POA vs 6 O'Clock Hold - XDTalk Forums - Your HS2000/SA-XD Information Source!

GunWolf · 10-25-2006, 07:11 PM

How do you shoot your XD45 (or other handguns/rifles) and why?

Is one system better than the other for specific purposes in your opinion?

What are the advantages/disadvantages of each (if any) in your opinion?

I shoot everything POA, but I am considering trying 6 O'Clock Hold (never really experimented with it much).

**jonny4523** · 10-25-2006, 07:39 PM

Ok, this sounds really stupid. I've stayed away from the question in fear of being made fun of, but I need to know.

What's the difference? Could someone explain both? I have a certain way I shoot, but I never knew it had a name. If it does have a name, I don't know what it's called. Could someone help me out? I'll vote after I know the difference. Thanks.

**Loves2Shoot** · 10-25-2006, 07:46 PM

Pretty simple really, but not a stupid question.

It is much harder to shoot precisely at POA because your target is BEHIND your front sight, covered up. If you use the 6 O'Clock you can be quite precise because the spot you want to shoot is on the top edge of the sight, which makes it easy to be precise.

GW45NUT · 10-25-2006, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loves2Shoot

Pretty simple really, but not a stupid question.

It is much harder to shoot precisely at POA because your target is BEHIND your front sight, covered up. If you use the 6 O'Clock you can be quite precise because the spot you want to shoot is on the top edge of the sight, which makes it easy to be precise.

Everyone is different. I prefer to hit right on the aim point of my sight, so I prefer a POA. I will adjust if necessary, based on the individual ammunition's point of impact.

Shooter76 · 10-25-2006, 08:07 PM

in the back of the xd manual on springfields site it explains I believe.

http://www.springfield-armory.com/Manuals/XDManual.pdf

**Loves2Shoot** · 10-25-2006, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GW45NUT

Everyone is different. I prefer to hit right on the aim point of my sight, so I prefer a POA. I will adjust if necessary, based on the individual ammunition's point of impact.

Opps, I hope it didn't come across as a better thing, I strictly meant an easier thing.

Preference is personal for sure. For close shooting many people prefer the put the sight on the target approach. Lots of people like to use the FO sights as a "aiming dots" so the POA style works better for that style.

Where the POA becomes ineffective is when the sight is bigger than the target, which is quite common in competition shooting where precision is very important. At common self defense situtation the distances are close enough that the difference between 6 and POA is a non factor on the target.

I think the illustration is a little off for the way most people use it, I generally see people describing the POA a bit lower than the illustration.

GunWolf · 10-25-2006, 09:11 PM

Jonny,

Some people describe 6 O'Clock sight picture as a "pumpkin on a post" sight. Meaning that you imagine the target (the black part) sitting atop the front post sight, much like a pumpkin sits on a post. And the bullet will strike the center of the target (So you could could be aiming maybe 6" lower or whatever depending on what you're shooting and how far). You're not actually putting the sight on the spot where you want to hit, you're putting it below it. You put the pumpkin on the post with the intention of striking the center of the pumpkin even though you are aiming below it. 6 O'Clock hold would work really well with a rifle where your front and rear sights are black and so is the target, because you can't see the sight well when aiming at a black target, but you can if you are aiming at the white part below.

POA means that the exact point of aim is the point of impact (POI), whereas with 6 O'Clock hold the POI will be higher than the point that the top of the sight is at.

I'm not sure exactly what is written in stone about all of this. Obviously if the target (pumpkin) is bigger or smaller it will affect how you aim when using 6 O'Clock. With POA, that is not really a problem because you just always aim at what you want to hit. But as somebody said, POA covers the target.

I generally find myself using the actual dot as my POA, rather than how it is shown in the SA illustration where it's at the top of the sight, so it definitely covers the target.

nickb · 10-25-2006, 09:11 PM

I've felt like my XD's are sighted to POA but I've yet to bench test them. I'll try that when my quick groups are not as good as my slow fire. (I know, maybe an indictment of my trigger slapping, but that's how I shoot)

chupacabrachus · 10-25-2006, 09:45 PM

Depends on the gun. Depends on the sight. My xd shoots 6'ock. My 92 shoots POA. My Taurus shoots POA-ish.

XDAtlanta · 10-26-2006, 06:22 AM

I am used to shooting POA, but it seems that I shoot a better group with my XD if I shoot 6 O'clock. ( I had not even heard of it before I read the manual)

View Poll Results: Which Sight Picture Do You Use?
Point of Aim	50	70.42%
6 O'Clock Hold	21	29.58%
Voters: 71. You may not vote on this poll

10-25-2006, 07:11 PM	#1
GunWolf XDTalk Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 76	POA vs 6 O'Clock Hold How do you shoot your XD45 (or other handguns/rifles) and why? Is one system better than the other for specific purposes in your opinion? What are the advantages/disadvantages of each (if any) in your opinion? I shoot everything POA, but I am considering trying 6 O'Clock Hold (never really experimented with it much).

10-25-2006, 07:39 PM	#2
jonny4523 XDTalk 2K Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Lafayette, IN Posts: 2,040	newby question Ok, this sounds really stupid. I've stayed away from the question in fear of being made fun of, but I need to know. What's the difference? Could someone explain both? I have a certain way I shoot, but I never knew it had a name. If it does have a name, I don't know what it's called. Could someone help me out? I'll vote after I know the difference. Thanks. __________________ -XD40 Service (Feb 2002) Springer Precision Carry Trigger -XD9 Tactical (June 2007) Springer Competition Trigger, USPSA Production -Remington 870 Mag, 12g, my hunting companion -Thompson/Center Triumph (June 2007) -Ruger Mark II (Oct 2004) Gvt Comp Model -AR build (Sept 07 - May 08 ) Mostly RR NRA, USPSA #TY60062 -If guns kill people, then spoons made Rosie O'Donnel fat! -When seconds count, the police are only minutes away

10-25-2006, 07:46 PM	#3
Loves2Shoot XDTalk 2K Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Bend, OR Posts: 2,612	Pretty simple really, but not a stupid question. It is much harder to shoot precisely at POA because your target is BEHIND your front sight, covered up. If you use the 6 O'Clock you can be quite precise because the spot you want to shoot is on the top edge of the sight, which makes it easy to be precise. __________________ www.SpringerPrecision.com The XD Specialists - Our web store is now online!

10-25-2006, 09:11 PM	#7
GunWolf XDTalk Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 76	Jonny, Some people describe 6 O'Clock sight picture as a "pumpkin on a post" sight. Meaning that you imagine the target (the black part) sitting atop the front post sight, much like a pumpkin sits on a post. And the bullet will strike the center of the target (So you could could be aiming maybe 6" lower or whatever depending on what you're shooting and how far). You're not actually putting the sight on the spot where you want to hit, you're putting it below it. You put the pumpkin on the post with the intention of striking the center of the pumpkin even though you are aiming below it. 6 O'Clock hold would work really well with a rifle where your front and rear sights are black and so is the target, because you can't see the sight well when aiming at a black target, but you can if you are aiming at the white part below. POA means that the exact point of aim is the point of impact (POI), whereas with 6 O'Clock hold the POI will be higher than the point that the top of the sight is at. I'm not sure exactly what is written in stone about all of this. Obviously if the target (pumpkin) is bigger or smaller it will affect how you aim when using 6 O'Clock. With POA, that is not really a problem because you just always aim at what you want to hit. But as somebody said, POA covers the target. I generally find myself using the actual dot as my POA, rather than how it is shown in the SA illustration where it's at the top of the sight, so it definitely covers the target. Last edited by GunWolf; 10-25-2006 at 09:17 PM.

10-25-2006, 08:07 PM	#5
Shooter76 XDTalk Newbie Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Missouri Posts: 26	in the back of the xd manual on springfields site it explains I believe. http://www.springfield-armory.com/Manuals/XDManual.pdf

10-25-2006, 09:11 PM	#8
nickb XDTalk 2K Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 2,345	I've felt like my XD's are sighted to POA but I've yet to bench test them. I'll try that when my quick groups are not as good as my slow fire. (I know, maybe an indictment of my trigger slapping, but that's how I shoot)

10-25-2006, 09:45 PM	#9
chupacabrachus XDTalk 3K Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 3,391	Depends on the gun. Depends on the sight. My xd shoots 6'ock. My 92 shoots POA. My Taurus shoots POA-ish.

10-26-2006, 06:22 AM	#10
XDAtlanta XDTalk Newbie Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Atlanta Posts: 16	I am used to shooting POA, but it seems that I shoot a better group with my XD if I shoot 6 O'clock. ( I had not even heard of it before I read the manual) __________________ ____________________________________________ XD45ACP Service

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode