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.22LR for Self Defense

This is a discussion on .22LR for Self Defense within the Non-XD Handguns forums, part of the Other Handgun Talk category; Originally Posted by Minkman555 Well , I see both sides of this argument. I think .22's account for most murders in the USA (not 100% ...


View Poll Results: What is your primary carry caliber?
.22LR 1 0.78%
.22 MAG 0 0%
.25 ACP 0 0%
.380 ACP 8 6.20%
9 MM 57 44.19%
.38 SPC 5 3.88%
.357 SIG/MAG 3 2.33%
.40 SW 29 22.48%
.44 MAG 0 0%
.45 ACP/GAP 48 37.21%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 129. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-04-2012, 12:22 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Minkman555 View Post
Well ,

I see both sides of this argument. I think .22's account for most murders in the USA (not 100% certain) , but I don't think there were many "stopped in their tracks" shoots with a .22 , most people die a few hours/days after being shot

I feel a .22LR is okay for self defense for a woman , but very far from ideal.

I wouldn't want to get shot with any round , but in the case of lawful self defense -- your drawing and shooting to stop/kill an attack that is putting your life in immediate danger.

That usually means someone has a gun and is going to kill you , or has a knife and is going to kill you. (usually)

So , in any lawful scenario -- your shooting to kill. The .22LR has hit humans in the head and everywhere else -- and bounced off (didn't break skin).

Would it stop a deadly threat ? It might --

But I would never , ever -- bet my life on .22LR. An attacker can keep attacking after being shot with a .45acp and that's true ...

BUT you have a MUCH better chance of stopping the threat with a .45ACP/.40/9mm then with a .22LR that potentially could hit an attacker and he wouldn't even realize it or even worse , it won't break the skin.

"what if's" are always going to be there , that doesn't change ballistics. And I've been in dangerous and potentially life or death scenarios and I can tell you one thing for sure ...

YOU LOOSE HALF YOUR SENSES ... EVEN REACHING IN YOUR WAIST BECOMES AN OVERWHELMING TASK .. Let alone taking a stance , aiming , and hitting your target -- anyone can shoot "amazing" at the range with a .22LR , but having a bad guy with a 9mm Glock 19 coming at you is going to definitely take away your .22 "perfection". And if I had a .22LR on my waist and am being approached by an armed B.G ..

I personally would not even draw , and just take my chances with giving my money up ...

I feel for women (who are less likely to be armed to a BG) a small .22 is a good thing to have ..

For a man ? No. No reason at all to CCW a .22LR as a primary.

It will stop a BG , but it could just piss off an ARMED B.G -- and you'll become the victim of his ".45ACP" greatness ..

And it's possible he will walk because you pulled your "accurate pinker" on him , and your not alive to tell your side of the story because you took a .45 round to the CNS.

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You lost me at its good for women but not for men.

Out of curiosity feel free not to answer what deadly situation were you involved with? I have been in some and didn't have any problems but they were also in war zones so we were waiting for them and it wasn't really a shock or surprise to the system. I would prob poop my pants if it happened here CONUS won't know unless it happens though.
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Old 09-04-2012, 12:26 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by tialloydragon View Post
I would consider carrying a 22LR handgun if they could figure out how to make a flush magazine that holds more than 10 rounds. Ammo choice is also a factor. I'd fill it with CCI Stingers or Mini-Mags.

Here's an article someone posted here, I think:

Tactical Life Israeli Mossad .22 LRS
Serious ?

Mossad , and the SEALs are the best of the best in the WORLD. No civilian will be trained like them , ever . And NO amount of practice at a gun range will make someone a navy seal or Mossad operative .

Your NUTS.

That is the worst reference I've ever seen in a .22LR defense --

Ever.


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Old 09-04-2012, 12:41 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by TCS_XDM View Post
You lost me at its good for women but not for men.

Out of curiosity feel free not to answer what deadly situation were you involved with? I have been in some and didn't have any problems but they were also in war zones so we were waiting for them and it wasn't really a shock or surprise to the system. I would prob poop my pants if it happened here CONUS won't know unless it happens though.
I haven't been in a war , and I have never used DF ...

But I have been shot at multiple times , and grew up in the "bad part" of West Palm Beach -- where I have been in small secluded areas (more times then I can count) -- with multiple assault rifles going off in every direction and nowhere to go.

I've had a pistol pulled on me and this person had a malfunction (held it sideways like a typical street moron) while engaging the trigger ... it was aimed directly at my head 4 feet away from me.

Looking down a barrel of a loaded gun aimed at my head "froze" me like an ice cube.

I've buried some of my best friends , and the last memory I have being in West Palm -- was seeing the person I was taking a roadtrip with the following day , crashed into a tree with multiple gunshot wounds dead and slumped over his steering wheel.

I've been robbed at gunpoint , have had many other near death expierences that I'd rather not think about.

I'm just glad I am alive and that I've never had to draw a gun.

Again , I haven't been to war ... but I have been close to death , and should have died .

I hope that answer was okay -- I salute you for your service , and to me your a hero -- and I don't mean to come off as a person who's been to war , I'm just answering your question and I would to not like to talk about this any further.


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Old 09-04-2012, 12:52 AM   #34
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I promise you I'm not hero won't claim that I am. I have been shot at as a stupid kid going to parties and being places I had no reason to be at. I didnt grow up in a bad area i just partied in them. I took off running in the opposite direction immediately. I remember being scared and tired and drunk. I prob ran a few miles before my friends called me on my brick Nokia phone trying to find me. Testosterone and booze are a dumb mix and as a stupid kid pride was way to important.

The one thing about the last firefight I got in was being really angry cause it was lunch time and I was hungry. I was in a crappy little village in a crappy valley in Afghanistan and it was just annoying.

Sorry for thread jacking.
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Old 09-04-2012, 09:27 AM   #35
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"if all I had was..."
Again, stupid.
Unless all you have is... and you're attacked right now.

You have time to get something better - so go do it!

Two things come to mind - from Hell on Wheels the advice given to Elam - "it's not about accuracy, it's about being close" - probably true. Are you gonna need to take out a sniper at Walmart? Not likely. Odds are you'll be face to face with a bad guy and he'll have his gun out already. Or you'll be asleep and your wife will say someone is in the house (so aim at the door an call the cops and wait) Should you be a in a movie theatre when a gunman walks in the best idea is get out - if not then yes accuracy may matter- but a 22 isn't going to be a good choice even if is your only choice. Because...

To quote another movie, Blazing Saddles in regards to shooting Mongo " I wouldn't do that, it will only piss him off" You start shooting YOU become the target. Don't be the guy that 'brought a knife to a gun fight' . And if in a theatre or similar you best be a damned good shot - you'll be crucified if you shoot back and injure a bystander or don't stop they guy because you'll be the 'crazy gun nut that made it worse that should have let the police handle it'

Having shot weak rounds that haven't penetrated (plinking and such) I want penetration and that means speed. fall is coming - get some pumpkins and go shoot them with various rounds and distances and see how they do. a 22 is a joke compared to something bigger.
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Old 09-04-2012, 11:07 AM   #36
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If you want to talk yourself into a 22 for defense you can certainly do so. Some people believe fire can't melt steel and 911 was an inside job or we never landed on the moon - there's no way to make people think clearly.

But the fact is I can shoot a 45 very accurately and rapidly and no amount of analysis is needed to show that a 22 will work as quickly as a 45, and the fact that the bad guy may bleed to death in a hour isn't a selling point on the 22 since he's got plenty of time to kill you or your family.

Dozens of studies have shown that in a life and death situation you will likely empty your gun, wouldn't you rather have that gun filled with a good 9mm or a good 45 rather than 22's? Another way of looking at it - in a life and death situation you cannot choose where it will happen, the circumstances, the environment, or who the bad guy is. ALL you can controll is your weapon choice and your training. Why choose a less than optimimum round?
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Old 09-04-2012, 11:29 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by Medic18d View Post
A 22 is better than nothing. And can be lethal
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So is a stick with a nail in it, but it won't be my choice for SD either.
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If it was all you had, you'd use a .22.
The point is DON'T CHOOSE A 22 FOR SELF DEFENSE!

If you got caught out somewhere and a 22 is what you were carrying, then yeah better than nothing but why take the 22 in the first place? I only carry my 22s when I'm out on the property for snakes and turtles and the rare armadillo or stray dog. It's not THAT unusual for me to have the Bersa 22 in one pocket and the Kahr CM-9 in the other JIC.
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Old 09-04-2012, 12:32 PM   #38
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As a backup they are fine. I dispatched plenty of big game with a .22 for the coup de grace


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Old 09-04-2012, 12:38 PM   #39
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Sure I'd use a 22 for SD,that is if my other option was a wiffle ball bat.
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Old 09-04-2012, 02:54 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by prof_fate View Post
"if all I had was..."
Again, stupid.
Unless all you have is... and you're attacked right now.

You have time to get something better - so go do it!

Two things come to mind - from Hell on Wheels the advice given to Elam - "it's not about accuracy, it's about being close" - probably true. Are you gonna need to take out a sniper at Walmart? Not likely. Odds are you'll be face to face with a bad guy and he'll have his gun out already. Or you'll be asleep and your wife will say someone is in the house (so aim at the door an call the cops and wait) Should you be a in a movie theatre when a gunman walks in the best idea is get out - if not then yes accuracy may matter- but a 22 isn't going to be a good choice even if is your only choice. Because...

To quote another movie, Blazing Saddles in regards to shooting Mongo " I wouldn't do that, it will only piss him off" You start shooting YOU become the target. Don't be the guy that 'brought a knife to a gun fight' . And if in a theatre or similar you best be a damned good shot - you'll be crucified if you shoot back and injure a bystander or don't stop they guy because you'll be the 'crazy gun nut that made it worse that should have let the police handle it'

Having shot weak rounds that haven't penetrated (plinking and such) I want penetration and that means speed. fall is coming - get some pumpkins and go shoot them with various rounds and distances and see how they do. a 22 is a joke compared to something bigger.
I find it quite disturbing/unrealistic, how completey ignorant/foolish you along with other so called "internet experts" tend to be. People often times tend to dismiss the killing potentional of any round, as a means to justify their gun purchase. Well, since I spend $1,000 on a 1911 chambered for .45 ACP it must be the best firearm with the most powerful round on earth. What is scary is how you along with other's underestimate the lethality of any pistol/rifile cartridge(even the .22LR) smaller than the one you carry, while the .45 can cause greater wounding effect, when compared to other pistols cartridge, believing a .22lr is a "weak", "underpowered", or "lacks the ability to stop a human". Almost all pistols rounds are deemed ineffective(with regards to one shot stops), against humans. In the unfortunate event involving a situation with another person pointing a pistol at me wether it be a .22lr, or a .45 sure It may take 1-2 shots with a .45 to put me down, or even 6-10 shots with a .22. Regardless dead is dead. I would say the .45 is a tad more humane(sad to say that). Overconfidence, and underestimation can/may lead to you own death.
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