Caliber question

[soberbill]

Hello again all,

Thank you so much for your input/suggestions/ideas for my first bolt action. I'll not go into all the gory details, but did spend a few hours looking at many of the suggestions. Looked at intro gun packages with scopes. Generally, they didn't great in my hands. The actions we a bit rough. Generally full size packages were in the $350 - $400 range.

Then I stumbled accress a Weatherby Vanguard on sale for $350. The scopes I saw on the other rifles ran approx $100, so with bore sighting and rings going that route would run approx $500. The action and tribber on the Weatherby was not even close to the other rifles so I'm leaning that direction.

But....they don't stock the .223 and the reason for the sale is the Vangards are discontinuted and being replaced with the Vangard II.

The Weatherby calibers are expense to shoot/buy so I'm not looking at them. This leaves me the following options.

.243
.270
.308

Any suggestions/exeperices with these rounds for availability, ease of purchase, general cost will be greatly appreciated.

I have check the prices this week, but have no idea if that is how they generally run or not. I believe the .308 is a nato round so should be easy, but being new would rather hear from others with more experiece.

Thx again Bill

PS, also ran accross an 1895 Loewe Mauser, what a smooth action. But a 100 year old rifle brings with it many other concerns...

[diyj98]

Since you're just punching paper, of the three you listed, I'd go with the 308. Recoil will be a bit more than the .243, but the 308 isn't a hard kicking magnum by a long shot. The caliber has been proven to be very accurate and you may be able to find cheap surplus ammo if you really want to cut costs.

[EMN83]

I'd go with the .308 also

[Jeanjacket]

In with the .308 crowd. Ammo availability being one of the foremost reasons. But it's a good all around round, for any purpose really. 2nd place goes to the 270.

[Dago_Red]

If you're doing more paper than hunting definitely the 308, and overall cost will be lowest (if you're buying not reloading which doesn't sound like you'll be doing). of the other two i'd ask what you were planning to hunt.

Ammo cost and availability/variety are my biggest concerns with regards to choosing a round nowadays.

Red

[apexhunter]

The good thing about a .308 is is is an excellent round for both target and hunting situations. Like diyj98 mentioned recoil is very manageable, especially with a nicely straight stocked rifle and as long as you stay under 168gr or so in bullet weight (due to slower twist barrels of most .308 rifles) there isn't many north american game that the .308 can't handle. And if the round is good enough for scout snipers it is definitely accurate enough for the average target shooter.

[EMN83]

for a reference, my .308 1:10 twist can put 178gr Hornady A-Max into 1/2 MOA groups at 100 yards. Savsge have a 1:10 twist, and mine at least, really likes the heavier bullets

[apexhunter]

Savage and some Remingtons are a couple of the exceptions with 1 in 10" twists but many brands of .308 barrels have 1 in 12". The faster twist definitely handles 170+gr projectiles well but the 1 in 12" is normally best with 168gr or less bullets..especially at longer ranges where spin velocity is critical to stabilize heavier/slower bullets.

A typical 168gr @ 2700'/sec will rotate @ 162,000rpm in a 1 in 12" twist while a 180gr at 2600'/sec will be at 156,000. This means the heavier & slower 180gr is on the cusp of not having enough rotation for total gyroscopic stability especially at longer ranges. Out of a 1 in 10" the same projectiles will spin at 194,000 and 187,200 rpm respectively which is plenty of spin for proper stabilization.

The point was to match the bullet weight to the twist for accurate and dependable bullet stability...this goes with any rifle. Many people are finding this out with heavier fodder in slower twist AR barrels. My X-Bolt and Montana with 12" twist rates love my 168 Berger loads and print sub 1/2" groups all day long but with anything heavier they start to wander around- especially at 300+ yards.

[EMN83]

Originally Posted by apexhunter

Savage and some Remingtons are a couple of the exceptions with 1 in 10" twists but many brands of .308 barrels have 1 in 12". The faster twist definitely handles 170+gr projectiles well but the 1 in 12" is normally best with 168gr or less bullets..especially at longer ranges where spin velocity is critical to stabilize heavier/slower bullets.

A typical 168gr @ 2700'/sec will rotate @ 162,000rpm in a 1 in 12" twist while a 180gr at 2600'/sec will be at 156,000. This means the heavier & slower 180gr is on the cusp of not having enough rotation for total gyroscopic stability especially at longer ranges. Out of a 1 in 10" the same projectiles will spin at 194,000 and 187,200 rpm respectively which is plenty of spin for proper stabilization.

The point was to match the bullet weight to the twist for accurate and dependable bullet stability...this goes with any rifle. Many people are finding this out with heavier fodder in slower twist AR barrels. My X-Bolt and Montana with 12" twist rates love my 168 Berger loads and print sub 1/2" groups all day long but with anything heavier they start to wander around- especially at 300+ yards.

Totally agree, was just pointing out that there are options for faster twist. In fact, when I re barrel next winter, I'm looking at a 1:11 twist, since I plan on shooting 180gr bullets max