My home invasion plan

[SD Monkey]

You should have some restraints of some kind available, zip ties or something that can work as hand cuffs. You don't just want a whole lot of guns and ammo. You have to think about how some jackass lawyer or jury member will look at things. "They just planned on killing someone" "They had no handcuffs/ restraints in the house yet they prepared for a BG with the intention of killing someone"

You never fire warning shots, you shoot to stop the bad gun from doing what ever it is he is trying to do to you and once the BG is no longer a threat you handcuff the BG, then call for help if you have not done so already. You handcuff the bad guy even if you think they are dead....

[JonXD]

When I first read the title I thought you were planning a home invasion! As others have said no warning shots. I never thought of that turning off the phone before the shot. I wonder if thats best instead of everything on tape?

[Biggie313]

ok so I am definitely off the warning shot idea. As for lights. I have 2 push button LED lights, very bright, no gun mounts. Not sure what I would do about lights. I the hall would be dark, and I am not sure I want to turn on my bedroom light, they could see my position. A flashlight in one hand and pistol in other will work, but they could see my location if they peak through the window, so i figure I will leave it off until they try to mess with the door.

[jj79]

Originally Posted by Biggie313

As for lights. I have 2 push button LED lights, very bright, no gun mounts.

this will work for the handgun, but you'll need a weapon mounted light for the shotgun. kinda hard to hold a light in one hand, and operate a shotgun w/the other...


-JJ

[jj79]

Originally Posted by SD Monkey

You should have some restraints of some kind available, zip ties or something that can work as hand cuffs. You don't just want a whole lot of guns and ammo. You have to think about how some jackass lawyer or jury member will look at things. "They just planned on killing someone" "They had no handcuffs/ restraints in the house yet they prepared for a BG with the intention of killing someone"

You never fire warning shots, you shoot to stop the bad gun from doing what ever it is he is trying to do to you and once the BG is no longer a threat you handcuff the BG, then call for help if you have not done so already. You handcuff the bad guy even if you think they are dead....

hmmm... this is definitely an interesting point, and one I've never considered.

out of curiosity, what is your source on this? did you hear it from a LEO? CCW instructor? or is it your idea? (no disrespect intended, just genuinely curious)


not too sure about the handcuff the BG once he's down idea...

seems this could be used against you in court, much easier than it could be used in your defense.

think about it...the 1st thing the cops see when they arrive is a dead guy, in handcuffs!!??

how do they know you didn't cuff the guy, then summarily execute him? if I were the prosecuting attorney, I'd be on that like a duck on a june bug....



-JJ

[Biggie313]

ok well i have been looking for a tactical stock, with a rail so i will probably do that then

[SD Monkey]

Originally Posted by jj79

hmmm... this is definitely an interesting point, and one I've never considered.

out of curiosity, what is your source on this? did you hear it from a LEO? CCW instructor? or is it your idea? (no disrespect intended, just genuinely curious)


not too sure about the handcuff the BG once he's down idea...

seems this could be used against you in court, much easier than it could be used in your defense.

think about it...the 1st thing the cops see when they arrive is a dead guy, in handcuffs!!??

how do they know you didn't cuff the guy, then summarily execute him? if I were the prosecuting attorney, I'd be on that like a duck on a june bug....



-JJ

LEO training, do some research and see how many Police Officers have been killed by the bad guy who they thought was dead or out of the fight because the Officer had shot the BG multiple times.

Just because you think he is dead does not mean he is. You handcuff the guy you shot who is obviously alive just the same. A wounded dog is just as dangerous or more. ALWAYS HANDCUFF BEHIND THE BACK, never in front.

You will be giving a statement/ report and it's best to consult a attorney before giving a formal statement to the cops so that you throughly explain the events.

DA's Question: Why was the suspect in handcuffs?

Home Owner: After suspect was shot and went down, I did not know if suspect was still alive or not and needed to insure the suspect could not harm anyone while we awaited for Police and Paramedics.

[jj79]

Originally Posted by SD Monkey

LEO training...

is this training that you yourself have received? are you a LEO?

I totally get it from the LEO side... but fact is, most of us are not LEO's.

I still say it'd look a little fishy (for someone who is NOT an LEO).


your original point was, all guns/ammo, and no restraints could = "this guy was just getting ready to kill someone".

I'd say a dead guy in handcuffs is even more incriminating...?

I mean, lots of civilian folks have home defense guns/ammo....but most don't have handcuffs/zip-ties, ready to cuff the BG's once they've been shot.

if I were on a jury, the freshly-shot perp in handcuffs would look a LOT more out of the ordinary to me...

home-defense weapons, on the other hand, are normal. there are millions of them, all across America.

disarm the perp, YES!!! handcuff him...? not so sure. just MHO...


-JJ

[Reyort]

Just keep the gun on him. If he is wounded, you really don't want to expose yourself to biological hazards (such as an STD). Would really suck if he died and you got HIV because you come into contact with his blood. Why risk it?

Plus if you have to put your gun up or away when you do it. If he comes to while you are cuffing him, you are could be in a situation where your gun is taken from you. Even with a family member covering you, it might not be enough. Would you shoot a BG if he was struggling with a family member?

Just shoot until he stops being a threat and keep the gun on him. If he gets up and wants to up his lead intake, oblige him. But as far as cuffing him, it just seems like a bad deal all the way around.

[SD Monkey]

Originally Posted by jj79

is this training that you yourself have received? are you a LEO?

I totally get it from the LEO side... but fact is, most of us are not LEO's.

I still say it'd look a little fishy (for someone who is NOT an LEO).


your original point was, all guns/ammo, and no restraints could = "this guy was just getting ready to kill someone".

I'd say a dead guy in handcuffs is even more incriminating...?

I mean, lots of civilian folks have home defense guns/ammo....but most don't have handcuffs/zip-ties, ready to cuff the BG's once they've been shot.

if I were on a jury, the freshly-shot perp in handcuffs would look a LOT more out of the ordinary to me...

home-defense weapons, on the other hand, are normal. there are millions of them, all across America.

disarm the perp, YES!!! handcuff him...? not so sure. just MHO...


-JJ

Originally Posted by Reyort

Just keep the gun on him. If he is wounded, you really don't want to expose yourself to biological hazards (such as an STD). Would really suck if he died and you got HIV because you come into contact with his blood. Why risk it?

Plus if you have to put your gun up or away when you do it. If he comes to while you are cuffing him, you are could be in a situation where your gun is taken from you. Even with a family member covering you, it might not be enough. Would you shoot a BG if he was struggling with a family member?

Just shoot until he stops being a threat and keep the gun on him. If he gets up and wants to up his lead intake, oblige him. But as far as cuffing him, it just seems like a bad deal all the way around.

Great responses, this really is one of those topics so full of so many variables and situations that no one answer can answer them all. Way too many what ifs and do's and don'ts. I believe any homeowner who is going to formulate a plan of defense and offense should also include restraints for BG's. Hell the BG can put them on themselves if they are conscious.

Yes millions of gun owners are all across the USA, but how many draw out a plan and train to shoot an intruder much less get personal defense training? No one knows the answer but I doubt the number is very high. I look at things that I have been trained to do as an LEO and Marine and apply them to my HD. Most likely and hopefully you never have to shoot anyone.

You can bet a civil law suite will follow by the family or the perp with the story line of how you been planning on shooting any and all trespassers because you wanted do nothing but kill poor Johnny scumbag.