Is the XD still "better than" the S&W M&P? - Page 4 - XDTalk Forums - Your HS2000/SA-XD Information Source!

husker_t · 09-20-2007, 12:05 PM

Brickboy, that's kinda' interesting, you're one of many that I've heard complaining of the M&P trigger. Another person I know that had your identical complaint is a LEO with a large agency in CA, and he has tried one as well as many officers he knows. He says because of that trigger, they will not use M&P's if given a choice.

Can you describe in some detail what it is you don't like about the trigger? Is the reset to long? Is the pull distance too long, or the pull weight too high, or what? Wonder if a simple trigger job would make it acceptable.

To sum up the M&P issues, here are the most frequent ones that occur with the M&P. This again isn't to badmouth the M&P or to imply that we couldn't produce a list of issues for the XD as well, but multiple current users are reporting these issues, so it's good to be aware. For example, the rust issue doesn't need to scare you off from buying one (it's still true that the majority of M&P buyers are NOT experiencing the rust problem), but it SHOULD lead you to be careful about putting a good rust protecting solution on your M&P.

Leading current M&P issues:

* Magazine-safety and magazine release types of issues (mags falling out, etc.).

* Poor trigger. (Subjective, but multiple users report the same perception that the trigger is "mushy" or "not crisp" or similar descriptions.)

* Surface rust. (Numerous user reports of rust even on the new stainless melonite-treated slides.)

**nikon777** · 09-20-2007, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by husker_t

Wonder if a simple trigger job would make it acceptable.

yup....... http://www.burwellgunsmithing.com/M&P1.htm

invssgt · 09-20-2007, 06:43 PM

I haven't shot an MP yet so I can't comment on the trigger. I shot one of the first Sigmas that was released to LE in the midwest, and have shot a number of them since. We've had lots of them show up at LE qualifications. It's worth mentioning that I never saw a Sigma

1) Jam, or
2) Break

Trigger pull is a subjective thing. What works for me might not work for you. The trigger on the Sigma isn't 'bad'; it's just different than the mainstream plastic service pistol. Most of us who learned on DA revolvers don't have any trouble with it at all. Treat it like a 14-shot S&W Model 19 and you'll get along fine.

It pains me to say this, but I generally shoot Glocks better in rapid fire, from a combat stance, than I do XD's. The trigger resets faster and just feels better under my finger. Compared to a 1911 or the SA trigger of a Sig or Beretta, I find the XD's trigger pretty sad.

I wasn't aware that the MP was having mag release issues, but that is information worth considering. The Ruger P90 suffered similar maladies and I saw several have their mag catch self-destruct at a qualification. Not a big confidence builder. KelTecs have also had some mag catch issues, and I see that you can now get a steel, aftermarket catch that resolves the wear issues with the OEM plastic part. This doesn't change the fact that KT markets these as defense guns, and could have easily corrected this problem so you the buyer don't have to.

Any new model is likely to have a few 'growing pains' and if this board is any indication the XD45 seems to have had a few itself. It's never a bad idea to let a new model alone for awhile, and let the bugs get worked out.

ARin · 09-20-2007, 09:16 PM

how quickly everyone forgets SW's abysmal history with autoloading pistols.

nonnieselman · 09-20-2007, 09:32 PM

I dont like the Trigger of the M&P... it just gets aggravating to me.. but ive gotten really use to my XD before i handled a M&P so i was (as you can say) spoiled...

**nikon777** · 09-21-2007, 08:08 AM

I still dont get the trigger thing everyone complains about. The MP trigger works just like the XD trigger does.

akhimark · 09-21-2007, 03:01 PM

I rented both the XD40 and the MP40 before I bought. Both shot well but I didn't like having to pick up the MP mag after every few rounds. Went with the XD40sc, added big dot sights, now have about 1k rounds thru it and am getting better at IDPA.

tialloydragon · 09-21-2007, 03:51 PM

Has anyone yet mentioned the Springfield Armoury lifetime warranty? (i'm too lazy to read through all the posts.) Personally, I think that deserves a mention.

**Alaskapopo** · 09-21-2007, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by invssgt

I haven't shot an MP yet so I can't comment on the trigger. I shot one of the first Sigmas that was released to LE in the midwest, and have shot a number of them since. We've had lots of them show up at LE qualifications. It's worth mentioning that I never saw a Sigma

1) Jam, or
2) Break

Trigger pull is a subjective thing. What works for me might not work for you. The trigger on the Sigma isn't 'bad'; it's just different than the mainstream plastic service pistol. Most of us who learned on DA revolvers don't have any trouble with it at all. Treat it like a 14-shot S&W Model 19 and you'll get along fine.

It pains me to say this, but I generally shoot Glocks better in rapid fire, from a combat stance, than I do XD's. The trigger resets faster and just feels better under my finger. Compared to a 1911 or the SA trigger of a Sig or Beretta, I find the XD's trigger pretty sad.

I wasn't aware that the MP was having mag release issues, but that is information worth considering. The Ruger P90 suffered similar maladies and I saw several have their mag catch self-destruct at a qualification. Not a big confidence builder. KelTecs have also had some mag catch issues, and I see that you can now get a steel, aftermarket catch that resolves the wear issues with the OEM plastic part. This doesn't change the fact that KT markets these as defense guns, and could have easily corrected this problem so you the buyer don't have to.

Any new model is likely to have a few 'growing pains' and if this board is any indication the XD45 seems to have had a few itself. It's never a bad idea to let a new model alone for awhile, and let the bugs get worked out.

If you have never seen a Sigma malfunction then you have not shot one near long enough. I have yet to see one that did not.
pat

husker_t · 09-21-2007, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tialloydragon

Has anyone yet mentioned the Springfield Armoury lifetime warranty? (i'm too lazy to read through all the posts.) Personally, I think that deserves a mention.

Yes, that warranty is good. But in all fairness, the M&P is also covered by a lifetime warranty, and normally S&W service is noted for being good by most people. So, I'd consider the service factor to be a tie between the M&P and the XD.

09-20-2007, 06:43 PM	#33
invssgt XDTalk 1K Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,192	I haven't shot an MP yet so I can't comment on the trigger. I shot one of the first Sigmas that was released to LE in the midwest, and have shot a number of them since. We've had lots of them show up at LE qualifications. It's worth mentioning that I never saw a Sigma 1) Jam, or 2) Break Trigger pull is a subjective thing. What works for me might not work for you. The trigger on the Sigma isn't 'bad'; it's just different than the mainstream plastic service pistol. Most of us who learned on DA revolvers don't have any trouble with it at all. Treat it like a 14-shot S&W Model 19 and you'll get along fine. It pains me to say this, but I generally shoot Glocks better in rapid fire, from a combat stance, than I do XD's. The trigger resets faster and just feels better under my finger. Compared to a 1911 or the SA trigger of a Sig or Beretta, I find the XD's trigger pretty sad. I wasn't aware that the MP was having mag release issues, but that is information worth considering. The Ruger P90 suffered similar maladies and I saw several have their mag catch self-destruct at a qualification. Not a big confidence builder. KelTecs have also had some mag catch issues, and I see that you can now get a steel, aftermarket catch that resolves the wear issues with the OEM plastic part. This doesn't change the fact that KT markets these as defense guns, and could have easily corrected this problem so you the buyer don't have to. Any new model is likely to have a few 'growing pains' and if this board is any indication the XD45 seems to have had a few itself. It's never a bad idea to let a new model alone for awhile, and let the bugs get worked out. __________________ It ain't personal. Nothing contained herein is intended is to offend the immature, retarded, hyper-sensitive, emotionally/hormonally unstable, or otherwise easily-offended. But if it does- don't cry to me. I don't care. "Sarge" www.thesixgunjournal.net http://sargesrollcall.blogspot.com/ LOCK & LOAD the VOTE!

09-20-2007, 09:16 PM	#34
ARin XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 488	how quickly everyone forgets SW's abysmal history with autoloading pistols. __________________ Does not provide product support for Chinese gear.

09-20-2007, 09:32 PM	#35
nonnieselman XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: CS, MS Posts: 248	I dont like the Trigger of the M&P... it just gets aggravating to me.. but ive gotten really use to my XD before i handled a M&P so i was (as you can say) spoiled... __________________ Bustmaster AR-15 Remington 700 .22-250 Ruger 10/22 Walther P-22 XD .40 Service 4" with Heinie N/S 2000 Silverado ECSB 6.0/4L80E STS Nitrous So fun!!!!

09-21-2007, 08:08 AM	#36
nikon777 XDTalk 5K Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland, OH. The Danger Zone. Posts: 6,727	I still dont get the trigger thing everyone complains about. The MP trigger works just like the XD trigger does. __________________ Clinging bitterly to guns and religion since 1977.. My Blogspot.

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09-20-2007, 12:05 PM	#31
husker_t XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: WA State Posts: 187	Brickboy, that's kinda' interesting, you're one of many that I've heard complaining of the M&P trigger. Another person I know that had your identical complaint is a LEO with a large agency in CA, and he has tried one as well as many officers he knows. He says because of that trigger, they will not use M&P's if given a choice. Can you describe in some detail what it is you don't like about the trigger? Is the reset to long? Is the pull distance too long, or the pull weight too high, or what? Wonder if a simple trigger job would make it acceptable. To sum up the M&P issues, here are the most frequent ones that occur with the M&P. This again isn't to badmouth the M&P or to imply that we couldn't produce a list of issues for the XD as well, but multiple current users are reporting these issues, so it's good to be aware. For example, the rust issue doesn't need to scare you off from buying one (it's still true that the majority of M&P buyers are NOT experiencing the rust problem), but it SHOULD lead you to be careful about putting a good rust protecting solution on your M&P. Leading current M&P issues: * Magazine-safety and magazine release types of issues (mags falling out, etc.). * Poor trigger. (Subjective, but multiple users report the same perception that the trigger is "mushy" or "not crisp" or similar descriptions.) * Surface rust. (Numerous user reports of rust even on the new stainless melonite-treated slides.)

09-21-2007, 03:01 PM	#37
akhimark XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: York, SC Posts: 411	I rented both the XD40 and the MP40 before I bought. Both shot well but I didn't like having to pick up the MP mag after every few rounds. Went with the XD40sc, added big dot sights, now have about 1k rounds thru it and am getting better at IDPA.

09-21-2007, 03:51 PM	#38
tialloydragon XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Levittown Pa Posts: 143	Has anyone yet mentioned the Springfield Armoury lifetime warranty? (i'm too lazy to read through all the posts.) Personally, I think that deserves a mention.