Reloading: 223 and 357 sig

[Raptor1956]

I'm looking into getting kitted up to reload for my two toys: Bushmaster Varmenter AR-15 (.223) with 24" fluted barrel and free floating handguard, and XD Tactical in 357 sig. So, as it's been maybe 30 years since I helped a friend reload shotgun shells I could use a little help with some questions.

I've done a quick listing of the items needed/desired and it looks to me that the cost of the press and dies is really only a small part of the total cost. Granted, some things like a chrono aren't technically needed, but if accuracy is a major factor in handloading then can you really build a kit without one? And there other tools, such as scales, that aren't cheap and would appear to be needed.

Bottom line is my list is now up to about $1600 total including:

* Dillon RL 550B
* RL 550 toolhead (second for other caliber)
* 223 case gauge
* 357 sig case gauge
* 223 carbide die set
* 357 sig caribde die set
* Case deburring tool
* Bullet puller
* Vibratory case cleaner
* Case/media seperator
* Walnut polishing media
* Precission ballance
* Chronograph
* Pistol propellant
* Rifle propellant
* Brass, 223
* Brass, 357 sig
* Primers, 223
* Primers, 357 sig

So, when you add it up it's obvious that the press is just the beginning.

Ok, now for a few questions:

1. If I start with new brass how many times can I expect to reload them before tossing?

2. Any difference in brass lifespan between 223 and 357 sig brass?

3. What brand of brass is recommended for 223 and 357 sig?

4. If I wish to load for accuracy with the 223 and figure on bullets in the 60-75 gr range what propellants, assuming I can't order many different ones, are preferred?

5. If I want a ballance of accuracy and power with the 357 sig and plan on using bullets of about 125 gr, what propellant is preferred?

6. Assuming I go with the Dillon RL 550B with the adjustable powder unit, how accurate and precise is the charge from it? That is, if I wanted a 6.6 gr charge and adjusted it to be exactly 6.6 gr how much variation can I expect from load-to-load?

7. If the precission of the 550 charge measure is not so good, and I'd surmise a variation of +/- 0.2 gr on a charge of 6.6 gr is not so good for accuracy, can I use the 550 but use hand measured charges?

8. If the best accuracy of the gunpowder scales is 0.1 gr and you'd prefer better accuracy/precision especially for the small pistol charges, how many would opt for a higher precision scale such as a 0.001 g (0.014 gr)?


Thanks,

Brian Stirling

[zac07]

there are some things you could trim out of your list if you want to cut costs. I dont use case gauges, chronograph, media separator, or new brass. If you search the forums you can find once fired for much cheaper. I pick almost all of my brass up from the range but it might be a little difficult to do that with 357sig. I use my straight walled pistol cases and 223 cases until they split of show signs of being wore out, but it might be a little different with the sig cases.

On you pistol rounds the powder measure is important but not as much as you think a little variance will not be noticed like a bench rest rifle, unless you are a excellent shooter. And you will just have to do a little testing to see what works well in your gun, they are all different.

This is just real brief but I would pick up a reloading book and do some more reading and researching, because everyone is different depending on their needs and wants when it comes to reloading.

[WyoXD]

If you plan to reuse your brass you're gonna eventually need a trimmer and you'll also need a dial caliper from the beginning.

6. Assuming I go with the Dillon RL 550B with the adjustable powder unit, how accurate and precise is the charge from it? That is, if I wanted a 6.6 gr charge and adjusted it to be exactly 6.6 gr how much variation can I expect from load-to-load?

Your charge to charge consistancy is greatly dependent on your loading technique. ie. cycling the handle in the same manner every time, keep the hopper above half full all the time, if you leave loading for a while throw a few dummy charges before starting back up again. Pay attention to these types of things and your charges should be very consistant--some powders are better than others also.

7. If the precission of the 550 charge measure is not so good, and I'd surmise a variation of +/- 0.2 gr on a charge of 6.6 gr is not so good for accuracy, can I use the 550 but use hand measured charges?

Dillon still sells a powder funnel for their powder dies so you can throw your own charges. Costs about $5.

[Raptor1956]

Originally Posted by WyoXD

If you plan to reuse your brass you're gonna eventually need a trimmer and you'll also need a dial caliper from the beginning.



Your charge to charge consistancy is greatly dependent on your loading technique. ie. cycling the handle in the same manner every time, keep the hopper above half full all the time, if you leave loading for a while throw a few dummy charges before starting back up again. Pay attention to these types of things and your charges should be very consistant--some powders are better than others also.



Dillon still sells a powder funnel for their powder dies so you can throw your own charges. Costs about $5.

Thanks for the feedback ...

I already have a good digital caliper but I should have added the case trimmer.

I guess I can practice with the press and check the consistency of the charge. Of course, checking the velocity would be the ultimate check of the consistancy so long as the bullets are all about the same weight/mass.


Thanks,

Brian

[jfdavis58]

Originally Posted by Raptor1956

1. If I start with new brass how many times can I expect to reload them before tossing?

2. Any difference in brass lifespan between 223 and 357 sig brass?

3. What brand of brass is recommended for 223 and 357 sig?

4. If I wish to load for accuracy with the 223 and figure on bullets in the 60-75 gr range what propellants, assuming I can't order many different ones, are preferred?

5. If I want a ballance of accuracy and power with the 357 sig and plan on using bullets of about 125 gr, what propellant is preferred?

6. Assuming I go with the Dillon RL 550B with the adjustable powder unit, how accurate and precise is the charge from it? That is, if I wanted a 6.6 gr charge and adjusted it to be exactly 6.6 gr how much variation can I expect from load-to-load?

7. If the precission of the 550 charge measure is not so good, and I'd surmise a variation of +/- 0.2 gr on a charge of 6.6 gr is not so good for accuracy, can I use the 550 but use hand measured charges?

8. If the best accuracy of the gunpowder scales is 0.1 gr and you'd prefer better accuracy/precision especially for the small pistol charges, how many would opt for a higher precision scale such as a 0.001 g (0.014 gr)?

1.Until they split; 10-20 cycles, maybe more. Also if primer pockets get loose.

2.Probably, but never bothered to check. What really matters is keeping a 'lot' of brass all together. If you acquire more at some later date, it's a new 'lot'. Shoot the whole lot, then reload ALL of it.

3.I use Starline for 357Sig, Winchester for .223. Stick with major named brands! See answer #2.

4. Reloading manual! I'm using Win748; good characteristics:meters well, clean, dependable.

5.AA#9. See answer 4.

6&7. Consistent stroking should yield a variation of less then 0.1grain---both of my presses do, with several different powder funnels. Poor accuracy is probably poor selection of propellant more than a mechanical deficiency. The small measure ain't too good with large particle sizes; hence the larger measure or the magnum funnel set-up. And bad operator characteristics. The rest is myth.

(Before anyone jumps down my back, they would need to collect a significant data set to convince me, mine might be wrong.)

8.Nonsense. Too many OTHER variables. Don't waste time or money on gimmicks-learn to shoot better. See answer to 6&7.

[fredj338]

I haven't seen a powder measure be more precise tna +/- 0.1gr. That is appr. 3-4 granuals of a powder like WSF. A 0.1gr diff. in charge wt. wil not affect your loads pressure wise or accuracy wise. There is often more variation in case volumn than 0.1gr.
Your rbass will last quite along time if you are off the max. charges. You can expect more than 10 loadings w/ normal pressure rounds.
LongSHot & AA#7 give a pretty good preformance range in the 357sig. You can run 125gr to 1400fps safely & drop down to 1250fps or so (4" bbl).

[Raptor1956]

Appreciate the input -- very helpful!


Brian