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Stealing their birth Rights. CDC finds 1 in 5 "mentally ill". By hook or crook.

Prometheus — Sun, 19 May 2013 22:56:43 GMT

Stealing the birth Rights of your children. CDC finds 1 in 5 children "mentally ill". Expounding on the dangers of that and the upcoming anti-self defense laws being proffered as "mental health" issues in this latest blog:

By Hook or Crook, robbing children and adults of their birth Rights.

The anti-self defense zealots will strip the birth Rights of your Children strait out of the gate.

Using multiple references to back up these opinions and the systematic way anti-gun zealots will disarm Americans, it is clearly not by chance. Having failed in the courts and most legislatures, "mental health" is the new 'in' to "subvert Constitutional protections" and advance their twisted agendas.

Please read it and share it.

How is Missouri's views on guns?

wicket1 — Sun, 19 May 2013 03:11:40 GMT

We're thinking about moving to Missouri down near Branson, the scenery is beautiful and it's great for fishing, table rock is wonderful. I was curious how gun friendly Missouri is though?
Do the laws seem to be getting better or worse there with everything going on?

We were originally thinking of moving to Texas but Missouri has a lot more pros for us, that is if it's a firearm friendly enviornment.....

Any folk around there feel free to weigh in..
Thanks!

Do you agree with Piers Morgan & Joe Scarborough?

bijou — Sat, 18 May 2013 23:16:42 GMT

Within the very limited context of these two videos, I do...

Joe Scarborough, Piers Morgan: Obama Scandals Prove Gun Advocates Aren't Crazy

........but not much else they say.

MOLON LABE: Pro-2A song mixing complete

Sgt_Prepper — Sat, 18 May 2013 05:54:59 GMT

Hey, Everyone...

Some friends and I wrote and recorded a pro-Second Amendment, anti-gun grabbing, metal song a few weekends ago. We're passionate about our Rights, so we though we'd write about it.

Gun Ban Song (metal) - Molon Labe (explicit lyrics) - YouTube

Thanks

Breaking: 54 of 62 Colorado Sheriffs join in lawsuit filed this morning.

Prometheus — Fri, 17 May 2013 18:14:51 GMT

13C - Thirteen Colonies: A historic day. 54 Sheriffs join suit against Colorado's new anti-gun laws.

I love this line by Sheriff Maketa at the press conference this AM:
"We each took an oath, the line in the sand has been drawn, and we will stand united!"

White House petitions are a joke.

CheapFuneral — Fri, 17 May 2013 13:55:43 GMT

I've signed several, one that needed millions to pass was cancel Obama care .it got its millions and so the whitehouse was upset. I just got an email from the White House saying that Obama care is not going anywhere and that's a good thing because Obama care is good for us and he knows better then we do ;)

'Media' word games

bijou — Thu, 16 May 2013 16:10:05 GMT

Have you noticed that when an AR-15 is in the hands of a government agency it is a 'Military Style' weapon, but when that same weapon is in the hands of a civilian, it is an 'Assult Weeapon'?

Rifle missing from Grant County sheriff's office | Local & Regional | Seattle News, Weather, Sports, Breaking News | KOMO News

Nope, no bias in the media! :rolleyes:

Dear Gun Control Democrats:

RalphPS — Thu, 16 May 2013 16:06:39 GMT

I listened to the interview on the Gun Talk podcast a week or so back. The author is a left leaning democrat that owns guns. Lengthy but a really good article. It makes one realize that not all left of center folks want your guns.

Dear Gun Control Democrats: 6 Ways to Make a Better Argument | Kontradictions

D.C. Considers Mandatory $250K Insurance Policy for Gun Buyers

RalphPS — Thu, 16 May 2013 12:34:19 GMT

D.C. Considers Mandatory $250K Insurance Policy for Gun Buyers � CBS DC

Open Carry is not grounds for nonvoluntary stops, even Terry Stops

Prometheus — Thu, 16 May 2013 02:16:34 GMT

After having the chance to read the text of the decision, it's truly vindicating for those in RKBA circles as well as for the fourth amendment.

I break down why the Fourth Circuit got it right and highlight some excerpts from the decision.

http://13cgunreviews.blogspot.com/2013/05/open-carry-is-not-grounds-for-non.html

nullification - 10th

g40 — Wed, 15 May 2013 22:43:58 GMT

Interesting read about nullification facts rather than government false led beliefs.
A Basic Civics Lesson for Pseudo-Historians ? Tenth Amendment Center

Registration = Confiscation

AwPhuch — Tue, 14 May 2013 17:54:57 GMT

Been quiet lately on the subject

Found this on another forum I go to from time to time

Just want to know what your take on this is

More than likely posted before...if not...here

9 rounds in mag: NY man arrested

GLADIAT0R — Mon, 13 May 2013 20:42:04 GMT

N.Y. Man Arrested for Gun Violation in NY ? His Offense? Two Extra Bullets | TheBlaze.com

Trends in firearm homicides

sdprof — Sun, 12 May 2013 21:10:54 GMT

The following picture showed up in the funny pictures thread. I think any further discussion belongs here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill in San Jose (Post 3973634)

Great gun control graphic. Any chance to a Iink with a source for the data?

Thanks!

I couldn't find the source of the annotated version above, but did find the following that generally support it. The "union led gun control" is a bit dubious, but the rest seems to reflect reality as we know it.

The chart we see above has been floating around since at least early March.

Here's a lot of the data, and an unlabeled chart, through 2010
U.S. Homicide Rate 1929 to 1940? | Extrano's Alley, a gun blog

Here's another article and collection of interesting data points:
Articles: Murder by Numbers

One more set: The Promise Of Gun Control

NJ senators caught on tape talking about confiscation

SRD — Fri, 10 May 2013 20:21:20 GMT

This is why we can never have a discussion about sensible gun laws. We can not give anything no matter how little it has to stop. This is a topic that cant even have an honest discussion anymore not because we dont want it. Its because we can not trust the opposition in any way shape or form. Their goal which may have seemed maybe in our imagination is clear as day now. Screw them. imaginative safety over liberty is not an option. They will eventually push to far.

CONFISCATION! NJ Senators CAUGHT Mocking Gun Owners Committee Meeting May 9, 2013 - YouTube

Californians read now!

peopleofthesun — Fri, 10 May 2013 07:08:18 GMT

2013 will be the year of the gun -- or whatever guns will be left, if we don�t show up and TAKE ACTION NOW.

Let�s build up a coalition of 100,000+ engaged pro-rights Californians to fight back against these anti-gun bills when it�s going to matter most. That time is coming soon -- we need your help NOW. Help us get the word out by distributing our CalGunFight materials to FFLs, ranges, and everywhere - we need to blanket the state ASAP! Gun grabbers and our allies should not be able to turn around without seeing a CalGunFight poster, flyer, buckslip, or petition.

Please help us get Gun Rights Action Packs to every FFL, outdoor range and 2A friendly business in the state. We've already shipped out hundreds of "Gun Rights Action Packs" to hubs throughout California and need to ramp that up 100x.

Each "Gun Rights Action Pack" consists of:

(2) 'movie-size' full color glossy Take Action posters
(100) full color 1/3 page 'buckslip' flyers
(100) full-color full-page informational flyers
(100) full-page petition forms

You can get FPC-CA�s Gun Rights Action Packs for free. Just Submit a request using this simple form (https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1OV8...Jh1rU/viewform)

So, get and distribute some Action Packs ASAP! Please report back so I can keep track of where we�ve been and where we still need to go. Email me pictures of the posters and materials out in the wild, wherever you place or see them - we�ll put them up for all to see how you and other California gun owners are TAKING ACTION!

If you want to help support FPC-CA and the CalGunFight initiative, you can donate to our efforts, purchase Gun Rights Action Packs to help offset costs, or sponsor (�pay forward�) Gun Rights Action Packs for others to distribute at CalGunFight.com.

We will restock the FPC-CA distribution hubs as necessary. Take Action Now! It�s time for us gun owners to be heard and seen in California. Please feel free to email any questions to me at takeactionca@firearmspolicy.org.

-Cisco

Web: Take Action California | Firearms Policy CoalitionFirearms Policy Coalition
Facebook: http://facebook.com/gunpolicy
Tweet to: @GunPolicy #TakeActionCA

The Firing Line - Clovis

OnTarget Range - Laguna

PRK Arms - Visalia

Gun Friendly Bussinesses

RalphPS — Wed, 08 May 2013 13:39:40 GMT

I just signed up at this site. Could be a great site with user input.

Friend or Foe - Pro and Anti Gun Business Database

Sneaky Bastards!!

cerealbyter — Wed, 08 May 2013 12:45:36 GMT

Round 2 2013

Can't they give it a rest?

Check out what Coburn is doing. It's actually pretty clever, but seriously. Why sneak in a bill for guns when related to water infrastructure. Whatever side he is on, that's just deceitful.

Quote:

Gun rights advocates were also taking the offensive. Sen. Tom Coburn, R-Okla., prepared two gun-related amendments to a water infrastructure bill, and the Senate planned to vote on them Wednesday.

One would require federal agencies to report annually how many firearms and how much ammunition they have, exempting the Defense Department and the CIA. The other would allow firearms on an Army Corps of Engineers water resources facility if it didn't conflict with state law.

Gun Turn-in Participants Miss Out on Cash, Have Privacy Violated

RalphPS — Wed, 08 May 2013 11:24:06 GMT

But one individual has a happy XD outcome!

NRA-ILA | Gun Turn-in Participants Miss Out on Cash, Have Privacy Violated

Gun violence is down in US

mojoman — Wed, 08 May 2013 04:09:32 GMT

So why are the still after ours gun if this is true.

Gun violence in US has fallen dramatically over past 20 years, Justice Dept. report finds - U.S. News

Biden's war on guns at your local church

stuz92 — Tue, 07 May 2013 21:43:21 GMT

Biden Wants Pastors, Rabbis and Nuns to Tell Their Flocks: Enacting More Gun Control Is the Moral Thing to Do

I don't even know what to say, guess they have no morals themselves , willing to bring religion into the debate.

Besides the fact that there is separation of CHURCH and STATE, the DNC took GOD OUT of their convention until there was POLITICAL backlash and they THREW GOD back in. Now these same HYPOCRITES want to USE GOD again for POLITICAL agenda.

Reports Show Gun Homicides Down Since 1990s

metalrogue76 — Tue, 07 May 2013 20:51:26 GMT

From link:
Reports show gun homicides down since 1990s

May. 7 3:24 PM EDT

WASHINGTON (AP) � Gun homicides have dropped steeply in the United States since their peak in 1993, a pair of reports released Tuesday showed, adding fuel to Congress' battle over whether to tighten restrictions on firearms.

A study released Tuesday by the government's Bureau of Justice Statistics found that gun-related homicides dropped from 18,253 in 1993 to 11,101 in 2011. That's a 39 percent reduction.

Another report by the private Pew Research Center found a similar decline by looking at the rate of gun homicides, which compares the number of killings to the size of the country's population. It found that the number of gun homicides per 100,000 people fell from 7 in 1993 to 3.6 in 2010, a drop of 49 percent.

Both reports also found the rate of non-fatal crimes involving guns was also down by around 70 percent over that period.

But perhaps because of the intense publicity generated by recent mass shootings such as the December massacre of 20 school children and six educators in Newtown, Conn., the public seems to have largely not noticed the reductions in gun violence, the Pew study shows.

The non-partisan group said a poll it conducted in March showed that 56 percent of people believe the number of gun crimes is higher than it was two decades ago. Only 12 percent said they think the number of gun crimes is lower, while the rest said they think it remained the same or didn't know.

The trend in firearm-related homicides is part of a broad nationwide decline in violent crime over past two decades, including incidents not involving firearms.

But handguns play a major role in violent crime. The Justice study said that in 2011, about 70 percent of all homicides were committed with a firearm, mainly a handgun.

The data was released three weeks after the Senate rejected an effort by gun control supporters to broaden the requirement for federal background checks for more firearms purchases. Senate Democratic leaders have pledged to hold that vote again, and gun control advocates have been raising public pressure on senators who voted "no" in hopes they will change their minds.

Gun rights advocates have argued that people are safer when they are allowed to own and carry guns. Those supporting gun control say that with more background checks, gun violence would drop because more criminals and mentally unstable people would be prevented from getting weapons.

Not a good sign

masterswimmer — Tue, 07 May 2013 19:19:08 GMT

NH, GA & AZ repubs are wavering:

Are Republicans cracking on gun control?

An awesome article

kmon22 — Tue, 07 May 2013 18:00:10 GMT

Hey all,

Just wanted to post this article written in a university newspaper that is generally pretty left-leaning. Showing some signs of progress!!!

Snell: Waking the dragon ? How Feinstein fiddled while America burned - Iowa State Daily: Opinion

.The Truth About Assault Weapons & High Capacity Magazines .

bijou — Tue, 07 May 2013 17:49:49 GMT

A video worth 5:40 minutes of your time.

The Truth About Assault Weapons & High Capacity Magazines - YouTube

David is the owner of Armed Response which produces very good DVD's

ARMED RESPONSE TRAINING - DVDs & Books

Hearing problems

g40 — Tue, 07 May 2013 17:48:10 GMT

I wonder if I am having hearing problems because when Ted Cruz came on the NRA stage I seemed to be hearing a lot of booing. It seemed equal if not louder than the praise.
Ted Cruz has been one of the greatest supporters of the Constitution for gun rights and he was met with booing at an NRA convention?
Something not right with my hearing I guess.

HR1474 Fire Mission!

hunttheevil — Tue, 07 May 2013 17:11:00 GMT

HR 1474 has been introduced to renew the undetectable firearms act to include the new 3D technology. The bill has been expanded to include firearm lowers and magazines. If the bill is not changed, polymer AR lowers and PMAGS will be illegal!
Reps. Israel and Rangel Introduce Plastic Magazine Ban, Extended Plastic Gun Ban | The Truth About GunsThe Truth About Guns

Long but good read.

KyXDS — Tue, 07 May 2013 01:32:51 GMT

Snell: Waking the dragon ? How Feinstein fiddled while America burned - Iowa State Daily: Opinion

CT's MASSIVE Firearm Paperwork Backlog

HowardMan — Mon, 06 May 2013 15:43:32 GMT

Quote:

Sen. John Kissel, an Enfield Republican who chairs the legislative committee, interrupted Stebbins, thinking the colonel had accidentally added a zero to his backlog calculations. He asked if Stebbins meant to say the backlog had increased to 6,200. “No,” Stebbins responded.

“So it went up 62 times?” Kissel asked. “And that’s the backlog? 62,000?”

CT News Junkie | Lawmakers ?Alarmed? By Firearm Paperwork Backlogs

The paperwork backlog went from 1000 in Dec 2012 to 62,000 now. If this is happening in a dominantly blue state, can you imagine the backlog that would happen if this crap went national?

Pretty good opinion piece in the Iowa State University newspaper.

jonathan171 — Mon, 06 May 2013 03:03:14 GMT

Pretty good opinion piece (with plenty of facts) in the Iowa State University newspaper. Apparently the author had had enough of liberals bashing gun owners and finally decided to write about it.

Snell: Waking the dragon ? How Feinstein fiddled while America burned - Iowa State Daily: Opinion

Judge Jeanine Pirro Exposes Anti-Gun Hypocrisy during NRA SPEECH

1003540 — Sun, 05 May 2013 19:16:06 GMT

Judge Jeanine Pirro Exposes Anti-Gun Hypocrisy during NRA SPEECH - YouTube

Current State Legislation Updates

RalphPS — Sat, 04 May 2013 13:24:32 GMT

NRA-ILA | State Legislation

Continuously updated.

Gun Owners of America Alert

Cnon — Sat, 04 May 2013 07:30:05 GMT

Hey All,

�Gun Owners of America [has] spent the months since Newtown doing tremendous damage, insisting that expanded background checks will lead to a gun registry.� - New York Times, April 4, 2013

It�s quite a complement when the New York Times thinks that you are doing �tremendous damage.� But you can be sure that the other side is not going to go away quietly.
And sure enough, the Obama Administration is trying to unilaterally undo our recent victory in the Senate - and to undo the �damage� that all of us inflicted together.
But first, a little history.
Remember when Senators Pat Toomey, Joe Manchin and Chuck Schumer formed an unholy alliance during the recent gun battle on Capitol Hill? Remember how their amendment would have encouraged your psychiatrist to turn you in to the FBI's gun ban list?
And you remember how we stopped that provision, because over 40 senators found it to be odious and a violation of the Second Amendment?

Well, guess what? Barack Obama has just concluded that "he don't need no stinkin� Senate."
Instead, Secretary Kathleen "ObamaCare" Sebelius - and her Department of Health and Human Services - has promulgated regulations which would, by executive fiat, waive all federal privacy laws and encourage you doctor to report you to the FBI.
Understand a couple of things: First, the standard which your doctor would use to turn you in is embodied in Clinton-era ATF language and in the anti-gun Veterans Disarmament Act of 2007. Specifically, you doctor would "drop a dime" on you if he suspected you were even a slight "danger to yourself of others" or were "unable to manage your financial affairs."
So if they say you can't balance your checkbook, then you lose your constitutional rights.
But there's another problem: The day these regulations become law, lawyers will be lining up to sue "deep-pocket" psychiatrists for every case where they failed to turn in a patient to NICS - if the patient subsequently engages in a horrific act.
The bottom line? Any psychiatrist who failed to report all of his patients to the NICS system risks losing everything if any of them engages in harmful conduct. Soon the rule of thumb will be: See a shrink; lose your guns.
And the regulations will apply to private, as well as government-employed psychiatrists.
The bad news is that 165,000 military veterans have already lost their gun rights because of the �see a VA shrink, lose your gun rights� precedent from the Clinton-Bush era.
Sadly, what happened to military veterans has now begun in the private sector - especially in places like New York, after they recently passed their misnamed SAFE Act.
According to gun rights reporter, Dan Roberts, firearms are now being confiscated from gun owners because of their mental health information. For example:
�[John Doe] received a letter from the Pistol Permit Department informing him that his license was immediately revoked upon information that he was seeing a therapist for anxiety and had been prescribed an anxiety drug. He was never suicidal, never violent, and has no criminal history.�
So now taking anxiety pills can result in one�s forfeiting their Second Amendment rights in New York!
This is where the gun haters want to push their agenda. And this is one reason why background checks are so dangerous - because they give government bureaucrats the opportunity to deny law-abiding people their constitutionally-protected rights.
But the good news is this: The HHS rulemaking is still at an early stage, and HHS is (no doubt reluctantly) taking the views of the general public.
ACTION: Go to the Federal Register - at http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-2013...2013-09602.pdf - and respond to the regs entitled �HIPAA Privacy Rule and the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS).�
Let the HHS know how you feel about waiving all federal privacy laws for people who seek counseling.

You may submit your comments at www.regulations.gov

Also, be sure to tell your congressmen that you oppose the �see a shrink, lose your guns� regs issued by the HHS. Ask him to issue his own comments as well.
The regs themselves lay out several ways that you may submit your opposition. The comment period ends on June 7, 2013.

And my reply:

I believe that the HIPAA Privacy Rule and the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (Document ID HHS-OCR-2013-0002-0001) is a violation of both the second and forth amendments to our Constitution.

Thanks,
Cnon

Obama Blames U.S. For Gun Violence In Mexico

RalphPS — Fri, 03 May 2013 20:11:50 GMT

Isn't this the same Administration that provided guns to LGS that "legally" sold them to straw buyers in Mexico?:mad::shock:

Obama Blames U.S. For Gun Violence In Mexico | RealClearPolitics

TX House Call

g40 — Fri, 03 May 2013 04:43:49 GMT

The Texas House will vote on HB928 Sat. 5-4-2013 which is concerning all of Texas not enforcing or allowing unconstitutional Federal gun controls in the state of Texas. Check into the bill and then call your rep. ASAP. tenthamendmentcenter.com for info.
This is vital to the salvation of the 2nd Amendment. Call your representative and ask their vote of YES on HB928.
Eric Holder is fighting this legislation so you know it needs to be passed.

California passes gun confiscation law on criminals and mentally incompetent owners

KandK_Dad — Fri, 03 May 2013 03:14:50 GMT

if it's a repost I'm sorry.. thought this should be in this sub.

CA Governor Signs Law Allowing Confiscation of Firearms

Quote:

On May 1, California Governor Jerry Brown signed legislation that allows law enforcement to confiscate handguns and assault rifles from Californians who bought the weapons legally but have since had a disqualifying "criminal conviction or serious mental illness."
Legislators believe up to 20,000 Californians will fall under this law, which could mean up to 40,000 weapons need to be confiscated. The legislation "allocates $24 million in surplus funds" to hire "dozens of special agents" to help recover the weapons.
Since California keeps a database of gun owners, they know where every gun is--or where it's supposed to be--and they'll use that database to locate them.
Sen. Mark Leno (D-San Francisco) said the money California has spent to maintain a "tracking program" on firearms has paid off and is now giving the lawmakers "the opportunity to confiscate [these guns]."
No word on when the confiscation will begin.

Minnesota beats back gun control

sansooshooter — Thu, 02 May 2013 18:15:20 GMT

Just got mail from MGOCRA that there will be no gun bills this session.
The anti gunners in the state house went all out to pass some really
strict gun laws.
We have a very active gun population in the state and flooded
all the hearings and wrote and called the legislature.

I am surprised we came out with no new laws!

WA revoking reciprocity with Florida

CheapFuneral — Thu, 02 May 2013 17:19:28 GMT

I just got this email from the NRA! FU Bob didn't want to goto your crappy state anyway! (No offense wa people)

Washington State Attorney General Bob Ferguson (D) who failed to fill out the NRA-PVF candidate questionnaire in his last election, has recently demonstrated an anti-gun and anti-veteran position, by revoking reciprocity with Florida for concealed weapons and firearms license holders.

The punitive action against gun-owners who have Florida licenses to carry concealed weapons or firearms was taken because Florida has honored members of the armed forces and veterans.

In 2012, Florida passed legislation to recognize the men and women of our armed services who have served our nation honorably.

Our nation trains 18 year old men and women in firearms proficiency then sends them off to war and asks them to give their lives, if necessary, in the cause of Freedom.

When they have served our nation honorably and returned home to private life, it is unconscionable to tell them our state will not allow them to qualify for a concealed weapons and firearms license so they may protect themselves and their family because they have not yet reached the age of 21.

Recognizing that our men and women in the military have been called into service in the fight for Freedom when they reach the age 18 - the age of majority, the Florida legislature lowered the minimum age requirement from 21 to 18 years of age for those men and women who have served our nation and have been honorably discharged from the service.

This age waiver ONLY applies to veterans. Every other citizen must be 21 years of age or older.

Because of this recognition of special circumstances involving our brave military men and women, Attorney General Ferguson has chosen to revoke reciprocity with Florida for concealed weapons and firearms license holders.

Florida has honored our veterans, and for that, all law-abiding Florida license holders have been punished by Attorney General Ferguson.

You can help by urging the Attorney General to reinstate reciprocity with Florida and once again recognize our licenses as valid in Washington State.

CALL: Please call Attorney General Ferguson at (360) 753-2702.

E-MAIL: Attorney General Ferguson does not have a publicly available e-mail address, you may send an e-mail to Assistant Attorney General Susan Pierini at: SusanP1@atg.wa.gov

Should the government decide how many bullets you can have to defend yourself?

RalphPS — Thu, 02 May 2013 16:10:08 GMT

From our home grown NC blogger's site. The video is quite thought provoking.

Should the government decide how many bullets you can have to defend yourself? - An NC Gun Blog

Holder Challenging KS Law

ptco911 — Thu, 02 May 2013 01:46:58 GMT

SB 102 The Second Amendment Protection Act being challenged by Eric Holder. Wow what a surprise.

Sensible Advocacy?

DMWyatt — Wed, 01 May 2013 16:45:46 GMT

As someone who favors unregulated access to firearms as a whole, it's frustrating to be writing this post. Here's the rub:

If we are going to be successful in fighting gun control, we need to use a little sense in the manner we go about it. I'm not advocating that we compromise on our rights, nor am I advocating that we back off in any way. That being said...

When we see appeals to emotion, without a solid basis in fact, we have a responsibility to call out such emotion on our side as we are so readily capable of doing when we see it on the other side. I would agree that an armed society is a polite society, but this will ultimately have no bearing on the inner cities of America. The so called "good guys" simply don't live, invest their money, or invest their time in such areas. Neither increasing nor decreasing the numbers of firearms in private hands will affect inner city crime rates. Such measures would logically have even less effect in areas that don't already have an existing problem with violent crime.

Casting ourselves as "law abiding citizens" may make for good emotional appeals and news clips. It does not, however, have a logical bearing on those who make laws. Laws aren't made with law abiding individuals in mind, they're made with the goal to restrict people who don't follow the law. Moreover, all one needs to do to render all of us criminals is to successfully change any number of laws to regulate our currently legal behavior. All too often we paint criminals with such a broad brush that we make recidivism the only logical outcome to assume for anyone going into the system. To put it in perspective, any of us who lives in a state that collects sales tax but haven't filed a return for internet purchases, has committed tax fraud. Any of us who have ever used an aerosol or other chemical in a manner not listed on the container (using brake cleaner to kill wasps, playing with a can of hairspray and lighter, not utilizing standardized hazmat procedures to clean up a broken mercury thermometer, improperly disposing of oil, etc.) have broken federal law. We have wholesale demonized criminals as being a subclass in society, while ignoring exactly how easy it is to classify anyone and everyone as a criminal. I remember a while back a lawyer estimating that the average person commits at least five felonies a day without realizing it. If the table were to turn, and we exposed to the same vitriol we perpetuate, what recourse would it leave us with regard to our rights?

The "false flag" BS needs to be called out for what it is. It's BS. It is also inherently illogical to froth at the mouth with fear of Muslims, Arabs, and would be terrorists, at the same time as the concept that our government is perpetuating all of it gets put forward. Reality is either one way, the other, in-between, or nowhere within this scenario. You cannot have it every which way that suits your mood for the day. The paranoia we currently accept from supposedly pro-gun individuals is doing nothing but artificially raising the prices of guns, getting in the way of day to day life, and beating at us from all sides with unmitigated cow feces.

We cannot expect to win the gun debate by decrying the use of victims and children as pawns for anti-gunners, while using our own children as pawns for our own agenda. Just as many of you choose to carry concealed in accordance with certain logical parameters, so too is displaying your child's proper use of firearms wrought with unintended consequences. Just as seeing child victims paraded around for political gain turns our stomach, seeing children used to demonstrate proper firearms handling triggers an emotional based vitriolic response in anti-gunners. We need to follow the rules we ourselves put forward when it comes to proper discourse.

When we legitimize discussions of armed revolution, all we serve to do is demonstrate innate fear and pessimism that things can ever change for the better. In some ways, defaulting to such rhetoric exposes an expectation that we are resolved to losing the debate entirely. Maybe, just maybe, it would be more sensible to actively engage in the debate and take in all available information, before we resolve to defeat? So many here beat their chests about the sacred nature of the constitution, yet still many would discuss actions which would serve to abolish and change it permanently. The constitution in its current form will NOT follow you into a delusional expectation, of an idyllic future, where the country is divided along ideological lines. (say that 3 times fast)

When we cite SCOTUS cases, we have a responsibility to actually understand why the judges ruled for and against the facts of the case, and how it fits in with legislative and judicial proceedings. How many of you are familiar with Gonzales Vs. Raich? The facts of the case have nothing to do with guns, but the precedence set is an important one to understand. It was one of the first major examinations of the commerce clause in decades, and it has the potential to weigh heavily in many aspects of the gun debate.

Finally, not because I'm done, but because I'm out of time: We need to quit asserting political labels such as liberal, progressive, and conservative, based on a person's stance in the gun debate. We're pigeonholing ourselves by castigating each other into labels and groups. The more we perpetuate such divides, the less likely it is that any logical conclusion in our favor will result. Calling a spade a spade is fine, but you have to know for certain that it is, in fact, a spade.

Chicago Gun Laws At Their Finest!

PoWdA — Wed, 01 May 2013 14:15:57 GMT

17 shot and 3 dead yesterday.

At least three people were killed and 17 wounded in shootings across Chicago overnight as the city saw its warmest weather in seven months.

In one of the fatal shootings, three men were shot in a parking lot across the street from the headquarters of the UIC Police Department, police said. The shooting happened around 10:40 p.m. in the 1000 block of West Maxwell Street, Police News Affairs Officer Amina Greer said.

All three men were taken to Stroger Hospital of Cook County. The conditions of two of them, 19 and 21, were stabilized at the hospital, Greer said. The third man, 19-year-old Tytrell Jackson, was pronounced dead at 11:13 p.m., according to the Cook County medical examiner's office.

About 12:10 a.m., a 27-year-old man was shot in the chest in the 6800 block of South Cornell Avenue, in the South Shore neighborhood, police said.

The man was taken to Northwestern Memorial Hospital, where he was pronounced dead at 12:53 a.m. The medical examiner's office identified him as Darrin Rodgers, of the 6800 block of South Cornell.

About 1:20 a.m., gunfire claimed another life, this time in the Lawndale neighborhood.

Police responding to the scene found a 23-year-old man lying in an alley near the 1900 block of South Drake Avenue, bleeding from multiple gunshot wounds, authorities said.

Pierre Howelett, of the 14300 block of South Halsted Street in Harvey, died on the scene, according to the medical examiner's office.

Earlier, about 7 p.m., three men were shot near the intersection of East 71st Street and South Jeffrey Boulevard, police said. An 18-year-old man, a 22-year-old man and a 23-year-old man were shot, according to Chicago Fire Department officials.

The younger two victims were taken to Northwestern and Stroger, and the 23-year-old refused medical attention for a graze wound.

About 6:15 p.m., three people were shot in the 10800 block of South Princeton Avenue at 6:13 p.m., according to fire officials. They were taken to Stroger Hospital and MetroSouth Medical Center in Blue Island, officials said. The condition of a 16-year-old boy had stabilized, and two men, ages 40 and 44, were listed in serious-to-critical condition.
In other shootings since Tuesday afternoon:

About 9:15 p.m. a police officer shot a 25-year-old man during a foot chase near the intersection of East 89th Street and South Brandon Ave. The man was shot multiple times but was expected to survive, according to Pat Camden, a spokesman for the Fraternal Order of Police. Accounts from residents and police differ.

A 16-year-old boy was shot in a drive-by shooting about 11:50 p.m. in the 100 block of West 68th Street, Greer said. The boy was taken to Stroger, where his condition was stabilized.

About 11:45 p.m., someone with a shotgun opened fire on two 20-year-old men walking in an alley near the 800 block of West 51st Street, police said. One man was struck multiple times, and the other sustained a gunshot wound to the upper back. Both were taken to St. Bernard Hospital and Health Care Center, where they were listed in good condition.

A 24-year-old woman sustained a graze wound to the shoulder about 10:30 p.m., in the 500 block of West Iowa Street, Greer said. The woman was taken to Northwestern, where her condition was stabilized.

About 8:30 p.m., a 25-year-old man was shot multiple times in Washington Park, in the 5700 block of South Russell Drive, Greer said. The man was taken to Stroger, where his condition was stabilized.

A 16-year-old girl was shot on the 700 block of East Oakwood Boulevard at 7:21 p.m., according to police. She was taken to Mercy Hospital and Medical Center with a wound to her arm, officials said.
About 5:15 p.m., a 22-year-old man was shot near Windsor Avenue and Sheridan Road, police said. The man was taken to Advocate Illinois Masonic Medical Center with a wound to his leg.
About 4:30 p.m., a 30-year-old man was shot in the 1000 block of West Garfield Boulevard and was taken in critical condition to Stroger, according to police and fire officials.

Woman poisons OJ at Starbucke

rayikeo2 — Wed, 01 May 2013 13:16:53 GMT

Now the woman are getting into terrorizing in the US.

Poisoned OJ Slipped Into Starbucks Cold Case | ABC News Blogs - Yahoo!

I wonder what country her homeland is?

Gov. Brewer Signs Gun Law

Bonehead — Wed, 01 May 2013 05:38:47 GMT

Did You Know Ariz. Gov. Jan Brewer Signed a Gun Law on Monday?

By Liz Klimas | The Blaze � 11 hrs ago

Gun BuybacksThis Jan. 2013 file photo shows Tucson police officers cataloging a gun gun buyback program outside a police station in Tucson, Ariz. Arizona is now a step away from essentially doing away with the programs with lawmakers approving a bill that would ban cities from destroying the weapons and require them to sell the guns _ part of a broader movement among gun-rights lawmakers to limit gun buybacks. (Photo: AP/Brian Skoloff)

PHOENIX (AP) -- Arizona cities and counties that hold community gun buyback events will have to sell the surrendered weapons instead of destroying them under a bill Gov. Jan Brewer signed into law Monday.
The bill was championed by Republicans in the GOP-controlled Legislature who argued that municipalities were skirting a 2010 law that was tightened last year and requires police to sell seized weapons to federally licensed dealers. They argued that destroying property turned over to the government is a waste of taxpayer resources.
Democrats who argued against the bill said it usurps local control and goes against the wishes of people who turn over their unwanted weapons to keep them out of the hands of children or thieves.
Buybacks are popular among some police and elected officials who either pay cash or hand out gift cards in exchange for weapons. Tucson and other Arizona communities destroyed weapons from the events, arguing that because the guns were voluntarily surrendered, the laws concerning weapons seized by authorities didn't apply.
gun buyback_4New Jersey Attorney General Jeffrey S. Chiesa, at podium, stands with other officials Tuesday, Jan. 29, 2013, in Trenton, N.J. , as he announces that the gun buyback program in January in the state's capital brought in over 2,600 guns, including 700 that were illegal. (Photo: AP/Mel Evans)

House Bill 2455 prompted a furious debate in the state Senate, where Democrats accused Republicans of complaining about an overbearing federal government but then turning around and dictating policies to local governments.
Brewer's office did not release any signing letter accompanying the announcement of more than 30 bill she signed Monday evening, but the Republican governor is a strong gun-rights supporter and had signed the 2010 and 2012 laws.
The governor's office said it received nearly 2,000 letters, emails or phone calls about the bill, with only 25 opposed.
One of the letters in support was from the National Rifle Association, which argued that selling seized or forfeited guns "would maintain their value, and their sale to the public would help recover public funds." The NRA letter said the bill doesn't prevent a private group from holding an event and destroying the weapons.
"However, this measure would ensure that taxpayer resources are not utilized to pursue a political agenda of destroying firearms," according to the letter, sent April 22 and signed by Brent Gardner with the NRA's Institute for Legislative Action.
Maricopa County Supervisor Mary Rose Wilcox, a Democrat who champions the buyback events and survived being shot in the buttocks at the end of a 1997 Board of Supervisors meeting, sent a letter to Brewer urging a veto.
The bill "would force the resale of guns that would otherwise never have been used for violence," she wrote. "How many lives would be lost through the use of weapons our citizens hoped to be removed from the hands of criminals?"
A second bill signed by Brewer on Monday bars cities, towns and counties from collecting or maintaining any identifying information about a person who owns or sells a firearm.

PBS Poll on gun laws

GhostTX — Wed, 01 May 2013 02:59:27 GMT

Be sure to vote! :)

Congressional action on guns | Need to Know | PBS

Leave federal gun laws as they are (94%, 19,200 Votes)
Expand background checks, ban assault weapons and limit the capacity of magazines (3%, 705 Votes)
Only expand background checks (3%, 566 Votes)

Ruger & letting your legislators know how you feel

MrE — Wed, 01 May 2013 00:26:37 GMT

Here's a link somebody posted on a local forum, arizonafirearmsforum.com

Ruger - Protect Your Rights

Ruger's forwarding this to the appropriate folks in the legislature.

A helpful marketing campaign? Sure. I did it.

Penn & Teller on Gun Control

cerealbyter — Tue, 30 Apr 2013 20:53:55 GMT

I'm sure this is floating around somewhere since it's from December but I wasn't able to find it through "search" it just had me cracking up. Sorry if it's a repost.

Penn & Teller on Gun Control

A long but good read on the 2A:

dawgchamp — Tue, 30 Apr 2013 17:27:56 GMT

"Justice Scalia noted that those who argued for a collective-rights interpretation of the Second Amendment have the impossible task of showing that the rights protected by the Second Amendment are collective rights, whereas every other right protected by the Bill of Rights is an individual right."

Hillsdale College - Imprimis Issue

PA Dems Push for "Universal Background Checks"

Krackels — Tue, 30 Apr 2013 14:11:49 GMT

NRA News just posted this on their facebook feed. Time to start making calls to your local reps.

As you may (or may not) already know, we already have handgun registration which makes it illegal to buy a handgun without going through a FFL. As a result, the only firearms that can legally be bought without a background check are long guns (i.e. rifles and shotguns).

We all know that the vast majority of murders are committed with handguns, so this is just another attempt to limit our liberty by chipping away at right protected not only by the US Constitution but also by the PA state constitution.

Quote:

April 29, 2013 Dems push for background checks on all gun sales in Pa.

By John Finnerty CNHI Harrisburg Bureau
HARRISBURG — Pennsylvania Attorney General Kathleen Kane and a group of Democratic state lawmakers have called for a House vote on a bill that would expand background checks to include all gun sales in the Keystone State.

But even the author of the bill, Rep. Steve Santasiero, D-Bucks County, has little faith that the bill would pass. It is unlikely to even come up for a vote, Santasiero said.

Santasiero’s bill essentially mirrors legislation that was unable to pass in the U.S. Senate. Santasiero authored the Pennsylvania bill prior to the U.S. Senate’s rejection of the bill championed by Sen. Pat Toomey. Also, Santasiero thinks there should be a vote so that his peers must stake out public positions on the issue.

“I doubt they even have the support in their own caucus (of House Democrats),” said Rep. Dick Stevenson, R-Mercer County. “If there is not the support to pass it, it seems pointless to ask for a vote.”

Stevenson said it is unclear how effective background checks really are. Such checks do not necessarily prevent weapons from being sold to relatives of people with criminal records or mental illness. In the Newtown shootings, the killer, Adam Lanza, reportedly attempted to buy a firearm but did not get the weapon because he did not want to wait 14-days for a background check. Lanza used weapons taken from his mother.

But even among ardent supporters of gun rights, there are some who have signaled willingness to consider language that would expand background checks.

Rep. Fred Keller, R-Union County, co-sponsored legislation, authored by Rep. Daryl Metcalfe R-Butler County, that would direct state employees to defy any federal laws regarding increased gun control. Keller said he is not sure that the measure would cover background checks, particularly if the background checks become law first. Keller said he is most opposed to any proposal that would limit the kind of firearms available to the public.

Toomey’s move to lead the call for compromise prompted Metcalfe to gather the signatures of 75 other Republican House members on a letter criticizing the senator.

In Pennsylvania, expanding background checks would only impact the private sale — including sales at gun shows and at auctions — of long guns. All sales involving handguns in Pennsylvania require a background check. All sales of firearms at licensed dealers are preceded by background checks.

Kane said that it makes no sense to have background checks for one type of firearm and not all firearms.

“They all shoot bullets,” she said. “They all can kill children.”

Rep. Gary Haluska, D-Cambria County, said that universal background checks would make sense by “leveling the playing field.”

Haluska added that another worthwhile reform would involve reviewing patient privacy rules to determine if there is a way to allow medical professionals to warn police if a psychiatric patient is expressing thoughts of violence.

Finnerty reports from Harrisburg for Community Newspaper Holdings Inc.’s Pennsylvania newspapers, including The Meadville Tribune. Follow him on Twitter @cnhipa.

The National Rifle Association has given $58,042 in campaign donations to 58 of the 203 members of the state House and Senate, according to followthemoney.org, a website that tracks political action committee spending.

Of the 50 members in the state Senate, 19 have taken contributions from the NRA, including 16 Republicans.

Of the $29,217 in donations accepted from the NRA by senators, Republican Bob Robbins, whose constituency includes Crawford County, has taken $7,000 — the highest of the Pennsylvania senators. The next closest is Joe Scarnati, who has accepted $5,275.

Of the 153 members of the House of Representatives, 39 have taken campaign contributions from the NRA, including 28 Republicans.

Of the $28,825 in donations accepted by the NRA, Republican Michele Brooks, whose constituency includes Crawford County, has taken $800. Fourteen House members have accepted more than Brooks, led by Ron Marsico’s $3,500 and Robert Godshall’s $3,460.

Every handgun sale in Pennsylvania must be preceded by a criminal background check, including private sales and sales at gun shows.

All sales of firearms conducted by licensed dealers are preceded by a criminal background check.

Private sale of long guns, including sales at gun shows and public auctions, do not require a background check.

Pennsylvania House Bill 1010 and the legislation under debate in the Senate would close the gun show loophole if it passes.

What do they check for?

The background check process involves accessing both state and federal databases to determine an individual’s eligibility to acquire a firearm or license to carry a firearm.

State databases search:

-Pennsylvania Criminal History Records

-Juvenile Records (contained within the criminal history record file)

- Mental Health File (containing involuntary commitment information and adjudication of incompetence)

-Pennsylvania Protection From Abuse (PFA) File

-Pennsylvania Wanted/Missing Persons File. As an agency organizational segment within a Point-of-Contact State, PICS conducts the check of the federal databases through NICS.

Federal databases search:

-Interstate Identification Index (III), containing criminal history records submitted by states throughout the country, federal and military records

-National Crime Information Center (NCIC), which includes civil protection orders and arrest warrants

HARRISBURG — As they witness the devastation of crime up close, mayors across the state and nation are scrambling to promote gun policy changes that make sense.

But even among mayors, there is little consensus about what that means.

Cloyd Wagner, the mayor of Beavertown in Snyder County, said he joined Mayors Against Illegal Guns because the group sent him an invitation at a time when he felt his borough, population 965, was being overrun by drug gangs.

Wagner said he supports efforts to make it easier to trace guns used in crimes.

Wagner said he has no objection to background checks. But, he feels like, due to the influence of New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg, the mayors’ organization is veering toward positions that he does not endorse.

“I intend to withdraw from Mayors Against Illegal Guns,” Wagner said. “I am against illegal guns. But they are pushing the envelope.”

Bloomberg is the chief source of funding for the mayors’ group, which recently announced that it would begin generating scorecards of legislative records to counter rankings compiled by the National Rifle Association.

At the urging of Mayors Against Illegal Guns, the mayor of Farrell Oliver McKeithan in Mercer County called together an impromptu rally in favor of gun-control legislation. That event was held primarily to gather signatures for petitions supporting the universal background legislation that was previously considered in the U.S. Senate.

Meadville Mayor Christopher Soff said he endorses universal background checks.

“I do not have a problem with universal background checks for all gun purchases, regardless of where or how the guns are purchased,” Soff said. “Let’s just make sure we severely penalize those who violate the law so we can deter the bad behavior of the few, instead of punishing the many who are doing it correctly.”

Lancaster Mayor J. Richard Gray leads the organization Mayors Against Illegal Guns in Pennsylvania and stood alongside Democratic lawmakers and the Attorney General Kathleen Kane to lobby for universal background checks.

The Lancaster mayor said that he has seen the devastation of gun violence up close.

“I’ve attended the funerals,” he said, describing the death of a 7-year-old young girl shot in the cross-fire of gang violence while visiting York.

Gun violence “is a suburban-rural problem,” said Gray, who noted that the Nickle Mines shooting in which five people and the gunman were killed at an Amish schoolhouse happened near his hometown.

Gray said that data is hard to come by to justify the need for expanded background checks. But the absence of data does not justify inaction, he said.

“There might be hundreds of people saved,” he said. “Don’t ask me to prove a negative.”

Finnerty reports from Harrisburg for Community Newspaper Holdings Inc.’s Pennsylvania newspapers, including The Meadville Tribune. Follow him on Twitter @cnhipa.

I bet you if we brought back the death penalty to PA for murders, rape, child molestation, etc and actually used it swiftly we'd see a much faster reduction in violent crime than trying add more restrictions on firearms.

This one bill board I like.

danryan1958 — Tue, 30 Apr 2013 13:32:33 GMT

Native Americans incensed over pro-gun rights billboard in Colorado | Fox News

Bill to stop feds from hoardering ammo

JonXD — Mon, 29 Apr 2013 18:51:21 GMT

I did not see this posted yet and was surprised as well. Did anyone see on foxnews how senators are going to try and propose a bill to stop the feds from buying up all the ammo. They say its part of obamas administation to keep us law abiding citizens from getting any. Im all for it. I know we all heard about DHS.

Manchin Trying Again

ptco911 — Mon, 29 Apr 2013 00:21:00 GMT

There is this problem with liberals/progressives. They can't read and they can't stand to be defeated.

What part of "shall not be infringed" don't they understand?

Manchin says he's working to get another Senate vote on gun background check | Fox News

WA State Puts Gun Control On Ballot

Captain Jack — Sun, 28 Apr 2013 21:46:37 GMT

Fellow Washington State Residents, it's time to educate our friends and neighbors as to why they should vote "NO" to any of their gun control proposals because the communists don't seem to know when to quit.

Link to full story:
A new front for gun background checks: the ballot | Local News | The Seattle Times

Quote:

After struggling to sway both state and federal lawmakers, proponents of expanding background checks for gun sales are now exploring whether they will have more success by taking the issue directly to voters.

While advocates generally prefer that new gun laws be passed through the legislative process, especially at the national level, they are also concerned about how much sway the National Rifle Association has with lawmakers. Washington Rep. Jamie Pedersen, a Democrat who had sponsored unsuccessful legislation on background checks at the state level, said a winning ballot initiative would make a statement with broad implications.

"It's more powerful if the voters do it - as opposed to our doing it," Pedersen said. "And it would make it easier for the Legislature to do even more."

On Monday, proponents of universal background checks in Washington will announce their plan to launch a statewide initiative campaign that would require the collection of some 300,000 signatures, according to a person involved in the initiative planning who spoke on condition of anonymity so as not to pre-empt the official announcement. The Washington Alliance for Gun Responsibility has scheduled a fundraiser in Seattle at the end of next month and hopes to have a campaign budget in the millions of dollars.

Washington state special legislative session next week could include gun control

Kable — Fri, 26 Apr 2013 22:28:12 GMT

I haven't seen any bills being brought up for this yet but you never know what could happen I'm Olympia. Time to call and write your reps again

NRA-ILA | Washington Special Session to Consider Gun Control Measures Under Consideration

NY Times: Senators Quietly Seeking New Path on Gun Control

Dave I — Fri, 26 Apr 2013 19:32:01 GMT

Sneaky little @#$%ers, aren't they?

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/26/us...trol.html?_r=0

-Cheers

North Carolina, Restaurant Carry Passes Committee

RalphPS — Fri, 26 Apr 2013 11:39:09 GMT

So far so good. Headed to the House next week.

Grass Roots North Carolina - GRNC Alert 4-24-13: Restaurant Carry Passes Committee

More Oregon Gun Control Approved

rohicks — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 18:21:13 GMT

Article:
Multnomah Co. approves gun restrictions | KOIN.com

Quote:

Multnomah County commissioners have unanimously passed an ordinance that puts tougher restrictions on gun use.

The ordinance was approved by a 5-0 vote Thursday.

The new law bans possession of a loaded firearm in public, makes it illegal to fire a gun within county limits and requires owners to report the theft a firearm within 48 hours of knowing it was stolen. It requires owners to take measures to prevent access to their firearms by children.

It also extends curfew hours for minors who have been found to have “possessed, purchased, used, transferred or transported a firearm unlawfully.”

Critics had argued that the ordinance would negatively affect rural residents, who they claimed may often carry loaded guns with them out of necessity.

According to the ordinance, in 2012 firearms were used in 891 incidents that were reported to law enforcement agencies in Multnomah County. Furthermore, firearms were used in 45 percent of homicides committed in Portland that same year. Over 1,200 firearms were reported stolen in Portland in 2011 and 2012 combined, the ordinance read.

The ordinance was co-sponsored by Commissioner Deborah Kafoury and County Chair Jeff Cogen.

in plain sight

g40 — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 17:24:11 GMT

While we all are jumping up and down thinking the Fed got beat on gun control the states in plain sight in our faces are doing exactly what the Fed was denied. I don't think the founding fathers gave the states rights to ignore the Constitution or Federal law.
Wake up people it is being done in plain sight. The people are acting like they have no legal constitutional leg to stand on. If these actions are constitutionally looked at they can't be legally done. The states are not separated from federal law. If that were the case then there would be no United States of America.
Article V1 clause 2.

A Question For Our President

RalphPS — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 15:19:53 GMT

This is worth a look. Gives me the chills knowing I may walk near some of these individuals in a parking lot or store. Certainly makes me ramp up my situational awareness.

Gun laws are written for.....:confused:

Charleston Thug Life: A Question For Our President

90% support for Gun Control exaggerated

Fileobrother — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 05:06:19 GMT

Just had this published today, should have been done 3 weeks ago. Let me know what you guys think.

Kudos to Captain Jack and XDTalk Forum for being relevant to the discussion!

Gun Control: Quinnipiac University Study Seems Disingenuous to Gun Owners