Show Me the (Tax) Money...

[jmichna]

Show Me the Money - Whether Democrat, Republican or Independent, one might want to know just what the candidates have in mind for our personal money. That's what taxes are.....OUR $$$.

Candidate-proposed changes in taxes after 2008 General election:
CAPITAL GAINS TAX
MCCAIN
15% (no change)

OBAMA
28%

CLINTON
24%

How does this affect you?
If you sell your home and make a profit, you will pay 28% of your gain on taxes. If you are heading toward retirement and would like to down-size your home or move into a retirement community, 28% of the money you make from your home will go to taxes. This proposal will adversely affect the elderly who are counting on the income from their homes as part of their retirement income.

DIVIDEND TAX
MCCAIN
15% (no change)

OBAMA
39.6%

CLINTON
39.6%

How will this affect you?
If you have any money invested in stock market, IRA, mutual funds, college funds, life insurance, retirement accounts, or anything that pays or reinvests dividends, you will now be paying nearly 40% of the money earned on taxes if Obama or Clinton become president. The experts predict that "Higher tax rates on dividends and capital gains would crash the stock market yet do absolutely nothing to cut the deficit."

INCOME TAX
MCCAIN
(no changes)
Single making 30K - tax $4,500
Single making 50K - tax $12,500
Single making 75K - tax $18,750
Married making 60K- tax $9,000
Married making 75K - tax $18,750
Married making 125K - tax $31,250

OBAMA
(reversion to pre-Bush tax cuts)
Single making 30K - tax $8,400
Single making 50K - tax $14,000
Single making 75K - tax $23,250
Married making 60K - tax $16,800
Married making 75K - tax $21,000
Married making 125K - tax $38,750

CLINTON
(reversion to pre-Bush tax cuts)
Single making 30K - tax $8,400
Single making 50K - tax $14,000
Single making 75K - tax $23,250
Married making 60K - tax $16,800
Married making 75K - tax $21,000
Married making 125K - tax $38,750

How does this affect you?
No explanation needed. This is pretty straight forward.

INHERITANCE TAX
MCCAIN
0%
(No change, Bush repealed this tax)

OBAMA
keep the inheritance tax

CLINTON
keep the inheritance tax

How does this affect you?
Many families have lost businesses, farms and ranches, and homes that have been in their families for generations because they could not afford the inheritance tax. Those willing their assets to loved ones will not only lose them to these taxes.

NEW TAXES BEING PROPOSED BY BOTH CLINTON AND OBAMA
* New government taxes proposed on homes that are more than 2400 square feet
* New gasoline taxes (as if gas weren't high enough already)
* New taxes on natural resources consumption (heating gas, water, electricity)
* New taxes on retirement accounts
and last but not least...
* New taxes to pay for socialized medicine so we can receive the same level of medical care as other third-world countries!!!

Consider the numbers when you decide which candidate you can afford to elect to office.
*****************************
Additional information regarding Obama's Campaign proposals and the effect on your taxes:

If Sen. Barack Obama (D-IL) Could Enact All Of His Campaign Proposals, Taxpayers Would Be Faced With Financing $874.35 Billion In New Spending Over One White House Term:
Updated February 14, 2008: Obama's National Infrastructure Reinvestment Bank Will Cost $60 Billion Over Ten Years; Equal To $6 Billion A Year And $24 Billion Over Four Years. Obama: "I'm proposing a National Infrastructure Reinvestment Bank that will invest $60 billion over ten years." (Sen. Barack Obama, Remarks On Economic Policy, Janesville, WI, 2/13/08 )

Obama's Health Care Plan Will Cost Up To $65 Billion A Year; Equal To $260 Billion Over Four Years. "[Obama] campaign officials estimated that the net cost of the plan to the federal government would be $50 billion to $65 billion a year, when fully phased in, and said the revenues from rolling back the tax cuts were enough to cover it." (Robin Toner and Patrick Healy, "Obama Calls For Wider And Less Costly Health Care Coverage," The New York Times, 5/30/07)

Obama's Energy Plan Will Cost $150 Billion Over 10 Years, Equal To $15 Billion Annually And $60 Billion Over Four Years. "Obama will invest $150 billion over 10 years to advance the next generation of biofuels and fuel infrastructure, accelerate the commercialization of plug-in hybrids, promote development of commercial-scale renewable energy, invest in low-emissions coal plants, and begin the transition to a new digital electricity grid." (Obama For America, "The Blueprint For Change," Welcome to Obama for America, Accessed 1/14/08, p. 25)

Obama's Tax Plan Will Cost Approximately $85 Billion A Year; Equal To $340 Billion Over Four Years. "[Obama's] proposed tax cuts and credits, aimed at workers earning $50,000 or less per year, would cost the Treasury an estimated $85 billion annually." (Margaret Talev, "Obama Proposes Tax Code Overhaul To Help The Poor," McClatchy Newspapers, 9/19/07)

*Obama's Plan Would Raise Taxes On Capital Gains And Dividends, And On Carried Interest. Obama's tax plan includes: "[i]ncreasing the highest bracket for capital gains and dividends and closing the carried interest loophole." (Obama For America, "Barack Obama: Tax Fairness For The Middle Class," Fact Sheet, Welcome to Obama for America, Accessed 1/8/08 )

Obama's Economic Stimulus Package Will Cost $75 Billion. "Barack Obama's economic plan will inject $75 billion of stimulus into the economy by getting money in the form of tax cuts and direct spending directly to the people who need it most." (Obama For America, "Barack Obama's Plan To Stimulate The Economy," Fact Sheet, Welcome to Obama for America, 1/13/08 )

Obama's Early Education And K-12 Package Will Cost $18 Billion A Year; Equal To $72 Billion Over Four Years. "Barack Obama's early education and K-12 plan package costs about $18 billion per year." (Obama For America, "Barack Obama's Plan For Lifetime Success Through Education," Fact Sheet, Welcome to Obama for America, 11/20/07, p. 15)

Obama's National Service Plan Will Cost $3.5 Billion A Year; Equal To $14 Billion Over Four Years. "Barack Obama's national service plan will cost about $3.5 billion per year when it is fully implemented." (Obama For America, "Helping All Americans Serve Their Country: Barack Obama's Plan For Universal Voluntary Citizen Service," Fact Sheet, Welcome to Obama for America, 12/5/07)

Obama Will Increase Our Foreign Assistance Funding By $25 Billion. "Obama will embrace the Millennium Development Goal of cutting extreme poverty around the world in half by 2015, and he will double our foreign assistance to $50 billion to achieve that goal." (Obama For America, "The Blueprint For Change," Welcome to Obama for America, Accessed 1/14/08, p. 53)

Obama Will Provide $2 Billion To Aid Iraqi Refugees. "He will provide at least $2 billion to expand services to Iraqi refugees in neighboring countries, and ensure that Iraqis inside their own country can find a safe-haven." (Obama For America, "The Blueprint For Change," Welcome to Obama for America, Accessed 1/14/08, p. 51)

Obama Will Provide $1.5 Billion To Help States Adopt Paid-Leave Systems. "As president, Obama will initiate a strategy to encourage all 50 states to adopt paid-leave systems. Obama will provide a $1.5 billion fund to assist states with start-up costs and to help states offset the costs for employees and employers." (Obama For America, "The Blueprint For Change," Welcome to Obama for America, Accessed 1/14/08, p. 15)
Obama Will Provide $1 Billion Over 5 Years For Transitional Jobs And Career Pathway Programs, Equal To $200 Million A Year And $800 Million Over Four Years. "Obama will invest $1 billion over five years in transitional jobs and career pathway programs that implement proven methods of helping low-income Americans succeed in the workforce." (Obama For America, "The Blueprint For Change," Welcome to Obama for America, Accessed 1/14/08, p. 42)

Obama Will Provide $50 Million To Jump-Start The Creation Of An IAEA-Controlled Nuclear Fuel Bank. Obama: "We must also stop the spread of nuclear weapons technology and ensure that countries cannot build -- or come to the brink of building -- a weapons program under the auspices of developing peaceful nuclear power. That is why my administration will immediately provide $50 million to jump-start the creation of an International Atomic Energy Agency-controlled nuclear fuel bank and work to update the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty." (Sen. Barack Obama, "Renewing American Leadership," Foreign Affairs, 7-8/07)

[DeltaV]

What is the source for the tax info? I've tried to tell liberal friends this kind of thing, but they always put it off to 'conservative propaganda'....

[jmichna]

That's an good question... I received the info in an email from an old USMC buddy. Some of the tax info is straightforward, such as repeal (or allowing the lapse) of existing income tax cuts, or reinstatement of the inheritance tax, just puts us back to where we were prior to 2001.

The figures for the proposed dividends taxes and capital gains taxes should be findable on the respective candidates' websites. I would assume the proposed "new" taxes should also be findable there.

Re the Obama info in the latter half of the email, there are sources cited in each section.

Sorry I can't offer a more definitive answer, but I'll post back anything I find. If anyone else has links to support or discredit any of these numbers, please post back to this thread... the goal is an accurate picture of what will happen to us tax-wise whatever\whoever the new administration will be.

[jmichna]

Here's a bit of supporting information on the Obama side of things:

INHERITANCE TAX
Obama Pushes for Higher Investment Taxes - Capital Commerce (usnews.com)
Obama Pushes for Higher Investment Taxes
September 19, 2007 03:02 PM ET | James Pethokoukis

As part of his "Tax Fairness for the Middle Class" plan, Barack Obama is in favor of nearly doubling the capital-gains tax rate from 15 percent to 28 percent. Leaving the fairness issue aside for a moment—as well as the impact of higher taxes on economic growth—the Obama plan could also be called a "Ways in Which Government Can Collect More Taxes to Pay for New Spending" plan, since Democratic candidates are all scrambling to figure out ways to plausibly pay for new healthcare, education, and infrastructure spending if elected.

CAPITAL GAINS & DIVIDENDS
Obama plan: $80B in tax relief - USATODAY.com

...Obama's campaign said he would pay for his proposals by closing corporate tax loopholes, cracking down on international tax havens and raising the top rate on capital gains and dividends. But the campaign did not say how much each of those proposals would generate.

When Obama announced his health care plan in May, his campaign said he could pay for it by rolling back several Bush tax cuts that benefit the wealthy. That included restoring the top rate on investments to pre-Bush levels: 20% for capital gains and 39.6% for dividends.

Now Obama's advisers say they have more than enough revenue from other sources to pay for his health care plan and the capital gains and dividends increase can be used in part to fund the tax plan. However, they could not say how much that would raise or exactly how high Obama would raise them except that the top rate for both would be between 20% and 28% — the rate President Reagan set in 1986....

[jmichna]

Summary of positions on taxes and voting records on taxes, presented by a group called On The Issues (dot) org

Below is just a snapshot of the candidates' positions over the years, and you really need to look at the details, and think through what the impact was\will be:

John McCain on Tax Reform
Voted against Bush tax cuts for not reining in spending (Opposed Bush tax cuts, but must extend them now)
Voted YES on repealing the Alternative Minimum Tax
Voted YES on raising estate tax exemption to $5 million
Voted YES on supporting permanence of estate tax cuts
Voted YES on permanently repealing the `death tax`
Voted NO on $47B for military by repealing capital gains tax cut
Voted YES on retaining reduced taxes on capital gains & dividends
Voted YES on extending the tax cuts on capital gains and dividends
Voted NO on $350 billion in tax breaks over 11 years
Voted YES on reducing marriage penalty instead of cutting top tax rates
Voted YES on requiring super-majority for raising taxes

Hillary Clinton on Tax Reform
Votes against the Bush tax cuts
- 5/26/2001: NO on Economic Growth and Tax Relief Reconciliation Act
- 5/23/2003: NO on Jobs and Growth and Tax Relief Reconciliation Act
- 11/17/2005: YES on raising capital gains taxes on wealthy individuals
- 2/13/2006: YES on allowing capital gains tax cuts to expire
Voted NO on repealing the Alternative Minimum Tax
Voted NO on raising estate tax exemption to $5 million
Voted NO on supporting permanence of estate tax cuts
Voted NO on permanently repealing the `death tax`
Voted YES on $47B for military by repealing capital gains tax cut
Voted YES on retaining reduced taxes on capital gains & dividends
Voted NO on $350 billion in tax breaks over 11 years
Voted YES on reducing marriage penalty instead of cutting top tax rates
Voted YES on increasing tax deductions for college tuition

Barack Obama on Tax Reform
Voted NO on repealing the Alternative Minimum Tax
Voted NO on raising estate tax exemption to $5 million
Voted NO on supporting permanence of estate tax cuts
Voted NO on permanently repealing the `death tax`
Voted YES on $47B for military by repealing capital gains tax cut
Voted NO on retaining reduced taxes on capital gains & dividends
Voted NO on extending the tax cuts on capital gains and dividends

[Brickboy240]

If those figures are to be trusted, then a single person making 30K a year will pay around twice the income taxes under Obama than they would under McCain's plan.

Could that be true? All we hear is how Obama is going to soak the wealthy. 30K a year annual income...well...thats not all that wealthy if you ask me!

But we're not supposed to criticize Obama, because that is partisan and racist...LOL!

- Brickboy240

[Frenchy]

There is something to be said for abject poverty!

[Brickboy240]

No kidding!

I should just sell off all my valuables and take all my money and bury it in a hole somewhere. Paint myself brown and sneak back into thie state with Gonzales as my last name and empty pockets.

It seems one gets better treatment if one does so, than to try to be an entrepreneur or try to anything else but hanging on the lowest rung of the ladder in our society.

That is also the hidden message, sent forth by the two Democratic candidates to people of my race and income level: shut up and hand over your earnings...we don't give a rip about you and yours and we don't represent you or your interests at all...just hand us your money and shut up.

Nice. Our founders are surely spinning in their graves by now.

- brickboy240

[jmichna]

Originally Posted by Brickboy240

If those figures are to be trusted, then a single person making 30K a year will pay around twice the income taxes under Obama than they would under McCain's plan....

One thing to consider about the income taxes... those would be the tax rate figures, not considering the dependents deductions and other deductions, so actual taxes paid would be somewhat less.

[ichy_trigger]

Hey, this is the "CHANGE" that Oboma is calling for...