Winchester Ranger Prices

[hotpig]

If you send me a email I will send a notification when I hear anything.

[JhankG]

Correction:


Here's a rundown of all the various incarnations of the Winchester SXT stuff as found at .38 Special Snubby Ammo, Black Talon Revisited, Ed Sanow and Guns & Ammo Intentionally Misrepresent Facts.


Black Talon SXT: The original Black Talon handgun bullet. It was introduced in 1991. The cartridge consists of a black colored bullet seated in a nickel-plated case. The black paint-like coating on the bullet is a Winchester proprietary lubricant called Lubalox. The bullet has six serrations on the rim of the hollowpoint cavity (meplat), and six talons. The talons deploy when the bullet expands. They are described by Winchester as: "six uniform, radial jacket petals with perpendicular tips." Winchester voluntarily discontinued sales of Black Talon SXT to the general public in late 1993/early 1994 due to intense negative media and political pressure. Some political activists derisively referred to it as "Black Felon" ammo. Black Talon is packaged in boxes of 20 cartridges.

Ranger SXT: Ranger SXT is a less expensive version of the original Black Talon cartridge intended for the law enforcement market. It consists of a black Lubalox coated bullet seated in a brass case. The bullet has six serrations on its meplat, and six talons. Ranger SXT is packaged in boxes of 50 cartridges marked "Law Enforcement Ammunition."

Supreme SXT: Redesigned "civilian" version of the original Black Talon bullet. The cartridge consists of a copper-jacketed bullet seated in a nickel-plated case. The bullet has eight serrations on its meplat, and no talons. Supreme SXT is packaged in boxes of 20 cartridges.

According to Olin-Winchester public relations, the Supreme SXT bullet design has not been factory tested in standard ordnance gelatin because it was not designed to meet police ammunition performance specifications. As a result, there's no valid and verifiable performance data available from Winchester or the FBI.

We find Winchester's attitude troubling because they're marketing a personal defense bullet (a life safety device) in which they confessed to us that they've no idea how well (or poorly) it performs. Therefore, we advise you not to buy and use Supreme SXT until Winchester gets its act together and coughs up performance data for this cartridge.

Ranger Talon: The second generation version of the original Black Talon SXT bullet. The cartridge consists of a copper-jacketed bullet seated in a nickel-plated case. The bullet has six serrations on its meplat, and six talons. Ranger Talon is packaged in boxes of 50 cartridges marked "Law Enforcement Ammunition."

[DigMe]

That page is outdated and does not included the Ranger Bonded LE ammo.

brad

[hotpig]

It is a no brainer that the Supreme SXT has been factory tested but has not been tested to the FBI standards since it does not have to meet their standards. ie not a LE duty round.

[JhankG]

After reading that, it has me thinking twice about carrying these Supreme SXTs...

[hotpig]

They have done ok in real world shootings. There are better rounds out there thou.

Winchester was kind of stuck with this round. They knew that it worked so that was not a issue. At that time had Ranger SXT that was pretty close to the BT other than some spec changes.

Winchester knew that the old style HP rounds were very velocity dependent. The market was moving toward compact and subcompact guns.

Winchester replaced the Ranger SXT with a third generation HP made with the SXT design. Ranger T-Series replaced the old black bullet SXT in 1998.

T-Series had a much larger window of velocities that it worked in. Now a Police Officer could use the same bullet in his full size gun as he used in is back up sub compact.

Federal followed Winchester by scrapping the introduction of a new bullet design that was to update the Hi Shock. The much talked about Hi Shock Two was moved from their Classic Pistol line to their Premium line. The HST was marketed to LE in order to compete with the T-Series line. In 2007 the HST was again moved from the Premium line to the Tactical line.

Years later CCI finally followed up by offering the Short Barrel GD that was made to work in the sub compacts.

[JhankG]

Originally Posted by hotpig

They have done ok in real world shootings. There are better rounds out there thou.

Winchester was kind of stuck with this round. They knew that it worked so that was not a issue. At that time had Ranger SXT that was pretty close to the BT other than some spec changes.

Winchester knew that the old style HP rounds were very velocity dependent. The market was moving toward compact and subcompact guns.

Winchester replaced the Ranger SXT with a third generation HP made with the SXT design. Ranger T-Series replaced the old black bullet SXT in 1998.

T-Series had a much larger window of velocities that it worked in. Now a Police Officer could use the same bullet in his full size gun as he used in is back up sub compact.

Federal followed Winchester by scrapping the introduction of a new bullet design that was to update the Hi Shock. The much talked about Hi Shock Two was moved from their Classic Pistol line to their Premium line. The HST was marketed to LE in order to compete with the T-Series line. In 2007 the HST was again moved from the Premium line to the Tactical line.

Years later CCI finally followed up by offering the Short Barrel GD that was made to work in the sub compacts.

So what JHP do you suggest in 230 gr 45?

[hotpig]

In 45 I prefer Ranger or Federal Bonded loads. T-Series is good as well as GD, SXT or Hydra Shock.