that? Of cource i will not blame christianity for that because i know there are peacfull christians. But maybe they took verses out of the bible out of context like this one..

"And they utterly destroyed all that was in the city, both man and woman, young and old, and ox, and sheep, and ass, with the edge of the sword." Jashua 6:21

This is not the only massacre that was done by christians look up black october as well. Were muslims stopped from their cars talken out along with their familes and slaughtered just for having a muslim name.

The plo did not make its goals to institue islamic law, this is where your ignorance comes in again lumping all muslims in one boat. THe plo is a organization that wanted to atack israel for ocupying thier lands (palestine). They used lebanon as a proxy for that, and that is not correct but to say they wanted to establish an islamic state is bogus for you to say.

Nobody is saying that it is all the christians fault, or all the muslims fault, i do not do this like you do. I look for the truth of the matter whereever it lies. Did muslims commit massacers yes they did. Did christians commit massacers yes they did. But for you to always deny andything that a christian does is from your own stubburnnes. This is what some terrorists do to defend their beliefs what seperates you from them when you act JUST like them.

Using your thinking, since the united states is a majority christian country they attacked hiroshima because they were good christians that wanted to help the world by using their example. And i cant belive you still justified it without saying that it was a mistake. I take it that you agree that killing women and children is ok??? But when muslims killed those adult male jews to protect themselves from there brutality and crimes agains them,, no this is wrong. But nuking an entire country killing babies that had nothing to do with it is OK. Or even using chemicle weopons in Iraq where some of the land there can never be used, and when babies are born deformed every day in the thousands because of these weopons, or when 500,000 innocent civilians died in iraq beccuase of sanctions ..this is OK?? Where is your logic in that?