9mm Defense rounds - XDTalk Forums - Your HS2000/SA-XD Information Source!

KyXD40 · 09-30-2005, 05:53 PM

Greetings all....I am purchasing an XD-9sc and have a couple questions. First, I think I read somewhere that I could use my XD-40 mags in this "9" without any modification. True or Not? Comments?

Second, it's been decades since I studied the ballistics etc of the 9mm as a defensive round. So many types of 9mm now that I am getting lost in details. What makes the best round...heavier weight with lower velocity, faster velocity with lighter bullit, or "as heavy as possible with velocity at least 1000fps".....I am so lost in trying to decide the best here.

I would love all comments that will help here. Thanks!

ichy_trigger · 09-30-2005, 07:17 PM

Being a short barrel, you will loose alot of velocity versus the longer barrel. For that reason, I carry 115 grain Gold Dots in my SubXD so I will be more apt to get reliable expansion. As far as the mags, I use 9mm mags but I think you can tweak the feedlips on the .40 mags to make them work.

nframe · 10-02-2005, 12:03 PM

There are so many opinions about this, it's hard to decide what to carry. For what it's worth I carry Winchester Ranger 127 gr. +p+ in my XD-9 sc, I chose it because it's going to penetrate better than the 115's, and expand more reliably than a subsonic round. It's a proven LE round with a sound record of ending conflicts quickly. With that being said practice multiple shots, an adversary rarely goes down with just one shot! I practice at least a double tap but mainly triple taps. Another good load to consider is the Speer 124 gr Gold Dot +p, also DoubleTap is making 9mm ammo now and has been getting excellent reviews, they load in 115,124,147 gr weights all loaded to +p pressures. I use their 10mm loads frequently and can vouch for their quality. Hope this helps.

retired · 10-02-2005, 02:26 PM

Go to tacticalforums.com, then to its Terminal Effects forum. Do a search for "LE Gel testing April 2005." Should give you what you want to know.

KyXD40 · 10-02-2005, 02:34 PM

Thanks for the replys....also wondering about specialty ammo that might be useful for the first several rounds of a mag. There seem to be many of those types, too.

Anyone with experience or opinions for or against things like the Glazer rounds, Gold-Dots, Cor-Bon or whatever?

thanks

nick19 · 10-02-2005, 05:23 PM

You may want the check out these posts:

http://www.hs2000talk.com/viewtopic.php?t=24283

When you are ready to buy you may want to give this guy a try. Quite a few of us have bought from him:

http://www.hs2000talk.com/viewtopic.php?t=22368

RiverRat59 · 10-05-2005, 07:06 PM

Guess I'm a LITTLE old fashioned. I carry the good 'ole Winchester 147gr Silvertip HP in my XD9SC.

ampleworks · 10-05-2005, 09:25 PM

127gr +P+ Ranger-Ts are the best for short barrel, 124gr +P GoldDots are second down my list.

A while back I did some chronograph tests and found that the 124s were giving a higher power factor (weight x velocity) than the 127, three grains of lead shouldn't have made that much of a difference, given the rangers were rated +P+, they were still not as hot as the +P GoldDots. Something to consider that this was out of a 4" barrel, I don't have a 3" or I'd test it.

orc4hire · 10-06-2005, 08:15 AM

9mm loads recommended by DocGKR, a ballistics expert who posts over on Tactical Forums (in no particular order):

Triton 115 gr +P JHP (TR9HVA)
Fed 124 gr JHP (LE9T1)
Speer 124 gr +P JHP (53617)
Win 124 gr JHP (RA91P)
Win 127 gr +P+ JHP (RA9TA)
Fed 135 gr +P JHP (LE9T5)
Rem 147 gr JHP (GS9MMC)
Speer 147 gr JHP (53619)
Win 147 gr JHP (RA9T)

'Gimmick' ammo like Glaser safety slugs is NOT recommended.

Pick one that works well in your gun, practice, and don't worry any more about ammo selection. Any bullet will do the job if you put it in the right spot. No bullet will do the job if you miss.

Wreckage · 10-07-2005, 07:13 AM

A good understanding of physics goes a long way in understanding ballistics. Kinetic energy (ft/lbs) is equal to half the mass multiplied by the square of the velocity.
E=(M/2)*V*V
Obviously, velocity is much more important than mass to achieve higher energy. I have read many tests and in all of them the heavyweight 9mm have been outperfromed by the midweights. In a nutshell, the heavyweights lack sufficient velocity to expand properly, thereby overpenetating and underexpanding (if expanding at all). The light weights show explosive expansion with poor penetration. The middlewights fall right in between, penetrating and expanding reasonably.

A few words on penetraion and expansion. Penetration is required to reach vital organs. Expansion is necesary to transfer maximum energy and make a wider wound channel in the hopes of reaching vital organs.

On a side note, my XD-9 shoots high with 147gr and spot on with 115gr at practical ranges

09-30-2005, 05:53 PM	#1
KyXD40 XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 265	9mm Defense rounds Greetings all....I am purchasing an XD-9sc and have a couple questions. First, I think I read somewhere that I could use my XD-40 mags in this "9" without any modification. True or Not? Comments? Second, it's been decades since I studied the ballistics etc of the 9mm as a defensive round. So many types of 9mm now that I am getting lost in details. What makes the best round...heavier weight with lower velocity, faster velocity with lighter bullit, or "as heavy as possible with velocity at least 1000fps".....I am so lost in trying to decide the best here. I would love all comments that will help here. Thanks! __________________ Rod Retired and loving it! "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" Edmund Burke 1770 "No success in life can compensate for failure in the home" David O. McKay

09-30-2005, 07:17 PM	#2
ichy_trigger XDTalk 5K Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Dayton, Ohio Posts: 7,417	Being a short barrel, you will loose alot of velocity versus the longer barrel. For that reason, I carry 115 grain Gold Dots in my SubXD so I will be more apt to get reliable expansion. As far as the mags, I use 9mm mags but I think you can tweak the feedlips on the .40 mags to make them work. __________________ "The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." http://militarysignatures.com/signatures/member2645.png

10-02-2005, 02:34 PM	#5
KyXD40 XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 265	Thanks for the replys....also wondering about specialty ammo that might be useful for the first several rounds of a mag. There seem to be many of those types, too. Anyone with experience or opinions for or against things like the Glazer rounds, Gold-Dots, Cor-Bon or whatever? thanks __________________ Rod Retired and loving it! "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" Edmund Burke 1770 "No success in life can compensate for failure in the home" David O. McKay

10-02-2005, 05:23 PM	#6
nick19 XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Sunny South Florida Posts: 335	9mm Answer You may want the check out these posts: http://www.hs2000talk.com/viewtopic.php?t=24283 When you are ready to buy you may want to give this guy a try. Quite a few of us have bought from him: http://www.hs2000talk.com/viewtopic.php?t=22368 __________________ I'm growing older but not up

10-05-2005, 09:25 PM	#8
ampleworks XDTalk 1K Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Communistic Ohio Posts: 1,159	127gr +P+ Ranger-Ts are the best for short barrel, 124gr +P GoldDots are second down my list. A while back I did some chronograph tests and found that the 124s were giving a higher power factor (weight x velocity) than the 127, three grains of lead shouldn't have made that much of a difference, given the rangers were rated +P+, they were still not as hot as the +P GoldDots. Something to consider that this was out of a 4" barrel, I don't have a 3" or I'd test it. __________________ *Ampleworks*

10-02-2005, 12:03 PM	#3
nframe XDTalk Newbie Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 10	There are so many opinions about this, it's hard to decide what to carry. For what it's worth I carry Winchester Ranger 127 gr. +p+ in my XD-9 sc, I chose it because it's going to penetrate better than the 115's, and expand more reliably than a subsonic round. It's a proven LE round with a sound record of ending conflicts quickly. With that being said practice multiple shots, an adversary rarely goes down with just one shot! I practice at least a double tap but mainly triple taps. Another good load to consider is the Speer 124 gr Gold Dot +p, also DoubleTap is making 9mm ammo now and has been getting excellent reviews, they load in 115,124,147 gr weights all loaded to +p pressures. I use their 10mm loads frequently and can vouch for their quality. Hope this helps.

10-02-2005, 02:26 PM	#4
retired XDTalk 5K Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: S. Calif. Posts: 5,328	Go to tacticalforums.com, then to its Terminal Effects forum. Do a search for "LE Gel testing April 2005." Should give you what you want to know.

10-05-2005, 07:06 PM	#7
RiverRat59 XDTalk Newbie Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 2	Guess I'm a LITTLE old fashioned. I carry the good 'ole Winchester 147gr Silvertip HP in my XD9SC.

10-06-2005, 08:15 AM	#9
orc4hire XDTalk 100 Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Texas Posts: 347	9mm loads recommended by DocGKR, a ballistics expert who posts over on Tactical Forums (in no particular order): Triton 115 gr +P JHP (TR9HVA) Fed 124 gr JHP (LE9T1) Speer 124 gr +P JHP (53617) Win 124 gr JHP (RA91P) Win 127 gr +P+ JHP (RA9TA) Fed 135 gr +P JHP (LE9T5) Rem 147 gr JHP (GS9MMC) Speer 147 gr JHP (53619) Win 147 gr JHP (RA9T) 'Gimmick' ammo like Glaser safety slugs is NOT recommended. Pick one that works well in your gun, practice, and don't worry any more about ammo selection. Any bullet will do the job if you put it in the right spot. No bullet will do the job if you miss.

10-07-2005, 07:13 AM	#10
Wreckage XDTalk Newbie Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 22	A good understanding of physics goes a long way in understanding ballistics. Kinetic energy (ft/lbs) is equal to half the mass multiplied by the square of the velocity. E=(M/2)VV Obviously, velocity is much more important than mass to achieve higher energy. I have read many tests and in all of them the heavyweight 9mm have been outperfromed by the midweights. In a nutshell, the heavyweights lack sufficient velocity to expand properly, thereby overpenetating and underexpanding (if expanding at all). The light weights show explosive expansion with poor penetration. The middlewights fall right in between, penetrating and expanding reasonably. A few words on penetraion and expansion. Penetration is required to reach vital organs. Expansion is necesary to transfer maximum energy and make a wider wound channel in the hopes of reaching vital organs. On a side note, my XD-9 shoots high with 147gr and spot on with 115gr at practical ranges

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