Which night sights: Heinie or XS Big Dot? - Page 4 - XDTalk Forums - Your HS2000/SA-XD Information Source!

dogboy · 04-05-2008, 07:54 PM

Wonder how the XS would work with the smaller dot?

kayl · 04-05-2008, 08:14 PM

I have a set of the big dots on a sig and don't like them; they're dim and not instinctive to aim if you're used to 3 dot sights...

K71BL · 04-05-2008, 08:17 PM

dogboy,

When you go smaller than the Big Dots, you reduce yourself to an ordinary set of sights. Don't let the big dot scare you into thinking you can't hit anything at a distance. These sights work and they work well.

YouTube - XS Sight Demo

and

YouTube - XS Sight Demo II

Mark

**Loves2Shoot** · 04-05-2008, 08:24 PM

I think you have it backwards. XS are a specialized sight for a particular use, see this post for the why:

Refit existing factory barrel for match grade accuracy

ps. If you remove the rear sight on a regular gun, you essentially have an XS sight (minus the trit) it was done long before the XS made sights too.

dogboy · 04-05-2008, 08:30 PM

Who has what backwards?

I'm so confused....

K71BL · 04-05-2008, 08:39 PM

I think he's referring to me, but if you watch the links I put up, the response makes no sense. Now if we're talking COMPETITION, then I'm out. That is it's own world. If we're talking self defense, then big dots are the cats pajamas

.

But remember, opinions are like big toes, we all have at least two. . .. .

dogboy · 04-05-2008, 09:01 PM

Ahhhh... OK.

**Loves2Shoot** · 04-05-2008, 09:03 PM

I was just taking about speed and accuracy, not application.

The XS is more limited than the notch and post sight because you have no vertical reference at the top of the sight, and you can only focus on one point in space at a time. This is the drawback to "balance on" type sights, you must look at two spots in space instead of one to be accurate. This is not faster than getting all your feedback from one point in space like you can get from a notch and post sight.

When you present a pistol the first thing you see is the tip of the front sight and that visual feedback tells you how and were to present the gun. Since the tip of the sight is the basically the SAME on both a notch and post sight and an XS there is nothing physically that makes the XS faster in any application. Aiming the tip of the sight is what you do to be fast AND accurate, not aiming the dot.

With a notch and post you never even need to bring the rear sight into play to make a shot at close distance. It is called shooting the notch. You basically have the same sight picture as an XS sight when you use that technique.

Some people prefer the huge front post and low rear sight for poor vision reasons, and that is valid.

With practice you don't even need sights for combat type shooting, as the slide is enough visual feedback when you open your vision for situational awareness.

ps. If you read my other post you will understand my thoughts on the videos, it is the shooter not the sights, as there are many videos to verify that (search fist fire, where they use no sights.) I've shoot poppers out to 100 yards with no sights personally, just using the slide as a reference.

dogboy · 04-05-2008, 09:16 PM

Thanks L2S. I think I have the idea, now.

I'll probably stick with the factory sights for forever, then figure it out. I've always been intrigued by the Straight-8's, and may go that way when the time comes. Time will tell.... thanks for your patience.

K71BL · 04-05-2008, 09:43 PM

Okay, I'm with you through most of this. I look at the vert. alignment from the other direction (might be cause I'm left handed). Since, in a combat situation, this alignment becomes fairly mute, my brain finds it much easier to "dot the i" than it does trying to "fill the void" between two posts. It's one less piece to the puzzle.

Where I'm TOTALLY in agreement, is on the topic of "needing" sights. I have never been in a stress-fire situation, but do have the benefit of learning from those who have, and a vast majority answer the question of "so do you remember your sight picture at all?" with "sights, what do you mean sights. I pointed and pressed the trigger, that's all I can recall".

So here's my question. If stress-fire really slows us down and gives us tunnel vision, and people such as yourself and James Yeager can shoot and hit pepper poppers at 100 yds with Big Dots or just a slide profile, why do we even mess with putting $100 + worth of technology on the end of our pistols, argue about which is best (guilty), only to not use, or even see them when we need them most? I think, at times, that I would much prefer to not have any sight at all on my defensive weapon, but something inside calls me a lunatic.

Well, I think I've talked myself into a corner, so I'll go now and wait for the paddie wagon . . . .

View Poll Results: Which 2 dot night sights to use?
XS Big Dot tritium night sights	20	55.56%
Heinie Straight 8 Slant Pro	16	44.44%
Voters: 36. You may not vote on this poll

04-05-2008, 08:14 PM	#32
kayl XDTalk 1K Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: WI Posts: 1,252	I have a set of the big dots on a sig and don't like them; they're dim and not instinctive to aim if you're used to 3 dot sights... __________________ Have you talked to your XD today?

04-05-2008, 08:24 PM	#34
Loves2Shoot XDTalk 2K Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Bend, OR Posts: 2,844	I think you have it backwards. XS are a specialized sight for a particular use, see this post for the why: Refit existing factory barrel for match grade accuracy ps. If you remove the rear sight on a regular gun, you essentially have an XS sight (minus the trit) it was done long before the XS made sights too. __________________ www.SpringerPrecision.com The XD Specialists - Our web store is now online! Last edited by Loves2Shoot; 04-05-2008 at 08:28 PM.

04-05-2008, 09:03 PM	#38
Loves2Shoot XDTalk 2K Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Bend, OR Posts: 2,844	I was just taking about speed and accuracy, not application. The XS is more limited than the notch and post sight because you have no vertical reference at the top of the sight, and you can only focus on one point in space at a time. This is the drawback to "balance on" type sights, you must look at two spots in space instead of one to be accurate. This is not faster than getting all your feedback from one point in space like you can get from a notch and post sight. When you present a pistol the first thing you see is the tip of the front sight and that visual feedback tells you how and were to present the gun. Since the tip of the sight is the basically the SAME on both a notch and post sight and an XS there is nothing physically that makes the XS faster in any application. Aiming the tip of the sight is what you do to be fast AND accurate, not aiming the dot. With a notch and post you never even need to bring the rear sight into play to make a shot at close distance. It is called shooting the notch. You basically have the same sight picture as an XS sight when you use that technique. Some people prefer the huge front post and low rear sight for poor vision reasons, and that is valid. With practice you don't even need sights for combat type shooting, as the slide is enough visual feedback when you open your vision for situational awareness. ps. If you read my other post you will understand my thoughts on the videos, it is the shooter not the sights, as there are many videos to verify that (search fist fire, where they use no sights.) I've shoot poppers out to 100 yards with no sights personally, just using the slide as a reference. __________________ www.SpringerPrecision.com The XD Specialists - Our web store is now online! Last edited by Loves2Shoot; 04-05-2008 at 09:07 PM.

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04-05-2008, 07:54 PM	#31
dogboy XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 164	Wonder how the XS would work with the smaller dot?

04-05-2008, 08:17 PM	#33
K71BL XDTalk Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 95	dogboy, When you go smaller than the Big Dots, you reduce yourself to an ordinary set of sights. Don't let the big dot scare you into thinking you can't hit anything at a distance. These sights work and they work well. YouTube - XS Sight Demo and YouTube - XS Sight Demo II Mark

04-05-2008, 08:30 PM	#35
dogboy XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 164	Who has what backwards? I'm so confused....

04-05-2008, 08:39 PM	#36
K71BL XDTalk Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 95	I think he's referring to me, but if you watch the links I put up, the response makes no sense. Now if we're talking COMPETITION, then I'm out. That is it's own world. If we're talking self defense, then big dots are the cats pajamas . But remember, opinions are like big toes, we all have at least two. . .. .

04-05-2008, 09:01 PM	#37
dogboy XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 164	Ahhhh... OK.

04-05-2008, 09:16 PM	#39
dogboy XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 164	Thanks L2S. I think I have the idea, now. I'll probably stick with the factory sights for forever, then figure it out. I've always been intrigued by the Straight-8's, and may go that way when the time comes. Time will tell.... thanks for your patience.

04-05-2008, 09:43 PM	#40
K71BL XDTalk Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 95	Okay, I'm with you through most of this. I look at the vert. alignment from the other direction (might be cause I'm left handed). Since, in a combat situation, this alignment becomes fairly mute, my brain finds it much easier to "dot the i" than it does trying to "fill the void" between two posts. It's one less piece to the puzzle. Where I'm TOTALLY in agreement, is on the topic of "needing" sights. I have never been in a stress-fire situation, but do have the benefit of learning from those who have, and a vast majority answer the question of "so do you remember your sight picture at all?" with "sights, what do you mean sights. I pointed and pressed the trigger, that's all I can recall". So here's my question. If stress-fire really slows us down and gives us tunnel vision, and people such as yourself and James Yeager can shoot and hit pepper poppers at 100 yds with Big Dots or just a slide profile, why do we even mess with putting $100 + worth of technology on the end of our pistols, argue about which is best (guilty), only to not use, or even see them when we need them most? I think, at times, that I would much prefer to not have any sight at all on my defensive weapon, but something inside calls me a lunatic. Well, I think I've talked myself into a corner, so I'll go now and wait for the paddie wagon . . . .