XD Talk

**jmichna** · 04-04-2009, 03:25 PM

Just ran over to my local GS and what did I see newly added to their used/consignment display case...

An Ithaca 1911A1, stamped "United States Property," "M1911 A1 US Army," and dated "1943." Completely stock, smelling of Cosmoline. Finish nearly like new... doesn't look like it was ever carried. Probably better than 95% Parkerized finish. Bore in great shape, felt very tight; trigger breaks like glass at about 8-10 pounds (just by my feel... no gauge to measure). I have read somewhere that Ithaca produced something like 370,000 1911s for WWII.

Owner is asking $1799. That's a lot of money to me.

If you know historical 1911s, what do you think of this price for an Ithaca in that shape?

**Cannibul** · 04-04-2009, 06:15 PM

That's right on the outer edge of what the going rate is. Do a search for "ithaca" in the semi-auto pistol area at GunBroker and you will get a good idea of the pricing.

bigun · 04-04-2009, 06:46 PM

Condition is everything with GI 1911's, Look for reconditioning proofs, Usually something like AAD Anniston Army Depot or Rock Island. Reconditioned guns bring a bit less than all original pieces and with anything better than 80% I'm always a bit leary of forgery or refinish. Make sure that the Serial # falls in the Ithica range and that it isnt just another mixmaster. The most common GI 1911's are Remington Rand, Colt, Ithica and US&S brings up the rear. $1700 is high but these are about the best investments you can get in this economy.Make sure the edges and lettering are sharp and the Ordinance stamp may be light ot heavier on one side than the other this is normal. Good luck.

**jmichna** · 04-04-2009, 08:38 PM

Thanks gentlemen,
I have more homework to do, and will need to take another, more detailed look at this one.
John

dirty magazine · 04-04-2009, 10:58 PM

Would it be poor form if I went out and bought it?

Just kidding- I wish I could even contemplate buying that pistol right now. Good luck!

**jmichna** · 04-07-2009, 12:14 PM

Okay, I went back to take another look, and here is what I came up with:

S/N is 1462673, which falls within the 1943-issued serial numbers for Ithaca M1911 A1:
1943
Serial Numbers: 1441431-1471430 Ithaca (30,000 produced in this series.)

Slide markings
Left Side:
ITHACA GUN CO., INC.
ITHACA, N.Y.

Right Side: no markings

Receiver Markings
Right Side:
After slide stop -
UNITED STATES PROPERTY
N° 1462673

Before slide stop -
M 1911 A1 U.S. ARMY

Under slide stop (easily visible when stop removed)
FJA

A '7' is stamped on the right side of the trigger guard. A 'P' is stamped just below the slide release button on left side. Another 'P' is stamped on the top of the slide, just forward the rear sight.

No stampings that I saw on the barrel breech area, but the barrel was pretty greasy, so I might have missed something. There should have been a proof stamp on the right side of the lug... I just didn't notice it.

No stampings to indicate any reconditioning or proof marks, other than the 'FJA' visible when you remove the slide stop.

As far as condition, the barrel lock grooves and corresponding slide grooves look sharp and unworn. There is no burnishing of the bushing, like you see when the gun has been fired a lot.

The price is still too high for what I'm comfortable spending, but I'm going to keep watching this to see if the price drops after sitting in the display case a while.

bigun · 04-07-2009, 02:57 PM

If it's as nice as you say and all original it wont sit long. GI 1911's have gone crazy price wise in the last couple of years. I had no trouble getting $1000 for a 1945 Remington Rand in about 85-90% condition last year. However with the economy hitting the skids there may end up being more on the market which could drop prices across the board. Good luck but remember there will never be any more made. The Ithica should have a HS marked barrel as well.

danp · 04-07-2009, 06:53 PM

Try to find out if there is a back story to the gun. If the owner is a vet that "liberated" it when he returned from WWII and will write you a letter telling where he served and that this is the gun he carried, it will increase it's collector's value.

bac1023 · 04-08-2009, 06:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmichna

Just ran over to my local GS and what did I see newly added to their used/consignment display case...

An Ithaca 1911A1, stamped "United States Property," "M1911 A1 US Army," and dated "1943." Completely stock, smelling of Cosmoline. Finish nearly like new... doesn't look like it was ever carried. Probably better than 95% Parkerized finish. Bore in great shape, felt very tight; trigger breaks like glass at about 8-10 pounds (just by my feel... no gauge to measure). I have read somewhere that Ithaca produced something like 370,000 1911s for WWII.

Owner is asking $1749. That's a lot of money to me.

If you know historical 1911s, what do you think of this price for an Ithaca in that shape?

I've got a nice WWII era Ithaca and Remington Rand. i love the old USGI 1911A1s.

**jmichna** · 04-08-2009, 11:22 AM

Bac1023,
Those are two mighty fine looking weapons!

Your Ithaca's receiver has an inspection stamp 'G.H.D.' (Guy H. Drewry) which likely means it came from Colt.

I found this:

Quote:

Colt manufactured 60,000 pistols in the Ithaca serial number range (856405-916404), 41,696 in the Remington Rand serial number range (916405-958100), and 4,171 in the US&S serial number range (1088726-1092896).

From the photo, it looks like yours is S/N 908944, which falls into that range of guns produced in 1943. I've been told that Ithacas, and some Remington Rands, made with Colt components are more rare, and command a higher price.

At: 1911/1911A1 Production Numbers

I can't tell for sure from the posted photo, but if that S/N for the Remington Rand is 1118387, that's also a Colt serial number, and it has the same G.H.D. Colt inspection stamp.

Here's another web site with some good photo ID info for 1911s:
1944 COLT 1911A1

Do you shoot your 1911s?