Best .40cal defensive ammo

[Street Dog]

Fatmatt1981, I feel the need to respond to a couple of things you said in this post. 1st, you said you shot 50 rounds through the gun and hope never to have to use it again. If this is a carry gun you should be practicing with it at least once a month, more if you can. 2nd, no pistol has "knock down" power. Battle rifles do, but pistols do not. That is why shot placement is so important. The only way to better you odds is to get training and practice, alot. Good Luck.

[DigMe]

Originally Posted by Street Dog

Battle rifles do, but pistols do not.

You mean battle rifles like the .308 and the .223. Not bloody likely. Second Chance founder Rich Davis used to routinely give demonstrations where he would stand on one foot wearing one of his companies vests and have someone shoot him with a .308 after shooting him with a .44 mag. Neither one had the ability to "knock down" this average-sized man. You don't get any better proof than that. Also, you can read just about any military book and hear stories of enemies being hit multiple times with rifle rounds and just keep charging with no visible effect.

EDIT: I was just kidding when I said "Not bloody likely" because it's actually very likely that someone is going to fall down when shot with a rifle but it's not from the force of the bullet actually "knocking them down" like a bowling pin.

brad cook

[airbornefist]

fatmatt,

Don't worry about the grain of the bullet. Use what you feel good shooting. I would have liked to seen this guy take one in the chest from a .308 or a .44 mag. I know that 5.56 takes people down as does 7.62, they do literally drop when hit in the chest. I've been hit with simrounds and that was enough for me. Trust me, if you start shooting, no matter what grain you are using in the .40 S&W, the situation will definately change!

airbornefist

[C.H.Luke]

"well except for that cat one time lol Hyrdashcks on a cat"

So you liike to shoot Cats?

Next time you have the urge, travel to my State at my expense. Then we can introduce you to our new Felony animal anti-cruelty Laws!

Can even arrange for one of the Big Boys at Sing-Sing to personally bestow upon you "his" "Little Jeffery Dahmer" Award. {Your cell or his, your preference}

[DigMe]

Originally Posted by airbornefist

I know that 5.56 takes people down as does 7.62, they do literally drop when hit in the chest.

You can actually see it on a video available from Amazon. I can't remember the name of it but I can find out. Here's a still from the video footage:



There are plenty of soldiers that have been in combat that have watched the enemy take multiple rounds and keep coming. As I said before this is documented in numerous books and articles, Black Hawk Down is one book that immediately comes to mind. So you are saying that ANYONE hit in the chest with a 5.56 will immediately be knocked down? Dropping dead from massive trauma or psychological reaction is different than being knocked down. So what are you saying? If you are saying that then we need some evidence because from everything I've seen it's groundless statement.

brad cook

[FatMatt1981]

i was kidding about shooting cats

[FatMatt1981]

how far away from the target is good for practice?
20-25ft or 20-25yrds

[Fly-Sig]

Originally Posted by FatMatt1981

how far away from the target is good for practice?
20-25ft or 20-25yrds

It depends on what you are practicing for. Here's my opinion on self defense practice.

SD shoots are for the most part very close. About arms length or so. Therefore you should be most proficient at these distances, although it may not require the majority of your practice time.


I practice shooting from retention, which means with one hand only, and with the pistol held in close to my side just above the holster. Be sure to keep your support side hand clear! A good technique when drawing your gun is to put your other hand over your navel until the gun is out in front of your body, then bring your support hand up to the gun from behind so as not to put your hand in front of the muzzle. Sorry if this is review for you, but it is the basis of the next part. If shooting from retention, keep the support side hand over your navel, or better would be to place it over the center of your chest. The idea is that if the BG shoots you mid chest you will have your arm/hand there to slow down or even deflect the bullet away from your vitals.

Anyhow, when shooting from retention you are not aiming with the sights, you are merely pointing the gun and "shooting from the hip" to loosely describe it. It's quicker to get off the first shot when shooting from retention and you are keeping your gun away from the bad guy so he cannot take it from you.

The next distance would be the 15-30 foot range roughly. This is where you are cornered and have to shoot your way out of a potentially lethal situation.

Next, I like to practice some longer shots, in the 50-75 foot range. Although very unlikely, it is possible especially in the outdoors to have to make a shot at such a distance.

Just for fun I occasionally shoot some 100 yard shots. Although extremely unlikely to have to make such a shot, it is nice to know that it can be done. About the only scenario I can think of is a sniper while camping/hiking, but anything is possible these days.

When shooting for defensive purposes, good enough is good enough. At Front Sight they teach hand sized groupings, meaning a grouping that you can cover with your hand, or about 4 to 6 inches in diameter. It is a tradeoff of speed vs precision at any distance. At closer distances you can achieve the hand sized grouping with high speed, but at further distances you will have to take more time to carefully aim and squeeze off the shot. Therefore it is important to practice at different distances to learn what kind of speed you can use.

In a real life shooting you will not shoot as well as you do when practicing. You will probably only be half as accurate under threat, so the hand sized groupings will open up but will still be theoretically good enough to hit the vital zones.

Practicing for self defense is different than practicing for precision target competitions and requires a different approach. Try to think of all the possible defensive scenarios and then set up practice sessions for them. Practice shooting from kneeling behind a barricade to simulate shooting from behind a desk in the bank or at the office. Shoot while seated in a chair to simulate a car jacking. Shoot one handed while moving. Mix it up so that you are comfortable shooting good enough at a variety of distances in a variety of situations.

[FatMatt1981]

thank you very much for all the feedback

[C.H.Luke]

"SD shoots are for the most part very close. About arms length or so."

Where did you get your data? Statistically gunfights happen in the 7 to 10 foot range.

"…if the BG shoots you mid chest you will have your arm/hand there to slow down or even deflect the bullet away from your vitals."

Well documented that a hand or arm will not provide any substantial protection from a bullet.

"...good enough is good enough. At Front Sight they teach hand sized groupings, meaning At Front Sight they teach hand sized groupings, meaning a grouping that you can cover with your hand, or about 4 to 6 inches in diameter."

The accepted reason is Handguns are low power weapons therefore, almost without fail, the best Instructors teach shooting "quick, aimed pairs" {at any distance} with a 6" separation because it does the most damage to COM.