9mm cost-effectiveness

[cuylar]

I realize that this topic is beaten to death but here is what I hope is a different aproach to the question...

I want to shoot as often as possible. To be frank I can go out with my fiancee to the range about 2 or 3 times every month. We shoot 150-200 rounds each time we go. I am buying Blazer Brass for $7.50 per box plus 6.5% sales tax. I have looked at a few of these threads about reloading to cut down the cost of ammo and I have to say that it seems like it would take a wile for it to make financial sense.

I understand that there is a certain feeling of accomplishment to firing your own rounds and I definately appreciate it. I love assembling something that I can use and love the satisfaction that I get from a job well done. I am driven to make the best and be the best at everything I do so I am sure I can make the rounds well with some practice.

There does seem like a large cost to the equipment and a large cost with time to make your own rounds. Most people are advising that we (beginners) start with a simple slow set of products and then move up to more refined, faster, and more efficient equipment. This concerns me mostly because I will be buying more equipment and don't want to drop $5k on equipment over just a few years to make something that may only save be a few dollars.

SA says that firing non factory rounds will void my warranty and I am not too thrilled about that either.

My questions are:

- What dangers are out there for any "Mistakes" during the loading of my own rounds? I know I will be handling powder and primers.
- What damage can happen to the gun if I do it wrong?
- Where is the break even point for cost-effectiveness? I only shoot 150-200 rounds per range visit.

[deapee]

Most people that reload are reloading .45's. I'm not even 100% sure the cost difference when you're talking about 9mm is worth it. You can buy a box of 100 rounds from Wal Fart for around $12.00

In either event, I'm not sure I'd want to void my lifetime warranty in the event that something did happen...caused by your reloading or not. Not that they'd know you reloaded, but it's a chance I wouldn't take given the inexpensive cost of 9mm ammo.

[Tard]

Personally, I don't reload 9mm because it's really quite cheap when purchased in bulk. It's my understanding that 9mm is harder to reload than other cartridges due to a wide variety of case lengths and volumes, that working up a load using the same case all the time is the best way to go... not a problem if you buy/shoot/save the brass of the same round all the time. I haven't loaded 9mm so I'm parroting what I've read but I've read it a lot.

I found that jumping into reloading did not save me money because I started shooting a lot more often (for the same money). I've only had one problem in 30+ years of reloading, I double-charged a .45ACP due to 100% operator error. It was a weak target load so the double charge was no big deal (lucky).

I also started with very inexpensive manual tools like Lee Loaders but really they are a hassle that will turn you OFF to reloading I think, especially trying to resize the case on 9mm (small, short, thick-walled case).

For pistols only, the Dillion Square Deal B press is the way to go. Fast and easy, not expensive, pretty simple to operate and you won't outgrow it unless you suddenly get into competition. I use this press to reload .45ACP which IS an easy round to reload and it DOES save a lot of money compared to commercial ammo because the 9mm is the worlds most popular center fire pistol cartridge and is produced all over the world in huge quantity while the .45ACP is not.

Now, reloading for rifles opens up a whole new world, you can tailor a round to your exact gun/chamber and get excellent accuracy for 35% the price of commercial ammo.

Jump into reloading, its fun and will save you money AND you can tailor your rounds to your needs... but there is that first big bump of money that makes folks pause. If I shot nothing but 9mm, I would not reload, but for any other round, I would say GO FOR IT!

All gun manufacturers say 'reloaded ammo voids the warranty', it doesn't mean anything. If your reload blows up the gun (very rare), of course it's not covered.

[lodraw]

For plinking at your range Walmarts 9mm-100 rnd. "Value Pack" is going to be VERY hard to beat. Just go shoot. Now, 40 S&W and larger is a different story all together. Night 'n Day. Pick up the Speer Reloading manual first. Learn the process and preparations and go from there.
Baby steps is a good thing here.

[rwilson452]

IF this is a big IF you get into reloading strictly for 9mm and your real carefull about the components you buy and buy in bulk, get a lower level press and dies. I suspect you can amortize your investment in about 5-6000 rounds. for a lress about the lowest I would go would be a Lee Turret press and a Lee 4 die set of carbide dies. This means getting the 4 hole turret press. Note only the sizer die needs to be carbide. Depending on where you buy you could go this route for somewhere around $200. However, before you make up your mind I would suggest you buy a book or two. I would suggest one of those be, "The ABC's of Reloading". A couple of laps around this book and you should have a good idea of what level you want to shoot for. then you start shopping around for the best deal. Sometimes you can really get a real good deal on Ebay for used presses. There is a warning I will pass along. Reloading is a hobby in itself and a strongly addictive one at that.

[cuylar]

Originally Posted by rwilson452

IF this is a big IF you get into reloading strictly for 9mm and your real carefull about the components you buy and buy in bulk, get a lower level press and dies. I suspect you can amortize your investment in about 5-6000 rounds. ....

What do you mean by be really careful?? Of what?

Basically I'm looking at 35-45 range visits to make back the money I spend... I can see long term at how that can be a benefit. About a year to a year and a half...

[Timmy44221]

Reloading is a huge investment upfront, and has a lewarning curve. But in the end you will save money, remember ammo costs just keep going up and up, and soon who knows what sorta regulations will be in place.

[JD McDorce]

Originally Posted by cuylar

My questions are:

- What dangers are out there for any "Mistakes" during the loading of my own rounds? I know I will be handling powder and primers.
- What damage can happen to the gun if I do it wrong?
- Where is the break even point for cost-effectiveness? I only shoot 150-200 rounds per range visit.

There becomes two different categories of things to be careful about when loading your own rounds - personal safety during the reloading process and the potential effect of misloaded rounds. For personal safety, the manufacturers of reloading equipment and supplies recommend using eye protection while reloading, with one of the potential risks being unintended detonation of primers. Lead exposure is also something to be aware of (even if you use encapsulated bullets, there is lead in the primers). Naturally, smoking and open flames do not get along well with powder.

Some of the more common types of misloaded rounds include: no powder (squib load - potential for bullet stuck in barrel), too little powder (potential squib), too much powder (overpressure, premature barrel and gun component wear), bullet seated too deep (overpressure, feed issues), bullet seated too shallow (feed issues), deformed cases due to improper adjustment of dies (feed issues), improper crimp (overpressure if too tight, bullet movement if too lose), and primers not fully seated (slam-fire condition).

Break-even depends on caliber, type of components used, how you get your components, and what you are using as a comparison point. Brass (case) is clearly the most expensive component - if you end up buying new brass and use it once, you'll never break even. Next is bullets, lead is typically least expensive, then ranging upwards in price from plated to jacketed to specialty (frangible, all-copper, etc.). The cheapest components are powder and primers. Both are a fraction of the cost of brass or bullets. In my personal case, I can reload 9mm using "free" brass cheaper than WWB or Blazer and can reload using virgin brass cheaper than Black Hill's red box.

I still, on occasion, pick up a Value Pack of WWB or a couple of boxes of Fiocchi if I am too lazy to catch up on my inventory of reloads for practice at the local range and remind myself that groups with factory ammo are about three times larger than groups with my reloads. I also make sure I pick up the brass from every spent round so it can go into the tumbler at home...

$5k on reloading equipment is a little extreme (okay, a whole bunch extreme). I have less than $1,500 invested in my reloading bench which includes two presses (one turret, one progressive), dies (9mm Luger, 40S&W, 45Auto, 270 Win, 300 Win Mag), scales, some miscellaneous rarely used stuff, and the cost of the actual bench.

[rwilson452]

Price and shipping costs. BUy powder and primers locally or at a gun show. Hazmat fees will eat you alive. Bullets are mostly lead thus heavy. watch for the best deals. but be sure they don't kill you with S&H fees you got to compute that into the price . Sometimes you can find a real deal on bullets only to find out they overcharge on shipping.

if you shoot 200 rounds per visit you should be able to amortize your costs in that 35-45 visit range. IF you shoot 50 rounds per visit it's going to take a long, long, long time. On the other hand if you shoot high priced premium bullets your not going to make it. I don't shoot a Glock that is reported not to like lead bullets. mostly I shoot a 1911 and use LSWC bullets that are 25-30 bucks for a box of 500. Bullets and brass are your largest expense items. if you pick up your brass they can be used numerous times. There are several brands of brass that I won't take home and if i find them I trash them. That is another question for another time.


What do you mean by be really careful?? Of what?

Basically I'm looking at 35-45 range visits to make back the money I spend... I can see long term at how that can be a benefit. About a year to a year and a half...

[Steel1212]

my .02 cents.

If your looking to load 9mm to save money, your not going to save much. If your looking to load 9mm to gain accuracy you can gain a lot. I'm always after accuracy and my box of 100 moly coated lead rounds end up being around 9 bucks. I save 3$ from WWB, 30$ per K or about 250 more rounds or in your case another trip to the range. Dillon stuff is great and I'm sure I'll drink the blue cool aid but right now mine is red. I have a Lee 4 hole turret and once the measure is broke in and running good, yes dillon's have to be to I don't care what they say, you can crank out 200 rounds in an hour no problem. Now a dillon 650 probably closer to 400-500 or so as your getting a round every pull where the lee its every 4th pull. I spend about 250 for my lee, 3 extra turrets, the pro measure, 4 powder through expander dies, 3 factory crimp dies, lee 4 hole turret, auto prime and probably a few more things. I already had the dies for 9mm, 40, 45, and .223. I'll probably buy 2 more measures so I don't have to keep moving the one I have.

9mm 100 rounds for 9.09
40minor 100 rounds for 10.18
40 major 100 rounds for 10.36
.45 acp major 100 rounds for 14.76

This is all once fired brass, precision moly coated bullets. Of course I use the brass over until it looks bad the toss it so those prices come down as well as the range pick ups. IDPA matches are a good place to get 9mm brass, especially the good winchester brass.

Man I'm long winded tonight!