Powder River Precision Striker Safety Lever Kit

[FunBobby]

Originally Posted by powder river

If you want to push this pin deeper into the block which arrow would you push on A or B?


I'm not trying to be sarcastic.

Is there a sexual meaning behind this???

[Modificationvt]

mine is on an angle, and its nice to be able to adjust the screw without taking the frame apart.

as for the diegram I belive it is ilistrating that if the screw is straight in it one could strip the threads if the pulled on the trigger to hard, and push the pin in too far. the angle allows you to push against the pin without pushing against the threads

[propellerhead]

Originally Posted by powder river

If you want to push this pin deeper into the block which arrow would you push on A or B?

B of course, but I'm missing what's is stronger for what purpose. Are you saying the set screw at an angle will be stronger against the trigger bar than if the set screw was straight into the frame?

I'm not trying to be difficult or critical, sir. I'm just trying to understand. I'm not a Mechanical Engineer but I work with a bunch of them. I still have one of your kits (without the drill bit or allen wrench) that I haven't installed primarily due to the set screw thing.

Originally Posted by Modificationvt

mine is on an angle, and its nice to be able to adjust the screw without taking the frame apart.

as for the diegram I belive it is ilistrating that if the screw is straight in it one could strip the threads if the pulled on the trigger to hard, and push the pin in too far. the angle allows you to push against the pin without pushing against the threads

With all due respect, I'm not sure I agree. The threads on the screw will hold better if the screw is drilled straight in. You'll have more threads supported and enclosed in the frame than if it were at an angle. Plus, you'll have the full surface of the screw head against the trigger bar instead of just a corner.

[agalindo]

Originally Posted by propellerhead

B of course, but I'm missing what's is stronger for what purpose. Are you saying the set screw at an angle will be stronger against the trigger bar than if the set screw was straight into the frame?

I'm not trying to be difficult or critical, sir. I'm just trying to understand. I'm not a Mechanical Engineer but I work with a bunch of them. I still have one of your kits (without the drill bit or allen wrench) that I haven't installed primarily due to the set screw thing.


With all due respect, I'm not sure I agree. The threads on the screw will hold better if the screw is drilled straight in. You'll have more threads supported and enclosed in the frame than if it were at an angle. Plus, you'll have the full surface of the screw head against the trigger bar instead of just a corner.

I too am not a mechanical engineer either but I have to agree with you that pushing straight against the screw is stronger. I can't think of any other mechanical setup where is there a "stop bar" at an angle.

[HHjr]

To PRP Daniel - about the .25" measurement .... no, I did understand that you gave me the depth of the hole to drill in to the frame..... I was trying to say that it looked to me the hole location seemed to measure about .25" down from the top of the frame to be centered in the trigger bar.

H

[GunnBugg]

Originally Posted by agalindo

I too am not a mechanical engineer either but I have to agree with you that pushing straight against the screw is stronger. I can't think of any other mechanical setup where is there a "stop bar" at an angle.

Well, I am an engineer, but not mechanical, but I can figure this one out.

If you push at Point A, only the threads keep you from pushing the screw to the bottom of the drilled hole. That's not a lot of friction/surface area preventing you from pushing the hole.

If you push at Point B, then the "buried" part of the screw is pushing either up or down, against the frame. That's a lot more surface area, and a lot more friction, and therefore less movement, less likely to move.

Very very similar to tapping in a pin. If you tap inline with the hole, the pin goes home (less friction). If you tap down at an angle it won't go home so easily. In this application, that's a good thing.

In the end, having a hole drilled to an exact depth would be best, as you pointed out with your example of other stops. But that isn't practical with this type of screw in this application.

AND, you'd have to pull the trigger bar to make any changes.

[agalindo]

Originally Posted by GunnBugg

Well, I am an engineer, but not mechanical, but I can figure this one out.

If you push at Point A, only the threads keep you from pushing the screw to the bottom of the drilled hole. That's not a lot of friction/surface area preventing you from pushing the hole.

If you push at Point B, then the "buried" part of the screw is pushing either up or down, against the frame. That's a lot more surface area, and a lot more friction, and therefore less movement, less likely to move.

Very very similar to tapping in a pin. If you tap inline with the hole, the pin goes home (less friction). If you tap down at an angle it won't go home so easily. In this application, that's a good thing.
[added]Looking at the picture posted pushing on the screw sideways B turns the screw into a leaver thus exerting more pressure on the polymer, than if you pushed straight A [/added]

In the end, having a hole drilled to an exact depth would be best, as you pointed out with your example of other stops. But that isn't practical with this type of screw in this application.

AND, you'd have to pull the trigger bar to make any changes.

I guess if your pushing on the polymer and not metal on metal.

Even if the screw was in straight the screw threads would still engage a larger amount of surface area than just the width of a singe thread. Not to sound like I'm arguing, just trying to understand the physics. If this was a common way to strengthen things then screws would screw in at angles and door stops would also be at angles. Wouldn't the force exerted on the screw being pushed sideways cause the polymer to expand and loosen up. Like when you try to loosen a stake that's been hammered into the ground. You push and pull sideway then pull straight up.

Looking at the picture posted pushing down on B would turn the screw into a leaver which would exert more pressure on the polymer than pushing down straight A.

[GunnBugg]

This is a particular application. In general, straight on is preferred. But when you do that you either have the butt against the bottom of the hole or a collar against the hole surround. These two things provide the strength beyond the threads' contact with the hole. Yes, more threads, more friction.

But in our application, you have neither of the two strengtheners discussed, AND you'd like to be able to adjust without removing the trigger bar. So, you take the angle, which is stronger, in our applicatoin with neither buttressed butt or collared surround, and doesn't allow the screw to be pushed deeper into the hole. But while stronger, the angled screw strike is subject to rocking weakening. But, you don't have to pull the tigger that hard!

[rgeliske]

I was a mechanical engineer and I have been avoiding weighing in on this but it's starting to get confusing. There is one major scientific principal involved here and that is leverage. The weakness or strength of this application is in direct proportion to the length of the set screw in the frame versus the amount exposed outside the frame. The higher the ratio inside the hole to outside the hole the stronger the application.

Ideally the strongest application is to have more set screw inside the hole than outside. Lateral pressure against the set screw would tend to elongate the hole eventually making the application weaker, the potential for this is greatly increased when there is more set screw outside the hole than inside creating more leverage the sides of the hole. The same principle applies when installing fence post the more post in the ground the more ridged the post will be. In addition the amount of void space at the bottom of the hole also effects the strength of the application, less void stronger condition. In this case the strongest condition would be to have more set screw in the hole than out, as little lateral pressure as possible, and no void at the bottom. So straight in with the longest screw possible and the hole the exact length necessary to achieve an acceptable trigger reset. The set screw at an angle should not be a problem as long as you have more inside the hole than outside the hole. Realistically you should not be applying that much pressure to the trigger anyway.

[XDanthony]

Originally Posted by rgeliske

Realistically you should not be applying that much pressure to the trigger anyway.

I was going to say, how hard are you guys pulling your triggers?