"The wealthy need to pay their share of taxes"...huh? - XDTalk Forums - Your HS2000/SA-XD Information Source!

Brickboy240 · 04-21-2008, 09:56 AM

Myth:

The rich are hiding their wealth from the taxman, get all sorts of breaks and need to pay their fair share of taxes.

(as repeated by Hillary and Obama over and over again...)

Truth:

The top 25% of wage earners pay 86% of all Federal Income Taxes.

The top 50% of wage earners pay 97% of all Federal Income Taxes.

The top 1% of wage earners pay 39% of all Federal Income Taxes.

(looks like the wealthy are shouldering almost ALL the income tax burden!)

meanwhile....
The bottom 25% of wage earners pay NO Federal Income Taxes at all.

Source?

http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/wp1.pdf

So...when they start this "rich need to pay their fair share" garbage...think of these stats, because it looks like the wealthy and the upper middle class shoulder almost all the income tax burden and the left has the tax issue completely backwards.

Many of you probably already knew this and I find it amazing that Hillary and Obama still use the "tax breaks for the wealthy" montra to whip up their base. I would guess that their base is completely ignorant on who really shoulders the tax burden in the United States.

- Brickboy240

FrankRizzoXD40 · 04-21-2008, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brickboy240

I would guess that their base is completely ignorant on who really shoulders the tax burden in the United States.

I think your guess is right.

This information regarding who bears the majority of the tax burden in this country has been relaltively consistent for the last several years. The top 50% of wage earners have been paying over 90% of the income taxes for a long time now.

Yet the modern-liberals are somehow able to fool people over and over.

Rhetoric has the facts in the eyes of many in the democrat base.

Frank

Brickboy240 · 04-21-2008, 10:09 AM

What kills me is why the left acts so shocked that wealthy people benefit from tax cuts. Hello! They're paying the higher percentages of the tax bill...who do you think should benefit from a cut? The payers! The poor don't care about tax cuts because...surprise! They don't pay any income taxes at all.

(by large, the poor also don't vote en masse...but thats another post)

Then, another popular notion tossed around by the left is that tax cuts hurt the poor. How? If you don't pay any income taxes to begin with...how will a cut to those that DO pay taxes affect you? True, tax cuts do not HELP the poor...but they don't HURT them, either. What nonsense this is.

Its amazing how the masses soak up all this garbage and accept it as the gospel truth when the left has the income tax issue completely backwards. Proof positive that class warfare and clas envy are still powerful tools in the left's political bag of tricks.

Bottom line: most of what ails the nation, money-wise, can be fixed not by asking the wealthy to pay more income taxes but by reigning in spending. But when have you seen any politician do this in either party? Rarely if ever.

- Brickboy240

kannibul · 04-21-2008, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brickboy240

Myth:

The rich are hiding their wealth from the taxman, get all sorts of breaks and need to pay their fair share of taxes.

(as repeated by Hillary and Obama over and over again...)

Truth:

The top 25% of wage earners pay 86% of all Federal Income Taxes.

The top 50% of wage earners pay 97% of all Federal Income Taxes.

The top 1% of wage earners pay 39% of all Federal Income Taxes.

(looks like the wealthy are shouldering almost ALL the income tax burden!)

meanwhile....
The bottom 25% of wage earners pay NO Federal Income Taxes at all.

Source?

http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/wp1.pdf

So...when they start this "rich need to pay their fair share" garbage...think of these stats, because it looks like the wealthy and the upper middle class shoulder almost all the income tax burden and the left has the tax issue completely backwards.

Many of you probably already knew this and I find it amazing that Hillary and Obama still use the "tax breaks for the wealthy" montra to whip up their base. I would guess that their base is completely ignorant on who really shoulders the tax burden in the United States.

- Brickboy240

Sure, when you consider the dollar having a flat value across the board.

Lets take tax off the table.

I have $100. You have $1.

We both go to McDonalds. I order something off the Dollar menu, and you order something off the dollar menu.

Who does that dollar mean more to? Who felt that cost more?

Because it's based on percentages, of course people who have more, pay more. However, when you consider that the value of a dollar for a person who has billions and recieves $200K/yr on interest alone, versus someone who earns $50K/yr working their butts off -the value of the dollar is NOT equal - thus, taxation on that dollar should also not be equal.

What gets me is the people who DON'T pay taxes AND have the money and the means to pay their share...

Palmguy · 04-21-2008, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kannibul

Sure, when you consider the dollar having a flat value across the board.

Lets take tax off the table.

I have $100. You have $1.

We both go to McDonalds. I order something off the Dollar menu, and you order something off the dollar menu.

Who does that dollar mean more to? Who felt that cost more?

Because it's based on percentages, of course people who have more, pay more. However, when you consider that the value of a dollar for a person who has billions and recieves $200K/yr on interest alone, versus someone who earns $50K/yr working their butts off -the value of the dollar is NOT equal - thus, taxation on that dollar should also not be equal.

What gets me is the people who DON'T pay taxes AND have the money and the means to pay their share...

Bottom line: punish people for being successful?

east_stingray · 04-21-2008, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brickboy240

Then, another popular notion tossed around by the left is that tax cuts hurt the poor. How? If you don't pay any income taxes to begin with...how will a cut to those that DO pay taxes affect you? True, tax cuts do not HELP the poor...but they don't HURT them, either. What nonsense this is.

- Brickboy240

You're not looking at the whole picture. Tax cuts DO hurt the poor, because they're not, as you asserted, paying 0 tax. They're actually paying NEGATIVE taxes, because even those who don't pay anything receive money from government programs. That money comes from taxing the rich (the "payers").

So, tax cuts DO impact the poor, because it lessens the amount of money available for their handouts (I don't actually believe this, since gov't revenue goes up with tax cuts, but that's the argument).

one-eyed-fatman · 04-21-2008, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Palmguy

Bottom line: punish people for being successful?

YES!

I'm not even going to try and guess how many times this same topic has been discussed already.

akhimark · 04-21-2008, 10:59 AM

It all comes down to "from each according to his means, to each according to his need." This really sounds good to those taught in gubment schools but is contrary to human nature. The 3 most important motivational factors: 1. What's in it for me? 2. What's in it for me? 3. What's in it for me? This may sound selfish but that's the way it is. Don't give me that "common good" crap because that only works on paper and in the movies.

I personally like the idea of the Fair Tax and think that is the best way to go. If not that how about a flat tax (NOT FLAT TAX RATE). In my version of the flat tax, everyone pays the SAME DOLLAR AMOUNT. I don't know what the number is, but lets say you or your family owes $2000 for each member. If you have a family of 4, you pay $8000 in income taxes. You get to keep whatever you make after that amount. This way, hard work is rewarded instead of punished as is the case in the current system.

Palmguy · 04-21-2008, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kannibul

Sure, when you consider the dollar having a flat value across the board.

Lets take tax off the table.

I have $100. You have $1.

We both go to McDonalds. I order something off the Dollar menu, and you order something off the dollar menu.

Who does that dollar mean more to? Who felt that cost more?

Because it's based on percentages, of course people who have more, pay more. However, when you consider that the value of a dollar for a person who has billions and recieves $200K/yr on interest alone, versus someone who earns $50K/yr working their butts off -the value of the dollar is NOT equal - thus, taxation on that dollar should also not be equal.

What gets me is the people who DON'T pay taxes AND have the money and the means to pay their share...

Put another way...

You and I both go to McDonald's. I have $100 and you have $1. You feel that you deserve to have two Big Macs, large fries and coke, and a McFlurry, and McDonald's makes me pay for your $10 lunch.

How is that fair?

**jmichna** · 04-21-2008, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akhimark

It all comes down to "from each according to his means, to each according to his need."...

Ah... Karl Marx at his finest. More power to the proletariat!

04-21-2008, 09:56 AM	#1
Brickboy240 XDTalk 5K Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 8,322	"The wealthy need to pay their share of taxes"...huh? Myth: The rich are hiding their wealth from the taxman, get all sorts of breaks and need to pay their fair share of taxes. (as repeated by Hillary and Obama over and over again...) Truth: The top 25% of wage earners pay 86% of all Federal Income Taxes. The top 50% of wage earners pay 97% of all Federal Income Taxes. The top 1% of wage earners pay 39% of all Federal Income Taxes. (looks like the wealthy are shouldering almost ALL the income tax burden!) meanwhile.... The bottom 25% of wage earners pay NO Federal Income Taxes at all. Source? http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/wp1.pdf So...when they start this "rich need to pay their fair share" garbage...think of these stats, because it looks like the wealthy and the upper middle class shoulder almost all the income tax burden and the left has the tax issue completely backwards. Many of you probably already knew this and I find it amazing that Hillary and Obama still use the "tax breaks for the wealthy" montra to whip up their base. I would guess that their base is completely ignorant on who really shoulders the tax burden in the United States. - Brickboy240 __________________ NOBAMA 2008...neo-Marxism is a very poor substitute for pretend conservatism! Es mejor morir a pie que vivir arrodillado Volvo...the Swedish Brick!

04-21-2008, 10:09 AM	#3
Brickboy240 XDTalk 5K Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 8,322	What kills me is why the left acts so shocked that wealthy people benefit from tax cuts. Hello! They're paying the higher percentages of the tax bill...who do you think should benefit from a cut? The payers! The poor don't care about tax cuts because...surprise! They don't pay any income taxes at all. (by large, the poor also don't vote en masse...but thats another post) Then, another popular notion tossed around by the left is that tax cuts hurt the poor. How? If you don't pay any income taxes to begin with...how will a cut to those that DO pay taxes affect you? True, tax cuts do not HELP the poor...but they don't HURT them, either. What nonsense this is. Its amazing how the masses soak up all this garbage and accept it as the gospel truth when the left has the income tax issue completely backwards. Proof positive that class warfare and clas envy are still powerful tools in the left's political bag of tricks. Bottom line: most of what ails the nation, money-wise, can be fixed not by asking the wealthy to pay more income taxes but by reigning in spending. But when have you seen any politician do this in either party? Rarely if ever. - Brickboy240 __________________ NOBAMA 2008...neo-Marxism is a very poor substitute for pretend conservatism! Es mejor morir a pie que vivir arrodillado Volvo...the Swedish Brick! Last edited by Brickboy240 : 04-21-2008 at 10:18 AM.

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04-21-2008, 10:59 AM	#8
akhimark XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: York, SC Posts: 369	It all comes down to "from each according to his means, to each according to his need." This really sounds good to those taught in gubment schools but is contrary to human nature. The 3 most important motivational factors: 1. What's in it for me? 2. What's in it for me? 3. What's in it for me? This may sound selfish but that's the way it is. Don't give me that "common good" crap because that only works on paper and in the movies. I personally like the idea of the Fair Tax and think that is the best way to go. If not that how about a flat tax (NOT FLAT TAX RATE). In my version of the flat tax, everyone pays the SAME DOLLAR AMOUNT. I don't know what the number is, but lets say you or your family owes $2000 for each member. If you have a family of 4, you pay $8000 in income taxes. You get to keep whatever you make after that amount. This way, hard work is rewarded instead of punished as is the case in the current system.