You want a varmint rifle, yet you've chosen 6.8mm SPC?
With the ammo expense and current lack of ammo availability, why would you chose that caliber? I just finished a 6.8mm build and will be reloading, but finding brass alone is an issue right now.
Have you looked into the .204 Ruger? From what I've been reading it's got great ballistics further out than 6.8mm and .204 Ruger ammo appears to be readily available.
Not trying to get you to switch gears, just wanting to suggest that you look into 6.8mm thoroughly.
If I was gonna build a "varmint AR", why not build it on the .243? The .204 is a pretty flat shooting round, but it's a bit light to be bucking gusts. The .223 isn't quite as flat shooting, but is plenty good for varmints, but the fact that you liked the 6.8 made me think you want something a little different. I think the .243 would be a good round for you, it's great on the varmints, flat shooting with the lightest rounds and still pretty flat shooting and not hard recoiling with some of the heavier bullets.
Start with this. Go to www.gunbroker.com and type in 6.8 and see how many firearm/upper results you get then type in 6.5 grendel and see how many you get. 6.5 is more fluiddynamic, and has more punch. If you don't want a 22-250, 204 or 223 all great varmint rounds go for the 6.5 grendel, you can order the upper today, personally I'd say at minimum go a 20" barrel and free float barrel. www.65grendel.com has some charts that when you read them will make you realize, that 6.8 costs just as much and isn't nearly as good. Once you get the brass for 6.5, the 6.5 bullets are readily available.
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I still do NOT understand why so many people are all about the 6.5 Grendel and the .260. I have seen some claims about the 6.5 Grendel and the .260 saying that they’re both superior to the .308 in terms of wind drift, bc, kinetic energy, etc. I have even seen some articles like this http://demigodllc.com/articles/the-c...260-remington/ that are claming things like the .260 even puts the .300 winmag to shame. THIS IS HYPE AND COMPLETE BS. I will talk more about that issue in a sec.
I just wanted to start off this post by saying that I personally believe that there is WAY too much hype behind the 6.5 Grendel, .260 and the 6.8 spc. Now the 6.5 Grendel and the .260 are kind of a medium cartridge between the .308 and the .243. The 6.5 Grendel will fire some of the lighter bullets at a pretty decent speed. Chuck Hawk lists the 6.5 Gendel as firing a 100 grain bullet at around 2800 fps and 2850. http://www.chuckhawks.com/6-5mm_grendel.htm . Some of the heavier bullets like 120 grainers have a muzzle velocity between 2530-2630 fps. (also on chuck hawk’s page). The funny thing about people that claim the 6.5 Grendel is so much better than the .308 don’t take several things into account. The .308 will push a 150 grain bullet between 2980-2700 fps, depending on the load. http://www.pacinfo.com/~dropinsator/....htm#308%20Win . Even the military has loading of the 168 grain bullet that are traveling at least 2680 fps. (a moderate loading, not too hot). This means that the .308 will push a bullet that is 48 grains heavier than the 6.5 Grendel, exactly the same speed. Since they will have a very similar time of flight, because they have a similar speed; this means that IF they were the same weight of bullet, they would have similar wind drift. They do NOT have the same weight of bullet, and therefore, the .308 will have LESS wind drift than the 6.5 Grendel. With some of the lighter bullets, the 6.5 Grendel MIGHT have the same or less wind drift. Because they have very similar velocities, the drop on the bullets will be slightly different, but still pretty close.
There are basically 2 thoughts on wind drift. You can fire a light bullet extremely fast; which means that it has a short time of flight, and therefore less time for the wind to affect the bullet. You can also fire a heavy bullet a little slower; although it will have a longer time of flight, since the projectile is heavier, it will be more difficult for the wind to push it.
The .243 sometimes DOES have less wind drift than the .308, even at long distances because of how much faster the bullets are sometimes moving. People that will claim the 6.5 Grendel, .260 or 6.8 spc have “better long range ballistics” than the .308, etc, are only talking about the very light bullets that the .260, 6.5 Grendel shoot, and comparing them to the heavier bullets that the .308 is shooting. Keep in mind that just because the bullet has less drop, does not mean that it will be a better long range cartridge, it merely means that the bullet will shoot flatter.
Something else that I always hear from the 6.5 Grendel and .260 guys: the high BC bullets of these calibers don’t slow down as quickly as the .30’s (.308, .300 winmag, etc), and they claim that even if they start out at close to the same speed, the BC means at longer range the .30’s aren’t going nearly as fast. For those guys that claim this, I have news for you, There ARE high BC bullets for the .30’s as well, some that have MUCH better BC’s than the 6.5 bullets. If I remember right, Lost River Ballistics (who got bought out by hooker I believe) had a 180 grain bullet that had a BC of something ridiculous like .89-90. I also think it’s funny how the guys that shoot 6.5mm Grendel or .260, like to compare the velocity of those rounds, against the .308 or .300 winmag out of a 24” barrel. You give a .300 winmag or a .308 a 26” barrel and some high BC bullets like 210 VLD’s, 180-190 Lost River, or 155 Scenars, and the 6.5 Grendel and .260 won’t even hold a candle to them. A .300 winmag will push a 180 grain bullet over 3,000 fps, and some of the 210 Bergers around 2700 fps. I assure you that the .260 can’t touch that kind of velocity and weight of bullet, but the guys that are all about the .260 say that it does.
Please realize that I am NOT saying that the 6.5 Grendel or the .260 are bad cartridges. I am merely saying that I believe that some of these cartridges are a fad, and that some of the guys that like to play with these cartridges are making people believe that they are the “cat’s meow”, and people aren’t looking at the ballistics. It’s fine if you want to have a caliber to play with that most everybody else doesn’t, just realize it probably doesn’t do anything special that other calibers can’t. The .260 and 6.5 Grendel both have their place, and I personally believe that’s right in between the .308 and .243. If you do not reload, I would personally stay away from the 6.5 Grendel, even if you do reload, I’d probably still consider the .243 or .243 AI. I would take the .243 AI any day of the week against the 6.5 Grendel, just from how easily you can get components and loads for each. From what I have heard there is only 1-2 makers of brass for the 6.5. There is also a pretty limited choice of bullet weights and manufacturers of them. With the .243 or .308 there are MANY choices of quality brass manufacturers and bullet manufacturers. If you just want to play with the 6.5 Grendel, then go for it, I just don’t want people expecting it to be the greatest thing in the world and beating the socks off of the .243 or .308, when it won’t. The 6.5 Grendel will cost you more to reload and shoot, you will have less choices of bullets, etc, and I personally believe won’t do anything special that others can’t do. Just look at the numbers for yourself, make an educated decision, and don’t buy into all the hype.
Oh yeah, I just wanted to apologize if I hijacked the thread. That was not my intention, but I just felt like someone needed to cover the ballistics of the 6.5 a little better, since I know it's quite popular with the AR crowd.
I still do NOT understand why so many people are all about the 6.5 Grendel and the .260. I have seen some claims about the 6.5 Grendel and the .260 saying that they’re both superior to the .308 in terms of wind drift, bc, kinetic energy, etc. I have even seen some articles like this http://demigodllc.com/articles/the-c...260-remington/ that are claming things like the .260 even puts the .300 winmag to shame. THIS IS HYPE AND COMPLETE BS. I will talk more about that issue in a sec.
I just wanted to start off this post by saying that I personally believe that there is WAY too much hype behind the 6.5 Grendel, .260 and the 6.8 spc. Now the 6.5 Grendel and the .260 are kind of a medium cartridge between the .308 and the .243. The 6.5 Grendel will fire some of the lighter bullets at a pretty decent speed. Chuck Hawk lists the 6.5 Gendel as firing a 100 grain bullet at around 2800 fps and 2850. http://www.chuckhawks.com/6-5mm_grendel.htm . Some of the heavier bullets like 120 grainers have a muzzle velocity between 2530-2630 fps. (also on chuck hawk’s page). The funny thing about people that claim the 6.5 Grendel is so much better than the .308 don’t take several things into account. The .308 will push a 150 grain bullet between 2980-2700 fps, depending on the load. http://www.pacinfo.com/~dropinsator/....htm#308%20Win . Even the military has loading of the 168 grain bullet that are traveling at least 2680 fps. (a moderate loading, not too hot). This means that the .308 will push a bullet that is 48 grains heavier than the 6.5 Grendel, exactly the same speed. Since they will have a very similar time of flight, because they have a similar speed; this means that IF they were the same weight of bullet, they would have similar wind drift. They do NOT have the same weight of bullet, and therefore, the .308 will have LESS wind drift than the 6.5 Grendel. With some of the lighter bullets, the 6.5 Grendel MIGHT have the same or less wind drift. Because they have very similar velocities, the drop on the bullets will be slightly different, but still pretty close.
There are basically 2 thoughts on wind drift. You can fire a light bullet extremely fast; which means that it has a short time of flight, and therefore less time for the wind to affect the bullet. You can also fire a heavy bullet a little slower; although it will have a longer time of flight, since the projectile is heavier, it will be more difficult for the wind to push it.
The .243 sometimes DOES have less wind drift than the .308, even at long distances because of how much faster the bullets are sometimes moving. People that will claim the 6.5 Grendel, .260 or 6.8 spc have “better long range ballistics” than the .308, etc, are only talking about the very light bullets that the .260, 6.5 Grendel shoot, and comparing them to the heavier bullets that the .308 is shooting. Keep in mind that just because the bullet has less drop, does not mean that it will be a better long range cartridge, it merely means that the bullet will shoot flatter.
Something else that I always hear from the 6.5 Grendel and .260 guys: the high BC bullets of these calibers don’t slow down as quickly as the .30’s (.308, .300 winmag, etc), and they claim that even if they start out at close to the same speed, the BC means at longer range the .30’s aren’t going nearly as fast. For those guys that claim this, I have news for you, There ARE high BC bullets for the .30’s as well, some that have MUCH better BC’s than the 6.5 bullets. If I remember right, Lost River Ballistics (who got bought out by hooker I believe) had a 180 grain bullet that had a BC of something ridiculous like .89-90. I also think it’s funny how the guys that shoot 6.5mm Grendel or .260, like to compare the velocity of those rounds, against the .308 or .300 winmag out of a 24” barrel. You give a .300 winmag or a .308 a 26” barrel and some high BC bullets like 210 VLD’s, 180-190 Lost River, or 155 Scenars, and the 6.5 Grendel and .260 won’t even hold a candle to them. A .300 winmag will push a 180 grain bullet over 3,000 fps, and some of the 210 Bergers around 2700 fps. I assure you that the .260 can’t touch that kind of velocity and weight of bullet, but the guys that are all about the .260 say that it does.
Please realize that I am NOT saying that the 6.5 Grendel or the .260 are bad cartridges. I am merely saying that I believe that some of these cartridges are a fad, and that some of the guys that like to play with these cartridges are making people believe that they are the “cat’s meow”, and people aren’t looking at the ballistics. It’s fine if you want to have a caliber to play with that most everybody else doesn’t, just realize it probably doesn’t do anything special that other calibers can’t. The .260 and 6.5 Grendel both have their place, and I personally believe that’s right in between the .308 and .243. If you do not reload, I would personally stay away from the 6.5 Grendel, even if you do reload, I’d probably still consider the .243 or .243 AI. I would take the .243 AI any day of the week against the 6.5 Grendel, just from how easily you can get components and loads for each. From what I have heard there is only 1-2 makers of brass for the 6.5. There is also a pretty limited choice of bullet weights and manufacturers of them. With the .243 or .308 there are MANY choices of quality brass manufacturers and bullet manufacturers. If you just want to play with the 6.5 Grendel, then go for it, I just don’t want people expecting it to be the greatest thing in the world and beating the socks off of the .243 or .308, when it won’t. The 6.5 Grendel will cost you more to reload and shoot, you will have less choices of bullets, etc, and I personally believe won’t do anything special that others can’t do. Just look at the numbers for yourself, make an educated decision, and don’t buy into all the hype.
That was one kick ass rant!!! Well thought out and backed up with facts. This is exactly the kind of info that I am looking for when weighing my options.
I am planning on buying a dedicated .308 AR, i am just thinking about a heavier caliber upper that will be compatible with my .223 lower.
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