Design of XD45 better than M1911

[Wild Rice]

Being a long term M1911 owner and a recent XD45 (5" Compact) owner, I am now more aware of the M1911's deficiencies. Sorry John Moses Browning, but the XD is a better design.

M1911 deficiencies include:
1. Too small ejection port
2. Difficult to accurately mill barrel lugs
3. Sloppy Barrel bushing fit
4. No loaded chamber indicator (a full length recoil spring guide prevents a "press check")
5. Main spring housing limits back strap grip geometry
6. Low, single-stack ammo capacity
7. Barrel link design has too many variables (hole spacing, hole diameter, clearance, etc)
8. Gun can be unintentionally disabled in panic situations (safety left on, hammer lowered, safety on when chamber empty thus locking slide, pressed out of battery)
9. Requires smithing and extensive reliability testing before it can be trusted
10. Slide stop can be lost in field (has happened to me)
11. Standard recoil guide rod allows recoil spring to bind
12. Grip safety often needs tuning or extra palm swell
13. Plunger tube can fall off
14. Hammer can hit rear slide slot
15. Steel Government model too heavy for concealed carry
16. Unsupported chamber, unramped barrel
17. Slide can lock open with untuned slide stop
18. Parts availability means many used guns are over-smithed and damaged by novices
19. Finicky multi-sourced magazines
20. Non-ambidextrous mag release
21. Single caliber

The XD addresses and improves upon all of these M1911 defects. To Browning's credit, it took almost 100 years to come up with a better design.

[ElrodCod]

Originally Posted by Wild Rice

Being a long term M1911 owner and a recent XD45 (5" Compact) owner, I am now more aware of the M1911's deficiencies. Sorry John Moses Browning, but the XD is a better design.

M1911 deficiencies include:
1. Too small ejection port
2. Difficult to accurately mill barrel lugs
3. Sloppy Barrel bushing fit
4. No loaded chamber indicator (a full length recoil spring guide prevents a "press check")
5. Main spring housing limits back strap grip geometry
6. Low, single-stack ammo capacity
7. Barrel link design has too many variables (hole spacing, hole diameter, clearance, etc)
8. Gun can be unintentionally disabled in panic situations (safety left on, hammer lowered, safety on when chamber empty thus locking slide, pressed out of battery)
9. Requires smithing and extensive reliability testing before it can be trusted
10. Slide stop can be lost in field (has happened to me)
11. Standard recoil guide rod allows recoil spring to bind
12. Grip safety often needs tuning or extra palm swell
13. Plunger tube can fall off
14. Hammer can hit rear slide slot
15. Steel Government model too heavy for concealed carry
16. Unsupported chamber, unramped barrel
17. Slide can lock open with untuned slide stop
18. Parts availability means many used guns are over-smithed and damaged by novices
19. Finicky multi-sourced magazines
20. Non-ambidextrous mag release
21. Single caliber

The XD addresses and improves upon all of these M1911 defects. To Browning's credit, it took almost 100 years to come up with a better design.

Many of the manufacturors of modern 1911s have addressed most of the issues that you've innumerated.

1. There are some out there with GI sized ports but most of the serious players are making the guns w/ lowered & flared ports.
2. This is a non issue with modern computer driven manufacturing processes.
3. Another non issue....the barrel to bushing fit is as good as the barrel to slide fit is on an XD.
4. Press checks are over rated (unless you have OCD). I know when my guns are loaded.
5. There are several options out there if the flat or arched MSH doesn't do it for you.
6. Double stack guns are out there if 8+1 isn't enough for you.
7. And your point about this is??? It's worked for a hundred years.
8. You're really reaching here. These are training issues not gun issues. I'd like to see your documentation about them if you have any.
9. This might have been true 30 years ago but not now. The guns from the top makers have few problems out of the box. The XDs haven't been flawless in their reliability either.
10. Parts can fall off or break on any gun. A weakness in the XD design would be the striker retaining pin. Springfield has said the dry firing should be limited because of this.
11. BS....document it.
12. The evolution of the modern 1911 has already addressed this.
13. This has been known to happen ...that's why the left grip panel is the way it is. Some manufacturors refined the parts to minimized the possibility of this happening.
14. So what!
15. A fully loaded (7 + 1) steel 1911 weighs 46.9 ounces. A fully loaded XD45 service (13 + 1 ) weighs 43.4 ounces for a 3.5 oz. difference. The weight of your compact 5" will depend on which magazine your using. Suck it up big boy ...I know you can do it!
16. It doesn't need either but the option is available.
17. I've never seen or heard of this happening. With any semi-auto the complaint is usually the opposite, i.e., the magazine fails to hold open the slide after the last round is fired.
18. This is true of any gun. Novices shouldn't work on carry guns.
19. Stick to the proven brand names like Wilson, Novak, & Metalform. The aftermarket XD mags can be crap also.
20. You can have it if you really want it.
21. Can be had in 9mm, 38 Super, .40 S&W, .45 ACP and .22lr.

While the XDs are nice guns, it remains to be seen if they'll be around 100 years from now. If the SHTF, my Les Baer TRS will be the gun in my hand.

[Wild Rice]

1. There are some out there with GI sized ports but most of the serious players are making the guns w/ lowered & flared ports.

The originally designed ejection port is too small. It can ding brass, jam when ejecting an unfired round, or lead to a stove pipe jam. I have many 1911's. The ejection port is different on everyone of them. The ejection port of the XD is huge

2. This is a non issue with modern computer driven manufacturing processes.

To make the barrel lug design drop in a variety of guns, there is built in slop. The XD barrel/slide lock up is easier to machine and mass produce with accuracy

3. Another non issue....the barrel to bushing fit is as good as the barrel to slide fit is on an XD.

I have bought new $1,000 1911's with poor bushing fit. The bushing system has many tolerance fits that can add up to a poor fit front barrel fit. Bushing/slide slop + bushing barrel slop = inaccuracy

4. Press checks are over rated (unless you have OCD). I know when my guns are loaded.

Famous last words

5. There are several options out there if the flat or arched MSH doesn't do it for you.

The XD's striker spring is in the slide, not in the back strap, freeing the grip design

6. Double stack guns are out there if 8+1 isn't enough for you.

Original design ammo capacity is quaint by today's standards

7. And your point about this is??? It's worked for a hundred years.

Links, link pins, slide stop holes, and barrel lugs can vary greatly. Browning's improved design (the BHP) went linkless as have almost all modern designs.

8. You're really reaching here. These are training issues not gun issues. I'd like to see your documentation about them if you have any.

In a panic situation, a 1911 may not go bang when you want it to, but this is not unique to the 1911

9. This might have been true 30 years ago but not now. The guns from the top makers have few problems out of the box. The XDs haven't been flawless in their reliability either.

In my experience, every M1911 I have purchased recent or not so recent has needed reliability tuning, testing, tuning, and testing. Para recommend hundreds of rounds for break in.

10. Parts can fall off or break on any gun. A weakness in the XD design would be the striker retaining pin. Springfield has said the dry firing should be limited because of this.

Designs where the dissassembly lever or slide stop are retained make for better field weapons in my opinion. I once lost a slide stop after field stripping at a farm, making the gun useless.

11. BS....document it.

I believe Bill Wilson's book covers this topic

12. The evolution of the modern 1911 has already addressed this.

I have installed many 1911 beavertial grip safeties and all needed reliability tuning. You can't switch fitted 1911 grip safeties between guns and assume normal function.

13. This has been known to happen ...that's why the left grip panel is the way it is. Some manufacturors refined the parts to minimized the possibility of this happening.

The plunger tube has been eliminated (thankfully) from modern gun design (there may be rare exceptions)

14. So what!

The hammer striking the rear slide slot can hinder accuracy in a big way. I have seen this happen with two of my own guns. It is a very under diagnosed cause of inaccuracy. The XD is hammerless

15. A fully loaded (7 + 1) steel 1911 weighs 45.9 ounces. A fully loaded XD45 service (13 + 1 ) weighs 42.4 ounces for a 3.5 oz. difference. Suck it up big boy ...I know you can do it!

There is an entire industry making the GM1911 lighter, smaller, and more appropriate for concealed carry. Note the advent of alloy and polymer frames. The interchangeable 10/13 round magazines of the XD45 Compact is brilliant

16. It doesn't need either but the option is available.

Modern gun designs have supported chambers and ramped barrels. The 1911 was designed for mild hardball. For +P personal defense hollow point ammo, supported chanbers and ramped barrels are better.

17. I've never seen or heard of this happening. With any semi-auto the complaint is usually the opposite, i.e., the magazine fails to hold open the slide after the last round is fired.

Most 1911's I have handled need slide stop dimpling and bullet clearance tuning to prevent unintentional slide stop activation. This is a very common combat modification describe by most 1911 gunsmithing books

18. This is true of any gun. Novices shouldn't work on carry guns.

Used 1911's are the most altered used guns I have seen. If I see any evidence of home gunsmithing, I avoid it

19. Stick to the proven brand names like Wilson, Novak, & Metalform. The aftermarket XD mags can be crap also.

The size, fit, followers, spring tension, and materials differ between the different makes and within each make. I feel more confident sticking to a single source for mags. I have seen expensive 1911's sold with cost cutting cheap mags

20. You can have it if you really want it.

The M1911 was not designed to be ambidextrous, but the XD was. With the XD you don't have to chose right or left. You have both, 100% of the time. This is not a huge issue for me being a righty, but it is important for police department weapons

21. Can be had in 9mm, 38 Super, .40 S&W, .45 ACP and .22lr.

The 1911 was not designed to be a multi caliber weapon, the XD was. 1911 conversions can have reliability problems (often magazine issues) and limited availability

[MasLakas]

It will be interesting to see which design is still around as time goes by. The 1911 is currently made by more companies than twenty years ago and shows no sign of slowing down. The XD, in my opinion, is a perfected glock. I have nothing against glocks, jsut never found one I like enough to purchase.

I own a 45XD Service (primary CCW) and a 1911. I will have the 1911 on my hip when I travel tonight to my mother's place because it is more comfortable when I am driving and easier to draw from a sitting position. I love my XD and carry it when I am not sitting in the car for 2+ hours. That is why there is no nor ever will be a 'perfect' handgun. Alot is up to the personal preferance of the owner.

[spamlovr]

The 1911 will be around for ever because so many parts and accessories are available for it. The XD? Well, we still have to see how long this ride will last. If you look at a Brownell's catalog, you can see why the 1911 is so popular.

You should note I did not say the 1911 is superior, because I don't think it is, on a dollar for dollar basis.

[Loves2Shoot]

The 1911 platform is hard to beat from a performance standpoint, but the really good ones are about 2-3k +. It still does what it was designed to do quite well.

The XD is a great service gun and it appears to be the new big boy on the block as far as sales go as reported by the folks that do such things.

Originally Posted by MasLakas

The XD, in my opinion, is a perfected glock. I have nothing against glocks

Actually, the XD is more of a perfected Sig, as the majority of the design features are taken from the Sig design. That it is black and has a trigger safety are about the only things that are Glockish.

The Ruger SR9 is their attempt at perfecting the Glock it seems.

[fredj338]

I love my XD Tac, but only time will tell if it lasts as long as the 1911 design. The curretn 1911s, are probably the best of the bread, accurate, reliable & shooter friendly. It would be the first gun I grab if my life were on the line (but I do love that XD).

[Palmguy]

I think 1911s are sweet shooters, but if I had to have only one pistol and I was choosing between a 1911 and an XD45, I'd take the XD.

[bkelm18]

Wild Rice, many of your statements are very, VERY thin. Given the choice, I'd choose the 1911 every time. It's a proven platform. The XD is not. Don't get me wrong, I think the XD is a wonderful gun, but it hasn't been around a century and still being mass produced. So what, you're comparing a pistol that was designed what, 10-15 yrs ago to a pistol designed almost 100 yrs ago? Of course there's going to be improvements on the design. It's called progress. But you simply cannot deny the proven track record of the 1911. If it were such a deficient design, it wouldn't still be in mass production almost a century after it was designed.

[spamlovr]

The above statements are true, but some background is necessary.

When teh USA has a gun that they adopt for the .mil, than the gun is also available to other allied countries at bargain basement prices. This allowed the proliferation of the 1911 all over the free world. You get something spread all over the world for relativewly cheap, and there is bound to be great innovation for that thing. Many soldiers kept their 1911's after leaving the .mil after WWII, creating a market for parts and service. There was surplus ammo around, and not many guns to shoot it in other than a 1911. Look at the AR15/M16 and the Berretta 92/M9. They are also damn near everywhere that the USA has allies. The Kalashnikov (AK47) is popular everywhere else because it is easy and cheap to make (stamped sheet metal is easy to acquire, so are cheap barrels and parts kits when compared to the AR15/M16) and no one notices it's accuracy, as it was never meant to be a long range weapon, and it keeps working with little maintenance.

Now, dollar for dollar, you cannot find a new 1911 that will be as versatile as the XD for what I paid for my new XD's. Nope, you can't. Any 1911 that cost less than $500 new I have ever shot would not reliably shoot HP ammo. I have no issues with HP ammo in my XD.

Could that less than $500 1911 be made to shoot HP ammo with 100% reliability? Yup. I don't have to, though. My XD did it out of the box.

Nothing is perfect, but I'm happy with my choices.