Why is .223 good for bad guys, but not deer?

[HB of CJ]

Let's think it through. No; a soldier doesn't weight 600 pounds, but if you combine the corpman, battalion aid, air lift, emergency surgery, another airlift, recovery in another nation, another airlift, recovery here in the states, rehab, retraining or release, VA benefits and infrastructure... and I'm only hitting the medical highlights.

Combat troops are supported by the vast majority of the outfit. Nowadays it may be only 15% of the organization. Kinda like fighting a small structure fire, it may only take 3 to 5 men to stretch in that initial 2.5 inch line, but it may take another 20 firefighters to pave and support the way soss the hose team can do their job.

Sosss...back to military intelligence, it may hurt the enemy more by just wounding the bad guy and putting him out of action because it takes sooss much infrastructure to care for the wounded soldier. Thus nowadays, most military rifles fire a low power cartridge. For deer hunting, you want Bambie dead right now. HB of CJ (old coot)

[Brickboy240]

The military's requirements and reasons WHY they chose the 5.56mm and your needs as a deer hunter are two very different things.

The military did not choose the 5.56mm because it was "good enough for bad guys" they chose it because it was the best balance between lighter weight and lethality. A soldier could carry more 5.56 ammo than 7.62. The military's concerns were more with weight and firepower not cleanly dropping a "bad guy."

You will notice that when the military IS concerned with dropping a "bad guy" they chose a modified version of the 700 Remington or the M-14 in 7.62...not 5.56. Why? Because the 7.62 WILL drop someone cleaner at distances than the 5.56.

Most SWAT teams of municipal police depts also use bolt action sniper rifles in 308 for the same reason.

Your needs as a deer hunter are to drop the deer as fast as can be and as cleanly as can be. Your goal should NOT be to shoot the deer with a 5.56mm and have him run 50-100yds.

Almost every deer I have shot with the 30-06 or 270 had either fallen right where it stood or took 2-3 steps then collapsed. I cannot tell you how many hunting buddies that I have helped search the brush for a deer that they shot with a 223 or 243 and the thing took off....some ever were not found at all.

You need, as a rule of thumb, at least 1000ft lbs of energy by a round to cleanly drop the average white tail deer. That was a rule that I was always told by my dad and uncle and it has always served me well.

The 30-30 fits that rule at 100yds or so and maybe a tad further with the newer Hornady ammo. The 243 is iffy in that area and the 223 is even less iffy.

Rounds I find acceptable for white tail deer are ones like this: 30-06, 270Win, 308Win, 8x57 Mauser, 7x57 Mauser, 25-06 (with heavier bullets), 300 Savage, 303 British, 7.62x54R, 7mm-08 or any of the Weatherby magnums.

Rounds that are iffy and maybe good for 100yds or less would be: 30-30Win, 243, 6.5x55 Swede, 260Rem, 6mm Rem, 7.62x39mm.

Rounds that are great for varmints up to coyotes: 243Win, 223, 220 Swift, 22-250 (my fav), 204 Ruger, 22 Hornet.

That is how I see it....the 223 is just not something we will use around here for deer or pigs.

- brickboy240

[cucamelsmd15]

Well, Ill be sure to let the 4 deer I bagged last year with a 70gr TSX know that a bunch of internet commandos think that a .223 isnt effective on them. Im sure they wont argue otherwise.

[Medic738]

It's not about what you say is good enough it's about being humane. For a new hunter that cannot hit the heart + lungs of an animal with every shot they take should hunt with something that hits a little harder. You may be able to make a clean kill shot every time but in general the other non deer Rambos may want something a little stouter.

[.hero.]

Originally Posted by cucamelsmd15

Well, Ill be sure to let the 4 deer I bagged last year with a 70gr TSX know that a bunch of internet commandos think that a .223 isnt effective on them. Im sure they wont argue otherwise.

Lol. I looked for the like button for this.

[ProCroation]

In another forum area on this site, I mentioned my favorite rifle being a Ruger M77 Mark II in .223 and I stand by that choice. Using soft point ammo I never had a deer run more than 40 maybe 50 yards. I've never taken a shot from less than 100 yards with it. 1 shot every time. My uncle also hunts strictly with .223 in an AR15 every year. Shot placement! I've always made a point to set up my shots in a way that I don't have to deal with brush/glanced bullets. If so, I will pass on a shot I'm uncertain of. YMMV

[Happypuppy]

Most of the time it is because the states have a minimum caliber. I wold have no problem. I have used a 22-250 on some pretty big critters and they are ballisticly very close.


Sent from my 300 baud modem

[ProCroation]

Originally Posted by .hero.

Lol. I looked for the like button for this.

I had to check and see if he was my dad. Sounds just like something he would say.

[Bonehead]

AR-15 .223 takes down 300 pound wild boar - YouTube

AR-15 .223 takes down 300 pound wild boar - YouTube

this isn't a deer but I am not sure how I feel bout it. they shoot it repeatedly and even with point blank head shots to the brain it doesn't seem "put down".

I realize sometimes they squirm and grunt when they are "dead" but I'm not so sure this is the case.

maybe someone can shed some light for me.

[Russ7777]

The idea of the .223 in combat is to wound and incapiciate the enemy, and not necessarily kill them. The idea of hunting is to kill the animal.
Therefore you do not use a round designed to wound and incapiciate rather than a round designed to kill.