9mm for self defense

[xdmfan4life]

Originally Posted by fredj338

You do realize how ridiculous the statement is? First, it's never about killing, never. It's about stopping the attack. The human body can take an amazing amount of punishment & still function. Unless that 22lr hits the CNS, there is likely to NOT be any immediate response, especially if the attacker is modivated.
Second, I here this complete BS about "shot placement" all the time. Yeah, if you are a Master level shooter w/ some combat exp, that might actually apply. Reallity is a fickle bitch though. Your gunfight is likely to occur very quickly, at dark, you & your target moving. I would venture to say 95% of ALL shooters can not make a CNS, head or throat shot under such conditions @ even 10yds. Why you carry & shoot the biggest caliber you can. You want the most damage done w/ maybe only 1 or 2 marginal hits because that is all that a lesser shooter is going to land in that event. The vast majority of civ & LE shooters have an exagerated opinion of their skill. I see it all the time just in IDPA matches. Keep this axiom in your brain; you'll be half as good in a gunfight as your BEST day @ the range. For the vast majority, that is a pretty sad assesment.

Most important though is carry what you can shoot. That really is the deciding factor.

Wow, did I hit a nerve or something?? And no, I don't realize how ridiculous my statement was. The point of it was, that a .22 has killed people, believe it or not, so Im sure a 9mm would as well. I am aware that stopping the threat is the main idea, I was making a point about the throat shot. Didnt think you were gonna cry about it...geez. And the shot placement thing...so you have to be a "master level shooter or have combat exp." to put some rounds where they need to go? I agree that gun fights happen fast, but by your numbers of 95%, only 5% of people are capable of putting rounds in the correct place. So I guess all the gang bangers are just shooting people in the hand, or arm? I have a friend that was killed by some tweaked out meth head, with a ruger mark 2. Im sure that dirt bag wasn't a "master shooter", and he was able to put 6 rounds in my buddys chest area from 25ft away. We all know that you are an IDPA shooter, you mention it in like almost every post. Does that mean you are a "master shooter"?

I agree with carry what you can shoot, as there is no magic bullet.

[SonOfOdin]

modern ammo in 9mm is nothing to shrug off. Training and mindset is all that counts.

[bigmoguls]

Originally Posted by Paul-K

And you know this because what, you read it in a book? Your buddies say so or is it that you can't do it so no one can? Ever been in a gunfight? Have ANY real world experience?

Actually I can and do regularly it at both 10 and 25 yards while I'm moving... It's how I was trained by Uncle Sam. Admittedly I have to train 5 days a week but that's only because after the age of 50 the eyes got a little tired...

I know a Doctor that did some ER work. I was asking him about his experience in the ER and one of his comments was "you'd be surprised how many people survive getting shot in the head. One guy came in with a bullet hole in the forehead and in the back of his head but no hole in the skull." The bullet traversed his skull UNDER the skin.

[xdmfan4life]

Originally Posted by bigmoguls

I know a Doctor that did some ER work. I was asking him about his experience in the ER and one of his comments was "you'd be surprised how many people survive getting shot in the head. One guy came in with a bullet hole in the forehead and in the back of his head but no hole in the skull." The bullet traversed his skull UNDER the skin.

I believe it. I read about a guy who wanted to kill himself, and drove out to the desert in his truck and shot himself in the head with a 22! He woke up the next day in pain and went to the ER (change of heart I guess!) The bullet fractured his skull, but traveled under his skin to the other side of this head.....

[nwmarc]

I carry a 9mm with hollow points, will do a lot of damage to a bad guy.

[SpringerFan]

Originally Posted by agalindo

Bunch of idiots trying to compensate.

This. Swinging small lumber, so they carry BIG guns. Like everyone else said, don't buy any of what they were selling. My night stand and edc guns will likely always be 9mm.

[fredj338]

Originally Posted by xdmfan4life

Wow, did I hit a nerve or something?? And no, I don't realize how ridiculous my statement was. The point of it was, that a .22 has killed people, believe it or not, so Im sure a 9mm would as well. I am aware that stopping the threat is the main idea, I was making a point about the throat shot. Didnt think you were gonna cry about it...geez. And the shot placement thing...so you have to be a "master level shooter or have combat exp." to put some rounds where they need to go? I agree that gun fights happen fast, but by your numbers of 95%, only 5% of people are capable of putting rounds in the correct place. So I guess all the gang bangers are just shooting people in the hand, or arm? I have a friend that was killed by some tweaked out meth head, with a ruger mark 2. Im sure that dirt bag wasn't a "master shooter", and he was able to put 6 rounds in my buddys chest area from 25ft away. We all know that you are an IDPA shooter, you mention it in like almost every post. Does that mean you are a "master shooter"?

I agree with carry what you can shoot, as there is no magic bullet.

Your statements tell me you are pretty new to all this shooting & ccw stuff. Reality, just because someone dies doesn't mean you solved the problem. Plenty of people are killed by their attackers & then the attacker dies later. Pretty easy to put rounds on people cowering behind a piece of cover & not shooting back (gang bangers). Your objective in a fight is to stop the attack, not kill your attacker. He lives or dies, doesn't matter, as long as he stops doing what he is doing.
I mention IDPA because it's a very good PRACTICE opportunity. Nope, not Master, Expert, but point being, I KNOW what my capabilities are or lack of. You I think have little clue. You speak like someone watching too many movies. So please share, what is your skill level? Can you hit a 4" moving target from 30ft? How about 20ft? Can you hit anything while moving, how about in the dark? Yeah, real evaluation of your skills is needed to be able to understand any of this. If you are a top level shooter that can do all that, then I have mis judged you, but I doubt it. I can tell BS from can do when I read these things. I am sorry about your friend but the story proves nothing about skill or a calibers ability to stop a fight. You can kill a person w/ a pencil in the right spot, doewsn't really prove anything.

[lharrell79]

Originally Posted by xdmfan4life

Wow, did I hit a nerve or something?? And no, I don't realize how ridiculous my statement was. The point of it was, that a .22 has killed people, believe it or not, so Im sure a 9mm would as well. I am aware that stopping the threat is the main idea, I was making a point about the throat shot. Didnt think you were gonna cry about it...geez. And the shot placement thing...so you have to be a "master level shooter or have combat exp." to put some rounds where they need to go? I agree that gun fights happen fast, but by your numbers of 95%, only 5% of people are capable of putting rounds in the correct place. So I guess all the gang bangers are just shooting people in the hand, or arm? I have a friend that was killed by some tweaked out meth head, with a ruger mark 2. Im sure that dirt bag wasn't a "master shooter", and he was able to put 6 rounds in my buddys chest area from 25ft away. We all know that you are an IDPA shooter, you mention it in like almost every post. Does that mean you are a "master shooter"?

I agree with carry what you can shoot, as there is no magic bullet.

You obviously haven't realized that Fred is the top dog around here. Unless your skill levels and knowledge are on par with his, you will always be wrong, and he will always be right. Get used to it.

[TheDudeAbides]

Two words....

9mm Ranger-T's

[WarLord]

Also a ridiculous statement. I don't want to get shot w/ a 22lr, but consider there are diff, if even minor, between the various calibers. If you have comfort in carrying the 9mm, good, confidence is key. Just keep in mind, nothing, not caliber or the number of rounds you carry is winning the fight for you.
I agree, the orginal point by the op is his NRA instructor has little knowledge of ballistics. I would be quite happy to carry a 9mm & do on occasion, but it's more bullet dependent if you want good results. In states where mag cap is 10, the higher rd count is negated. So if I only get 10rds, I want the most damage tha can be done w/ those 10rds. Could be good 9mm, but carrying something that expands well & penetrates deep is the key. Most important though is carry what you can shoot. That really is the deciding factor.[/QUOTE]


my statement wasnt ridiculous, I was supporting the fact that you carry whats comfort for you and that no matter what it sucks at getting shot with anything...