Deepen Gun Ownership

[Etta Place]

I don't know if this has been posted here before, but I wondered what you guys thought about this guy's proposal.

Issue #8, Spring 2008
Deepen Gun Ownership
by Jim Kessler


In recent election cycles, the greatest feat of liberal tight-rope walking has occurred not over abortion, but gun safety. Candidates talk about renewing the assault weapons ban, then mumble something about the rights of hunters. But there is a better way to take on this issue–one that would yield real reductions in violence without adversely impacting law-abiding gun owners.

There are 280 million firearms in private hands in America, and last year there were about 300,000 gun crimes. That means that at least 279,700,000 guns did nothing wrong. We also know that in 89 percent of crimes, the person using the gun was not the person who originally bought it. In 34 percent of crimes, the firearm was bought in one state and used in a crime in another. And in 32 percent of crimes, the firearm was less than three years old.

This indicates that the root of America’s gun crime problem is not the number of guns in the hands of Americans, but an extensive web of gun trafficking operations that funnel firearms to criminals. In some cases, the trafficking operations cover long distances. Nearly 40 percent of all crime guns recovered in New Jersey and New York came from Virginia, Georgia, Florida, and the Carolinas. Nine out of 10 crime guns changed hands between the first purchase (which was likely legal) to the last purchase (which was certainly illegal). What we need, then, is a new national strategy to reduce gun violence: Don’t restrict gun rights, but instead deepen the sense of gun ownership.

The first step is to make gun trafficking a federal crime, not a term of art. There is only one statute on the federal books that deals even indirectly with gun trafficking–a vague, loophole-ridden law that allows only federally licensed gun stores "to engage in the business" of dealing in firearms. Since federal law allows any individual to sell his or her own firearms to anyone else, the "engaged in the business" bar is virtually insurmountable. And since any individual may also sell firearms without performing a background check, asking for identification, or keeping any sort of record, the requirement that individuals not knowingly sell to criminals is merely a suggestion. That is why federal prosecutors in 29 states filed five or fewer cases related to trafficking behavior over a recent three-year period.

Trafficking should be redefined as selling multiple guns out of a home, car, street, or park that have two or more of the following characteristics: obliterated serial numbers, are stolen, are new in the box, or are sold to underage buyers or people with felony records. This would still allow individuals to privately sell firearms to people they know or trust, and it would put the onus on sellers to demand a background check for those they don’t.

Beyond the new law, finding traffickers isn’t that hard. Investigators can readily aggregate the crime gun trace data that we now have–data that identifies the original buyers and sellers of hundreds of thousands of guns later used in crime. They will discover that about 1 percent of the nation’s gun stores are the source of more than half of the nation’s crime guns. And they will discover that a select group of individuals repeatedly turn up as the original purchasers of guns later linked to crimes. This is not a quirk of fate; these people are gun traffickers.

Moreover, investigators can easily check every gun recovered in a crime against the National Stolen Firearms Registry, which contains the serial numbers of two million stolen guns. Under federal law, possession of a stolen firearm adds five years to a prison sentence. True, the criminal apprehended with a stolen gun is usually not the person who lifted it. But those five years are a great bargaining chip–one state and federal prosecutors consistently leave on the table–to determine the person who actually sold the criminal the gun. Play the same game with obliterated serial numbers–another five-year penalty under federal law. An obliterated serial number hides the trafficker and provides no benefit to the person using the gun in a violent crime.

Finally, we need to close the gun-show loophole. It is no coincidence that 13 of the top 14 crime-gun-exporting states do not require background checks for sales at shows. This loophole is exploited by buyers who obtain used guns to resell on the streets.

What ultimately matters isn’t the number of guns. It’s the number of bad people who have them. With a national firearms trafficking strategy, we can pull the roots out of the illegal operations that kill and destroy people and communities.

Democracy Journal Search

[LUVMYSIGP225]

At risk of catching hell, I agree with much of this.

[AwPhuch]

Yoohoo..where do you think criminals get their guns...

They steal them...they don't go trotting into a gun show...then slap down a drivers license to be run thru NICS...because it will flag them as a "Do not sell"

Did you know that all display sellers (the guys sitting behind a bench with thier array of firearms layed out) have to run a NICS check just as if you walked into a gun store?!?

Now face to face and straw sales happen..but normally criminals dont go to gun shows...they can steal them much easier than trying to walk past about 5 cops at the front desk checking CHL'er firearms

If guns caused crimes..wouldn't a gun show be the most freeking dangerous place on earth?!?

Here ya go Etta..stuff this in your pipe and smoke it

Gun Facts - Your guide for debunking gun control myth

here is the screen version...ready for you to browse thru
http://www.gunfacts.info/pdfs/gun-fa...5-0-screen.pdf

And per the 10th Amendment....the power to regulate gun sales is ACTUALLY reserved for the states to decide

What we need, then, is a new national strategy to reduce gun violence: Don’t restrict gun rights, but instead deepen the sense of gun ownership.

Yah...how about reduce criminal violence..as in using the laws already on the books and punishing them...aka..you shoot someone in a robbery...you get injected and take a dirt nap...stop babying criminals...stick them in hot prisons with no ac, no tv, no electricity and make their lives HELL (take the tens of thousands of dollars a year to support/house/comfortably each individual prisoner and put it to some better good)...so when they get out..they don't want to do crime and go back...crime control..not gun control!

[Etta Place]

Originally Posted by AwPhuch

Yoohoo..where do you think criminals get their guns...

They steal them...they don't go trotting into a gun show...then slap down a drivers license to be run thru NICS...because it will flag them as a "Do not sell"

Did you know that all display sellers (the guys sitting behind a bench with thier array of firearms layed out) have to run a NICS check just as if you walked into a gun store?!?

Now face to face and straw sales happen..but normally criminals dont go to gun shows...they can steal them much easier than trying to walk past about 5 cops at the front desk checking CHL'er firearms

If guns caused crimes..wouldn't a gun show be the most freeking dangerous place on earth?!?

Here ya go Etta..stuff this in your pipe and smoke it

Gun Facts - Your guide for debunking gun control myth

here is the screen version...ready for you to browse thru
http://www.gunfacts.info/pdfs/gun-fa...5-0-screen.pdf

And per the 10th Amendment....the power to regulate gun sales is ACTUALLY reserved for the states to decide


Yah...how about reduce criminal violence..as in using the laws already on the books and punishing them...aka..you shoot someone in a robbery...you get injected and take a dirt nap...stop babying criminals...stick them in hot prisons with no ac, no tv, no electricity and make their lives HELL (take the tens of thousands of dollars a year to support/house/comfortably each individual prisoner and put it to some better good)...so when they get out..they don't want to do crime and go back...crime control..not gun control!

Did you see this part?

Finally, we need to close the gun-show loophole. It is no coincidence that 13 of the top 14 crime-gun-exporting states do not require background checks for sales at shows. This loophole is exploited by buyers who obtain used guns to resell on the streets.

[R Dub]

Finally, we need to close the gun-show loophole. It is no coincidence that 13 of the top 14 crime-gun-exporting states do not require background checks for sales at shows. This loophole is exploited by buyers who obtain used guns to resell on the streets.

I think public execution would do the trick!

[AZXD]

Originally Posted by R Dub

I think public execution would do the trick!

YEP!!
Put it on Pay-Per-View ... They'd be able to recover the cost for whatever method was used ... Bang the gavel and grab a rope ... Coming down hard on Gun crime is OK in my book ... Fry Em!!

[afmo]

Actually, i agree with this...

I'm sorry, there shouldn't be a sale of a firearm that doesn't require a background check. I think the fee should be removed because it amounts to a "tax" on a constitutional right, but there should not be an instance where a person can go purchase a firearm without a background check.

NICS is not a burden on the buyer. I'm sure people woudl be glad to kill the time waiting for the check to come back browsing the gun store or gun show.

requiring a background check is not gun control IMO.

[ForTehNguyen]

i can sell a car without a background check even tho they kill many times more people than guns do

[afmo]

Originally Posted by ForTehNguyen

i can sell a car without a background check even tho they kill many times more people than guns do

cars aren't designed to kill

[AZXD]

Originally Posted by afmo

cars aren't designed to kill

Tell that to the victim of a drunk driver ... It's never the fault of a piece of machinery.

Wanna try for a psychological exam to make a purchase ??
How about DNA ??

I prefer that we stop supporting invasions into peoples private affairs, and start getting tough on the people who do harm to others ??