9mm Vs. .38. Caliber difference?

[scooter123]

Just a bit of background on the 38 spl.

First, in Europe it's identified as the 9mm x 29R, which means it is a 9mm in some parts of the world.

Technically, it's a .357 caliber round. So why is it called the 38 spl. The reason for this is due to the Russian government. In the 1870's S&W contracted to supply 44 caliber revolvers to the Russian government and they requested a few changes in the guns. Prior to this contract S&W revolvers used what are called "heeled" bullets that featured a bullet the same diameter as the casing with the bullet having a smaller diameter extension that was crimped into the casing. The Russian government requested that the bullets for their guns be a smaller diameter such that the bullet was equal to the inside diameter of the 44 caliber casing. It turns out that the Russians knew a thing or two. One was that the lubrication for the bullet could now be protected by the casing, which meant that barrel leading was greatly reduced. It also turned out that this change resulted in higher accuracy. So, today's 44 revolver ammunitions feature bullets with a .429 diameter, exactly the same as the 44 Russion back in the 1870's. In about 1899 S&W introduced the 38 Special and used the lessons they learned from the 44 Russion. However, because it was replacing a weaker "heeled" 38, they chose to retain the 38 caliber disignation so that the unwashed public wouldn't perceive it as being "weaker" than the older heeled 38. As a result today we have 9mm calibers being referred to as 38's or 380's, with the exception of the 357 Magnum which is simply a 38 spl. with a longer case operating at much higher pressures.

BTW, that is also why 38 spl. ammunition can be used in 357 Magnum handguns without any problems. The shorter 38 spl. case fits easily in the 357 chamber and the bullets are the same diameter. However the reverse won't work because the longer 357 Magnum case won't fit in the shorter 38 spl. chambers. The reason for that is so that the much more powerful 357 Magnum could cause a gun designed for the 38 spl. to blow up.

Now concerning the ballistics. Historically there have been 2 means of measuring the power of a handgun round. One is by using the Momentum, which is a product of bullet Mass times the Velocity. A newer scheme is by using the Energy, which is a product of the bullet Mass times the Velocity Squared. Back when the 38 spl. was first produce Momentum was the measure in use and as a consequence of this most ammunition tended to favoer somewhat heavy bullets. In the case of the 38 spl. that was a 158 grain bullet moving at about 850 feet per second. Take the product and your have 134300. When the 9mm parabellum waas being widely adopted in the US Momentum was considered dated and the predominant measure was now Energy. Because the Velocity is squared, this favors ammunition featuring lighter and faster moving bullets. Common 9mm ammo today runs a 124 grain bullet at 1100 feet per second. Under Momentum this produces a product of 136400. So under the Momentum measure the 38 spl. and the 9mm parabellum are roughly equal. However, when you compare the Energy, the 38 spl. comes in at about 200 ft.lbs. and the 9mm at about 300 ft.lbs. In terms of Energy the 9mm trumps the 38 spl. However, in terms of effectiveness, the 38 spl. and 9mm have both proven to be fairly effective calibers.

IMO, the greatest difference between the 38 spl. and the 9mm is in the guns they are used in, the 38 is commonly used in a revolver and the 9mm is normally used in a semiautomatic. However, there are always exceptions, the S&W model 52 is a 38 caliber semi and the 547 is a 9mm revolver.

PS; as noted in previous posts you can use either 9mm or 38 caliber bore bushes interchangeably, in fact with most brands today you'll find them marked 9mm/38 caliber.

[Frenchy]

And the .38/200...Essentially the .38 S&W, but a British military load for the Enfield and Webley revolvers.

[cypress]

I don't know if you guys have noticed but "Amber" has been a member here for 2 years, yet she is new to guns. There is always something new to learn but in that amount of time she should have learned the answer to those questions by osmosis if she was really interested.

[john_bud]

Originally Posted by cypress

I don't know if you guys have noticed but "Amber" has been a member here for 2 years, yet she is new to guns. There is always something new to learn but in that amount of time she should have learned the answer to those questions by osmosis if she was really interested.

I've been around guns for 45 years or so since Dad showed me how to shoot a bb gun, then a .22, etc etc and I still learn something new every once and again. (Actually fairly often, like the information on the .38 spl history above).

[JeffXD]

Originally Posted by agalindo

Wouldn't it be funny if "Amber" turned out to be this guy. Sitting at home laughing this A## off at all the guys insulting each other in order to defend "her".

HEY!!! That's my dad!!!!

[Amber]

Originally Posted by cypress

I don't know if you guys have noticed but "Amber" has been a member here for 2 years, yet she is new to guns. There is always something new to learn but in that amount of time she should have learned the answer to those questions by osmosis if she was really interested.

So i dont shoot alot!! Big Deal. I dont even shoot once a week or twice a month. An di only have 2 handguns, a 9mm and a .22. I dont have a .38. It was just a question.

[Klaws]

Ignore the haters.

There can be quite a lot of them in here, but don't let them win.

[Amber]

Either you (who have accused me of using a girls picture and name) dont like my picture for some reason or..for some reason you think a girl my age cant be interested in guns. Whatever the case, i've had it. I am not only removing my avatar but this is my last post with my name. I'll rejoin, using a man name and no avatar. I'll keep posting my stupid questions as a man , and i'll prove to you, those who have answered me didint do it to get a date with me. Theres still good people in this world who believe in helping others, without anything in return.. Thanks very much for focussing more on my being who i am or who i am not, and not on my questions.

The rest of you people, who have answered my questions, which were dumb, and stupid, and nonsense, and trivial, and there was absolutely no reason to ask those questions, but you still answered them anyway, thank you all for your advice and help. God bless you all.

Good moment for you cannibul, u wont be seeing stupid questions with my avatar and name anymore. Same goes for you Cypress. I guess your comment about me "stoking up the testosterone" and i quote "Congrats Amber, you succeeded in stoking up the testosterone, which usually happens when you drop in" the other finally got you what you wanted. Maybe i should an all woman forum. That ought to get me information without accusations.

When i rejoin as a male, i'll let my friends know who i am. Till then, goodbye. Take care.

God bless you

[Klaws]

Your letting them win.

Bummer.

[Amber]

Originally Posted by Klaws

Your letting them win.

Bummer.

I dont want to Klaws. Just look at the 5 pages of response to my question. How many answers i got and how many accusations?
I only joined this forum 3 years ago for one reason. I wanted to learn about firearms and be a good and safe gun enthusiast. Thats all. Then i met alot of nice people here and made godo friends with them. That became the second reason to remain a member here. To have good friends and a good healthy relationship with people from all over with all kinds of experience to share and be like a family. Thats what it's been like for 3 years for me. Alot of peopl ehere have treated me like family and vice versa. But i am tired of all this crap that i get cuz of my avatar and name.

My dumb questions are too annoyeing for these highly educated and experienced people. Some of them were probably born with guns in their hands, i was not. I hadn't even fired a gun till i was 19!!!

I am sorry if i seem harsh or rude or whatever, i am just tired of all this.