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.22LR for Self Defense

This is a discussion on .22LR for Self Defense within the Non-XD Handguns forums, part of the Other Handgun Talk category; Originally Posted by Bonehead if a .22LR if what you have, its better than nothing. also hits with a .22LR are better than misses with ...


View Poll Results: What is your primary carry caliber?
.22LR 1 0.78%
.22 MAG 0 0%
.25 ACP 0 0%
.380 ACP 8 6.20%
9 MM 57 44.19%
.38 SPC 5 3.88%
.357 SIG/MAG 3 2.33%
.40 SW 29 22.48%
.44 MAG 0 0%
.45 ACP/GAP 48 37.21%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 129. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-03-2012, 07:57 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonehead View Post
if a .22LR if what you have, its better than nothing. also hits with a .22LR are better than misses with a .44Magnum.

I would rather hit with a .44Magnum but things don't always go as you would rather have them.

I've seen this argument before, specifically the if a .22LR if what you have, its better than nothing.

Why would that be all you have?
If you are considering a weapon to have for self defense that won't be on the list of choices.
Cost? You can get a used 380, 38, or 9 for less than many 22's.
Cost to shoot? Maybe. But few folks put cost of ammo as a prime consideration in self defense.

And in the OPs instance...he's carrying two guns (so cost is not an issue I assume) and he shoots competitively (so ammo costs are not much concern).

Most people prolly feel if attacked they want the biggest, baddest whatever to defend themselves - be that a given caliber, rounds in the mag, baseball bat or bowling ball.

Chrono results -
Shot CCI minimag from a SW15-22 rilfe. CCI has on the box '1260fps' and these are HP, so 37gr I suppose, give or take 1gr. Avg FPS was 1247.

Now if we convert that to ftlbs of energy at the target we get 127ftlbs.
For comparison, a 9mm 125 at 1100 fps is gonna give you 319 - 2.5 times as much punch.
A 230 gr 45 at 900 fps does 413, 3.2 times what the 22LR does.
Whats you wants is a 357 mag. A 158 gr bullet traveling at 1450 fps hits with 737 ft lbs of energy. More than double the 9, nearly double the 45 and nearly 6 times what a 22LR does. You'll need all 30 rounds of 22out of that keltec or 6 out of a SW J frame.
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Old 09-03-2012, 08:44 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prof_fate View Post
I've seen this argument before, specifically the if a .22LR if what you have, its better than nothing.

Why would that be all you have?
If you are considering a weapon to have for self defense that won't be on the list of choices.
Cost? You can get a used 380, 38, or 9 for less than many 22's.
Cost to shoot? Maybe. But few folks put cost of ammo as a prime consideration in self defense.

And in the OPs instance...he's carrying two guns (so cost is not an issue I assume) and he shoots competitively (so ammo costs are not much concern).

Most people prolly feel if attacked they want the biggest, baddest whatever to defend themselves - be that a given caliber, rounds in the mag, baseball bat or bowling ball.

I have a buddy that all he can manage is a .410 Mossberg 500 and a used pre accu trigger MKII bolt action .22LR. the rifle seems quite nice and I am a bit jealous.

I spent a good bit of time trying to advise him on a 9mm and away from a .38 wheel gun. he keeps telling me 250 or less. so I am showing him a keltec that I think he is going to look at next time he is out shopping for guns.

I don't know if its HIM or his wife or what it is. he gets weird when I am talking capacity and reloads.

I try to impress him that its not about hunting or a range toy, its about preventing people from harming his family. he isn't a gun guy but he is working on it. he surprised me with his purchases or I would have tried to guide him a bit but I can't exactly say he did wrong.

they are both wife approved and she is willing to go shoot them with him. maybe in a while when their comfort level is higher they will move up but for now I tell him if that's what you have it will do. its better than what you had before.
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Old 09-03-2012, 08:52 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prof_fate View Post

I've seen this argument before, specifically the if a .22LR if what you have, its better than nothing.

Why would that be all you have?
If you are considering a weapon to have for self defense that won't be on the list of choices.
Cost? You can get a used 380, 38, or 9 for less than many 22's.
Cost to shoot? Maybe. But few folks put cost of ammo as a prime consideration in self defense.

And in the OPs instance...he's carrying two guns (so cost is not an issue I assume) and he shoots competitively (so ammo costs are not much concern).

Most people prolly feel if attacked they want the biggest, baddest whatever to defend themselves - be that a given caliber, rounds in the mag, baseball bat or bowling ball.

Chrono results -
Shot CCI minimag from a SW15-22 rilfe. CCI has on the box '1260fps' and these are HP, so 37gr I suppose, give or take 1gr. Avg FPS was 1247.

Now if we convert that to ftlbs of energy at the target we get 127ftlbs.
For comparison, a 9mm 125 at 1100 fps is gonna give you 319 - 2.5 times as much punch.
A 230 gr 45 at 900 fps does 413, 3.2 times what the 22LR does.
Whats you wants is a 357 mag. A 158 gr bullet traveling at 1450 fps hits with 737 ft lbs of energy. More than double the 9, nearly double the 45 and nearly 6 times what a 22LR does. You'll need all 30 rounds of 22out of that keltec or 6 out of a SW J frame.
Well to be fair that Kel-Tec (my phone tries to autocorrect that to melted coincidence?) is 22 magnum so well just take the 40gr hornady v-max at 1950 FPS comes out to 340 ft lbs of muzzle energy. So your results are slightly off. But if the second round jams anyway the disadvantage is worse then you described.
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Old 09-03-2012, 08:57 PM   #24
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A 22 is better than nothing. And can be lethal
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Old 09-03-2012, 10:23 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Medic18d View Post
A 22 is better than nothing. And can be lethal
So is a stick with a nail in it, but it won't be my choice for SD either.
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Old 09-03-2012, 10:52 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaboom View Post
So is a stick with a nail in it, but it won't be my choice for SD either.

If it was all you had, you'd use a .22.
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Old 09-03-2012, 10:54 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Gulftanker View Post
If it was all you had, you'd use a .22.
That statement makes no sense whatsoever.

Why would one put themselves in a situation where it was all they had?
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Old 09-03-2012, 11:16 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Cuda66 View Post

That statement makes no sense whatsoever.

Why would one put themselves in a situation where it was all they had?
Maybe you were at a rimfire shooting match on a cold range when all of the sudden terrorist go all jihad Allah Akbar on you.
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Old 09-03-2012, 11:48 PM   #29
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If for some reason a .22 is all you got ( for what ever reason that's all you had) I'd say it's better than nothing IMO. The Mob used alot of .22's.

But in no way would it be my first chance if I had another!
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Old 09-04-2012, 12:13 AM   #30
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Well ,

I see both sides of this argument. I think .22's account for most murders in the USA (not 100% certain) , but I don't think there were many "stopped in their tracks" shoots with a .22 , most people die a few hours/days after being shot

I feel a .22LR is okay for self defense for a woman , but very far from ideal.

I wouldn't want to get shot with any round , but in the case of lawful self defense -- your drawing and shooting to stop/kill an attack that is putting your life in immediate danger.

That usually means someone has a gun and is going to kill you , or has a knife and is going to kill you. (usually)

So , in any lawful scenario -- your shooting to kill. The .22LR has hit humans in the head and everywhere else -- and bounced off (didn't break skin).

Would it stop a deadly threat ? It might --

But I would never , ever -- bet my life on .22LR. An attacker can keep attacking after being shot with a .45acp and that's true ...

BUT you have a MUCH better chance of stopping the threat with a .45ACP/.40/9mm then with a .22LR that potentially could hit an attacker and he wouldn't even realize it or even worse , it won't break the skin.

"what if's" are always going to be there , that doesn't change ballistics. And I've been in dangerous and potentially life or death scenarios and I can tell you one thing for sure ...

YOU LOOSE HALF YOUR SENSES ... EVEN REACHING IN YOUR WAIST BECOMES AN OVERWHELMING TASK .. Let alone taking a stance , aiming , and hitting your target -- anyone can shoot "amazing" at the range with a .22LR , but having a bad guy with a 9mm Glock 19 coming at you is going to definitely take away your .22 "perfection". And if I had a .22LR on my waist and am being approached by an armed B.G ..

I personally would not even draw , and just take my chances with giving my money up ...

I feel for women (who are less likely to be armed to a BG) a small .22 is a good thing to have ..

For a man ? No. No reason at all to CCW a .22LR as a primary.

It will stop a BG , but it could just piss off an ARMED B.G -- and you'll become the victim of his ".45ACP" greatness ..

And it's possible he will walk because you pulled your "accurate pinker" on him , and your not alive to tell your side of the story because you took a .45 round to the CNS.


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