FN FiveseveN

[SKasz]

Well Alaskapopo, Not everybody is connected to law enforcement or looks at every new firearm in a "tactical" sense. Most people here are gun enthoisist or collectors, most of the guns people I know own are for recreational use and yes they are mostly just "TOYS".

[Alaskapopo]

Originally Posted by SKasz

Well Alaskapopo, Not everybody is connected to law enforcement or looks at every new firearm in a "tactical" sense. Most people here are gun enthoisist or collectors, most of the guns people I know own are for recreational use and yes they are mostly just "TOYS".

Thats fine. But this gun was marketed for tactical uses and if someone uses it in its advertised role they will be woefully underarmed.
Pat

[Neomet]

Pat:

Interesting stats on handgun calibers vs .233 penetration. I'm not doubting the data, but am wondering why the smaller (takes less effort to "push" through walls) bullets while traveling at a higher velocity didn't penetrate more than a lumbering widebody .45 at 850 FPS. Perhaps it is bullet weight that is the key factor?? My knowledge of physics stops pretty much when the apple landed on Newton's head, but maybe there is some law of physics that says heavy things traveling slowly penetrate more than light things going very, very fast. Hmmmmm..........

[The Knight Of Light]

I don't think Pat has ever gone to the range to shoot cans and bottles without some kind of tactical agenda in mind.

Some times people just want to shoot guns cuz' it's fun not because they are looking out for zombies.

[Neomet]

Originally Posted by The Knight Of Light

I don't think Pat has ever gone to the range to shoot cans and bottles without some kind of tactical agenda in mind.

Some times people just want to shoot guns cuz' it's fun not because they are looking out for zombies.

Full cans of course, right??

[The Knight Of Light]

Originally Posted by Neomet

Full cans of course, right??

Wally World root beer! 2$ a 12 pack!

[Neomet]

Originally Posted by The Knight Of Light

Wally World root beer! 2$ a 12 pack!

Now were having some fun!! I haven't taken Ms. N out to shoot stuff yet, but as it gets a bit warmer here I plan on taking her out with a trunk full of stuff. Soda, 1 gallon water jugs, watermellons, all the usual stuff.

Funny, I was just remembering how my dad taught me to shoot using soda cans laying on their sides so I had to shoot the bottoms of them. 5th grade, 1966, Webb AFB Big Springs TX. Cool...............

[Alaskapopo]

Originally Posted by Neomet

Pat:

Interesting stats on handgun calibers vs .233 penetration. I'm not doubting the data, but am wondering why the smaller (takes less effort to "push" through walls) bullets while traveling at a higher velocity didn't penetrate more than a lumbering widebody .45 at 850 FPS. Perhaps it is bullet weight that is the key factor?? My knowledge of physics stops pretty much when the apple landed on Newton's head, but maybe there is some law of physics that says heavy things traveling slowly penetrate more than light things going very, very fast. Hmmmmm..........

It all has to do with the difference between momentium and energy.

Simply put a .223 bullet has a lot of energy but not a lot of momentium. So the light bullet slows down very very fast. And in many cases the bullet comes apart and this slows it down even further. Now a pistol round like a 230 grain 45 acp round does not have a lot of energy but it has more momentium. (Power factor of 176 for the .223 with a 55 grain bullet at 3200 fps and a power factor of 196 for a 230 grain ball round at 850)

To further complicate things there are some things that a .223 will penetrate better on. Thats hard targets like steel. The initial energy of the .223 allows it to burn through steel (although there is nothing really left of the bullet due to fragmentation) that would not even be dimpled by a pistol round.

Energy is 1/2 the mass of the bullet times the velocity squared. You can figure it on a scientific calculator with the following take the bullet weight times the velocity times the velocity again then divide by 450200. This will give you the muzzle energy.

Momentium is figured by taking the bullet weight times the velocity. Bullet weight is much more important in penetration in soft targets than velocity is. I hope this helps.
Pat

[HTOWN stunna]

blahblahblahblah

[The Knight Of Light]

Funny thing about rifles.

When we say, "he was shot with a handgun," we usually go into what, where, and how many. When we say, "the rifle round hit him," we don't have much to talk about afterwards. As in, "he was down," meaning the fight was over. Not dead, dead is not the objective, stopping the fight is. Putting the threat down.

Clint Smith of Thunder Ranch