California foreclosure "surge": Up 327% from '07 levels

[afmo]

Originally Posted by bountyhunter

You know what's hard to explain Brickboy?

How it is people who don't know any more about california housing than an artichoke knows about brain surgery can delight in making such callous and ignorant generalizations.

People out here want what anybody wants: to own a house their family can live in. It jusy so happens that it takes two working parents to do that and if anything goes wrong on the job scene they can rapidly lose their homes.

I'll have to quit subscribing to this thread because all the compassion flowing from the "compassionate conservatives" is making my heart get too warm...

karma gets around, hope you never need any help in your life. If you do, don't bother asking a conservative... you'll just get a lecture on living within your means.

well, i'm in california, and the job market is fine unless your in construction or real estate. I already said it earlier in this thread, the unemployment rate does not back up your accusation that lost jobs are to blame for people losing their homes. What i've seen here in california is a housing market boom that banks went nuts over, started qualifying people based on teaser interest rates, and now they can't afford what they purchased. You claim that peope here want "what everyone wants." yeah, i want a house too, but i'm realistic enough to realize that i can't afford one, so i live in an apartment. a little over a year ago, when everyone was going nuts over buying homes, i got an offer from our bank for a 300k home loan. I was smart enough to realize that i could afford that loan for the 5 year interest only or whatever it was, and then i'd be screwed. I have zero sympathy for people who weren't smart enough to realize that if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is....so they bought 200k homes for 400+k and now they are screwed over...

You've let emotions cloud your judgment.

[Brickboy240]

Yep...lighten up...I was not ragging on CA in general.

However, living within one's means is one thing that I think makes me a conservative. I am actually trying to...well...CONSERVE! Imagine that.

I never said anything about not helping people that are down and out and in trouble. However, most that are losing their homes...as tragic as the stories are...should have NEVER bought what they bought. Now, they need to face the music. This should not be my fault or my problem. I do not live this way, because I know good and well that things like THAT can happen.

Have I ever made bad decisions? Sure, but I learned from them, paid my dues and did NOT go crying to others for help. I took my lumps and moved on. I also tried like hell to make sure these things did NOT happen to me again.

You're right...I have been lucky and I do hope I never need anyone's help. I have tried to design our lifestyle so that we have a cushion against hard knocks because at some time, its going to rain. If others decide to not do research or heed warnings or not prepare for possible disruptions in their incomes...I don't feel this is my fault or obligation to bail them out.

Everyone could learn a lesson by living within or below ones means, but go ahead and call me coldhearted becaue I don't want to bail out those that choose to live irresponsibly.

Again..like 99% of what ails our society...a healthy dose of personal responsiblilty and restraint will go a long ways. That used to be the foundation of what we call conservatism, but it has gotten lost in our rabid consumer "gotta have everything now" society.

- Brickboy240

[bountyhunter]

Originally Posted by afmo

well, i'm in california, and the job market is fine unless your in construction or real estate. I already said it earlier in this thread, the unemployment rate does not back up your accusation that lost jobs are to blame for people losing their homes. What i've seen here in california is a housing market boom that banks went nuts over, started qualifying people based on teaser interest rates, and now they can't afford what they purchased. You claim that peope here want "what everyone wants." yeah, i want a house too, but i'm realistic enough to realize that i can't afford one, so i live in an apartment. .

And you will until the day you die.

You people just don't get it: you spout the mantrah of "those stupid people should not buy homes until they are sure they can afford it." Under those guidelines, the vast majority of working class families will NEVER own a home and you won't either.

KNOW WHY?

Because as you rent you are simply burning money in rent, and your wealth will never accumulate fast enough to "catch" the housing market which is accelerating away from you. Every working class couple I know or knew with both parents working really had to STRETCH to get into a home, and that hasn't changed.

We were lucky having two good incomes and no kids, we were better off than most. We still had to raid every account we had, including our IRA's and borrow some from relatives. We made it into our house and one month later my company laid off half it's employees... but not me. We dodged a bullet.

The whole point of this thread is the arrogant, condescending neocon BS about how all these STUPID PEOPLE jumped into houses they couldn't afford... well guess what, about 99% of working class people in kali can't SAFELY afford a house and the only way they get into one is to bite off a big mortgage loan and pray for the grace of God. And working 20 years renting won't help, it actually makes them sink farther down towards the lower middle class range where they will NEVER afford a house.

And FYI, poor people can only get into variable rate loans. The lenders jack the "up front" points very high on fixed rate loans to keep people from getting them. We barely got into one.

If the banks qualified people for loans they couldn't afford, THEN BEAT ON THE BANKS. People are not finacial experts. If Chevrolet started putting defective starters and water pumps in all their new cars, would you blame the people who bought them for not knowing that ahead of time? Blame the greedy lenders if you want, but quit bashing people for buying houses with the only loans they could get into.

[bountyhunter]

Originally Posted by afmo

well, i'm in california, and the job market is fine unless your in construction or real estate. .

RIGHT.......

You may want to retract that post... or all of them.

Friday, April 18, 2008

California Unemployment Increases Sharply




From the LA Times: California unemployment hits 6.2%; worse than Ohio, Pennsylvania

California's unemployment rate rose by a whopping half a percentage point in March, reaching 6.2% as a weakening economy shed jobs in the ailing construction and financial activities sectors. In all, 1.13 million were unemployed.

...

California is doing worse than Pennsylvania and Ohio ... the two Rust Belt states that have figured prominently in the presidential primary elections because of their lost manufacturing jobs.

Originally Posted by afmo

You've let emotions cloud your judgment.

Actually, it's facts that guide my judgement, Try it some time.

[XDConvert9mm]

Originally Posted by bountyhunter

And you will until the day you die.

You people just don't get it: you spout the mantrah of "those stupid people should not buy homes until they are sure they can afford it." Under those guidelines, the vast majority of working class families will NEVER own a home and you won't either.

KNOW WHY?

Because as you rent you are simply burning money in rent, and your wealth will never accumulate fast enough to "catch" the housing market which is accelerating away from you. Every working class couple I know or knew with both parents working really had to STRETCH to get into a home, and that hasn't changed.

We were lucky having two good incomes and no kids, we were better off than most. We still had to raid every account we had, including our IRA's and borrow some from relatives. We made it into our house and one month later my company laid off half it's employees... but not me. We dodged a bullet.

The whole point of this thread is the arrogant, condescending neocon BS about how all these STUPID PEOPLE jumped into houses they couldn't afford... well guess what, about 99% of working class people in kali can't SAFELY afford a house and the only way they get into one is to bite off a big mortgage loan and pray for the grace of God. And working 20 years renting won't help, it actually makes them sink farther down towards the lower middle class range where they will NEVER afford a house.

And FYI, poor people can only get into variable rate loans. The lenders jack the "up front" points very high on fixed rate loans to keep people from getting them. We barely got into one.

If the banks qualified people for loans they couldn't afford, THEN BEAT ON THE BANKS. People are not finacial experts. If Chevrolet started putting defective starters and water pumps in all their new cars, would you blame the people who bought them for not knowing that ahead of time? Blame the greedy lenders if you want, but quit bashing people for buying houses with the only loans they could get into.

Since you're not the person who originally posted this thread I'll just go ahead and not take your word for the purpose of it.

Blame the banks and not the people, huh? I think that call needs to be made on a case by case basis, not with your blanket statements. The Chevy analogy, again, does not fit this discussion, IMO.

Oh, and do you have any backup for the top bolded portion of your statement above? I'd be interested to see any facts that back up this 99% claim. Maybe the insertion of ALL CAPS and exclaimation points!!! and bolding is enough to turn your opinions into fact?

I eagerly await your response. Thank you.

[longtalltechsan]

Originally Posted by bountyhunter

And you will until the day you die.

You people just don't get it: you spout the mantrah of "those stupid people should not buy homes until they are sure they can afford it." Under those guidelines, the vast majority of working class families will NEVER own a home and you won't either.

KNOW WHY?

Because as you rent you are simply burning money in rent, and your wealth will never accumulate fast enough to "catch" the housing market which is accelerating away from you. Every working class couple I know or knew with both parents working really had to STRETCH to get into a home, and that hasn't changed.

We were lucky having two good incomes and no kids, we were better off than most. We still had to raid every account we had, including our IRA's and borrow some from relatives. We made it into our house and one month later my company laid off half it's employees... but not me. We dodged a bullet.

The whole point of this thread is the arrogant, condescending neocon BS about how all these STUPID PEOPLE jumped into houses they couldn't afford... well guess what, about 99% of working class people in kali can't SAFELY afford a house and the only way they get into one is to bite off a big mortgage loan and pray for the grace of God. And working 20 years renting won't help, it actually makes them sink farther down towards the lower middle class range where they will NEVER afford a house.

And FYI, poor people can only get into variable rate loans. The lenders jack the "up front" points very high on fixed rate loans to keep people from getting them. We barely got into one.

If the banks qualified people for loans they couldn't afford, THEN BEAT ON THE BANKS. People are not finacial experts. If Chevrolet started putting defective starters and water pumps in all their new cars, would you blame the people who bought them for not knowing that ahead of time? Blame the greedy lenders if you want, but quit bashing people for buying houses with the only loans they could get into.

If people really want to buy a house then they should do it elsewhere, like another state where they can get a decent house for a good price, not just say, "oh well, nobody else can afford their house, why not join them?" That is absurd. If it is that bad, people should move.

When I moved to AZ 3 years ago, we couldn't afford a house unless we got an interest only loan or an ARM. I am not stupid so we didn't buy one. And I thank my lucky stars everyday. I would be upside down if I had bought. Now we are looking at a great time to buy. Nobody forced these people to buy a house when they did and nobody put a gun to their heads to live in California. If it is that bad and you really want a house, then you move to a place that is affordable.

[AZXD]

Originally Posted by longtalltechsan

If people really want to buy a house then they should do it elsewhere, like another state where they can get a decent house for a good price, not just say, "oh well, nobody else can afford their house, why not join them?" That is absurd. If it is that bad, people should move.

When I moved to AZ 3 years ago, we couldn't afford a house unless we got an interest only loan or an ARM. I am not stupid so we didn't buy one. And I thank my lucky stars everyday. I would be upside down if I had bought. Now we are looking at a great time to buy. Nobody forced these people to buy a house when they did and nobody put a gun to their heads to live in California. If it is that bad and you really want a house, then you move to a place that is affordable.

Uh .... By that rational .... I suppose people should move to where the work is when they get laid-off and discover no one in the area is hiring

[longtalltechsan]

Originally Posted by AZXD

Uh .... By that rational .... I suppose people should move to where the work is when they get laid-off and discover no one in the area is hiring

Forgive me for not saying that one should find a job in an affordable place and then move there. Not every place that is affordable has no job openings.

[AZXD]

Originally Posted by longtalltechsan

Forgive me for not saying that one should find a job in an affordable place and then move there. Not every place that is affordable has no job openings.

The most memorable assignment from my first econ class involved choosing three locations and determining the validity of accepting a job offer at each location. Prior to the assignment, I had been lucky to land in locations where I could survive.
Beautiful beaches are nice to look at, but of little value if you need to sleep on the beach ... ALL THE TIME.

So to clarify, I agree .... If the job market dries up, stay and struggle, or move and hopefully improve.

[aeneas26]

Real estate prices on both coasts are astronomical. It would be tough to own a home out there unless you were well off financially. But I don't think that is a great reason to over-extend yourself on a home loan.

If owning a home is important (and I am not sure it really is) then I would think that people should exercise patience and wait until they can afford a house safely. Get a second job, get a better paying job, live frugally. In short, do whatever you need to do to buy a home without exposing yourself to unnecessary risk. And if someone is entirely dependent on their income from their job, I would make sure that I am properly insured. In business, you expose yourself to risk on an almost daily basis. But good businesspeople learn how to minimize their risk as much as possible.

Hopefully the market is allowed to work and home prices come down to affordable levels for working class people. I doubt that could ever happen if there is a gov't bailout. A bailout would probably just prop up the inflated prices. Bubbles need to burst; it is part of having a dynamic economy. Unfortunately that means some people are going to feel a little bit of pain.

Losing a house is not the end of the world for anyone. It is not like losing a child, or anything of real importance. If a situation like this is painful then there is probably a worthwhile lesson to be learned from it. Even if the truth seems harsh and painful, there is a lot of value in learning how to minimize risk to your personal finances.